GMN Labour Manifesto response

[DennisNoelKavanaghOffTwitter]

Hey Mumsnet, Kavanagh interloping again if I may, we've just published a response to the Labour Manifesto focusing on the Cass Review, Conversion Legislation and the meaning of Sex in the Equality act. Full document is available at:

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/6200252604e9795287de2ada/t/6671b5cc373b6025fffcbbec/1718728141412/GMN+Labour+Party+Manifesto+Response+2024+Branded+V2.pdf

If you find it of any use speaking to Labour canvassers or contact please be our guests and use as much as you like and we're most grateful for any other forms of amplification.

Thanks Dennis - I haven't seen a single canvasser, that's because I live in a very safe Labour seat, and they are all busy in all the Tory areas. It's almost like they don't want my vote.

Magic, thanks for that, Dennis. That is a fancy looking document. Footnotes!

Very useful.

'In Australia the biological definition of male/female was removed from the 1984 federal Sex Discrimination Act 1984. As a direct result lesbians may no longer meet in public “pride centres” because the Australian Human Rights Commission takes the view that this amounts to “gender identity discrimination” against “male lesbians”

JFC.

That's a great document. It brings together the Cass Report, conversion therapy ban and clarification of "sex" in the Equality Act really well.

I'm aware there's been a bit of a split on whether clarifying the Equality Act creates unintended consequences because it ratifies categories of "biological sex" and "legal sex" but as I understand it, clarifying the EA would be more beneficial than not. The GRA still needs to go in the long run IMO but clarifying sex in the EA would mitigate a lot of issues (and limit the ambiguity from which the GRA currently benefits) in the short term, including protecting same-sex attraction, as per this document. It also sounds considerably more achievable than unpicking the GRA from current laws e.g. those under the ECHR.

Thank you Dennis. That's a thoughtful, nuanced and constructive response to the manifesto.
Really great.

This is really really excellent. It is concise, easy to follow and really comprehensively covers the issues with labour’s manifesto. I am going to share this with several people I have been discussing these issues with, as it is so accessible. Thank you so much for sharing it.

Does anyone else frequently get moments where you sort of zoom out and wonder how on earth we got here, arguing about the meanings of what used to be such obvious concepts? It would almost be funny if it wasn’t so frightening and damaging to people’s lives.

That's such a helpful document, thank you Dennis. It's positive and constructive and gives me lots of starting points with my Labour candidate (I'm in a marginal Labour/SNP and you can hardly move without bumping into the Labour candidate and campaigning team).

That is so well argued, calm, fair and measured.

I think it would be a good thing if all the leaders, their deputies , and proposed ministers of health, were made to sit down and read it in public, on television. No getting up or fiddling with pens or glasses of water. It would take them about 20 minutes.

I am quite sure that most, including Rishi Sunak and Kier Starmer have not yet given any real thought so far to the problems described; and this isn’t even about the 50% of people who are girls or women.

It not being about women might help them bear to read it, actually, as that brings a new perspective to the matter.

Plus they are so used to TRAS saying “But Section 28… here we go again” that something from the Gay Men’s Network would give them pause for reflection.

I think so too @ScrollingLeaves, it slightly pains me to say and/or think it but I wonder if seeing it’s not ‘just women’ who are affected by this might help people grasp that there is a real actual issue here.

I hope someone might send it to Evan of PM at 5 p.m.

Yes, it's good to have that other perspective laid out so clearly.

This document also has useful talking points for anyone who is doorstepped by the Lib Dems, given the similarity of their policies on sex and gender.

Bumping this for anyone who hasn't read it. It's an excellent, well written piece with some very useful points when talking to candidates.

What a time to be alive.

Thanks for posting Dennis, this is very useful 👍

Edited for misspelling name

This is so clear and helpful. Thanks so much for posting here, Dennis.

No apology necessary, I get called far worse on twitter every day lol

Thanks Dennis, keep up the good work on TwitterX.

Also @DennisNoelKavanaghOffTwitter, excellent twitter thread this evening about the London pride poster 👏thank you for all your work on this issue

It makes me so angry a lightweight like Khan unthinkingly ok's a campaign that is so obviously conceptually adjacent to self harm. I just don't see why some Labour politicians are not getting this.

I agree. I am finding that the difficulty with this whole topic is often that once you’ve seen it, you can’t unsee it. And you can’t understand how other people can’t see it, because once that lightbulb goes off, it’s so bloody obvious. ‘It’ being how damaging, abusive, regressive and incoherent the whole gender ideology thing is.

But it really is an extra level of wtf that people don’t see the issue with that poster.

edited for typo

Sorry have derailed your thread now!

They prefer to cloak themselves in borrowed virtue by showing the world how cool and 'with it' and ‘not like the other square politicians' they are? 🤷‍♀️

I don’t know know why Khan and Starmer etc can’t make the logical leap to seeing how dangerous it is for young people to see self-harm glamourised in this way. It really upsets me to think an image like this could either encourage someone towards surgery or remind them of a painful past.

PS That was an excellent letter from LGBA to Khan on this issue!

The lack of joined-up thinking in Labour is of huge concern.

Wes Streeting is starting to shift his language e.g. in the Venice Allan interview (fair play that he actually did it), where he talks about "same-sex". However, he did use the term "trans child" in the parliamentary debate about the Cass Report on 15th April and conflates LGB (fact) with T (predicated on belief) in the Venice interview.

But we've had nonsense from Annaliese Dodds on conversion therapy and complete silence from Brigit Phillipson on everything that's been happening in education. She is on record here, in a MN forum, saying that Labour would start a consultation with teachers etc on how the subject of gender identity should be handled in schools. This was said just before the release of the draft Gender Questioning Children guidance. When that guidance was finally released she said she welcomed the consultation but made no comment on its contents. I find her silence on all things Cass-, KCSIE*-and RHSE-related particularly worrying, given schools are currently enabling and promoting the belief that it's possible to be born in the wrong body. It's in schools that girls are receiving an amplification of the message on this billboard.

*The KCSIE (Keeping Children Safe in Education) update for 1st September 2024 is a key step forward in recognising the vulnerability of children to messaging like this poster and the potential consequences of an affirmation pathway as per Cass. As the Shadow Education Secretary, where is Brigit's voice?

It's not schools' fault that this type of poster is influencing vulnerable children and young people. But it is schools' responsibility to manage how this influence is handled within its curriculum and general messaging.

This is Bridget saying Labour would start the process if elected (see screenshot):
https://www.mumsnet.com/news/mumsnet-founder-justine-roberts-puts-users-questions-to-shadow-education-secretary-bridget-phillipson

That was her position on 4th October. Yes, she was sceptical that the government would achieve anything in this space but they did. They also released updated (draft) RHSE guidance and updated KCSIE guidance.

This is her saying "I welcome the publication of this consultation around the [Gender Questioning Children] guidance" in December:

Great! What are your thoughts on its contents though...?!

(And apologies for the misspelling of your name Bridget, if you're reading this)

For someone who is potentially the next Education Secretary, her silence on this critical issue is as deafening as Keir Starmer's.