Mumsnet Manifesto urges government to define what a woman is

[InThePottingShed]

Telegraph today:

”The first ever Mumsnet “manifesto” is urging the next government to define what a woman isin the Equality Act.
The popular online forum released a 25-page document on Friday which it said represented the chief concerns expressed by its nine million users over the past four-and-a-half years.
It has 12 asks of the incoming administration after July 4, including to “guarantee access to single-sex spaces” for women by reforming the 2010 Equality Act.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/06/01/mumsnet-manifesto-woman-gender-equality-act-election/

if you have the Telegraph app the article also includes some quotes from Labour politicians. Conservatives For Women have put them in a post on X:

https://x.com/cforwomenuk/status/1796782966909096316?s=46&t=tGndANTCcSFoV6PaqNg6qA

We are in danger of walking into having 'legal sex' in addition to 'biological sex' and creating an unnecessary group

I really think we need to start talking about this. This, and whatever the fuck is going on about "belief".

The GRA needs repealed.

We already are dealing with legal sex overriding biological sex rather than walking in to it

Agree the GRA is a damaging law and should be repealed

I've only skimmed it so far so I may be back with questions and reservations, but before any of that, well done MNHQ. And well done FWR vipers for not shutting up - you did this.

Are we dealing with legal sex overriding biological sex though? Prior to Stonewall Law, no we were not. The approach was that a GRC didn't mean "legal sex". That was the approach. We are talking ourselves into it instead of holding the line. We are also not encouraging decision makers to take all the salient facts into account when making decisions. We've helped them ignore their duties and to encourage "legal sex". Some serious thinking needs to happen all round here.

We definitely need to think how repeal would work in a practical sense, and push for that. What happens to those with GRCs needs some airtime.

The PC of GR and the GRA all seem to be based on the idea that if men are comfortable using female id, the government will recognise that in law.

Why?

We dont need more laws, we need to question the purpose of the existing ones.

If you're on TwiX, a mega thread by ripx4nutmeg has loads more Labour batshittery

https://x.com/ripx4nutmeg/status/1442783035389325313

Congratulations to MNHQ and anyone who worked with them on this.

I've just been reading about yet more health conditions that disproportionately affect women and the dearth of research and treatments to help women with something that has a substantial impact on their lives.

It's amazing women manage to hold up half the sky with so many healthcare needs disregarded, belittled, or mistreated.

This article is from 2023.

'Hannah Betts 14 July 2023 • 2:28pm'

Edit - I have opened the right link now! Sorry everyone.

I really like the idea of a manifesto that centres women. Only thing I’m not sure about is the formula policy - while I’d like it to be cheaper, history shows formula companies will do anything (including risking babies’ lives) to get more business, and I think the policy proposed in the MN manifesto will make this easier for them.

I’d suggest a policy re-think, around how to ensure there is a cheap, safe, NHS approved formula available that people can choose. That should bring prices down via competition.

Goodness me. Very welcome.

I agree that there needs to be a proper debate on assisted dying. We all die, so it affects everyone. I’d personally prefer some choice in the matter - I’m in my 70s, and cared for my own parents in old age, so I’m aware of the problems of ageing and infirmity - but I acknowledge the reservations of others.

Nationalised formula is an interesting idea.

And yes, formula is a minefield. Massive multinationals will continue to try to undermine breastfeeding and market aggressively, sneakily, and illegally.

Thanks MNHQ. Great to see this released.

One of my scientific crushes is Harriet Chick of National Loaf fame.

It would be so good to have a national formula named in her honour although I realise there is potential for confusion in Chick Formula.

Another crush is Cicely Williams of the 1939 Milk & Murder exposé of Nestlé (also, hard as nails, concentration camp during WW2).

http://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1628679/pdf/archdisch00735-0108a.pdf

https://wellcomecollection.org/works/xq7j4rtz

I wondered if someone, even MNHQ would post a link to their manifesto on FWR, and instead we get a link to a telegraph article.

Even WPUK managed to get the link - and praise it!

First 4 demands are all related to childbirth and given the recent reports about the state of maternity services I suppose that isn't a surprise.

Clarifying that sex means biological sex in the EA comes 11 our of 12

And am surprised that assisted dying made the list but affordable child care, let alone refunding Sure Start centres doesn't feature.

I am currently dealing with a very rapid deterioration of dementia in a parent. This parent's parent had dementia and expressed to me many times that they'd rather die than end up in that state.

I'd rather not have assisted dying, but decent care for people at end of life with conditions like dementia. However, this is currently not the case. My parent will end up in a poorly run nursing home that I wouldn't voluntarily put an animal in let alone a person, with underpaid staff (whilst the nursing home company makes a profit - a carer I spoke to mentioned the 'manager with a mercedes' whilst they're struggling on min wage). They will spend most of their day in a prison of drugs because otherwise they will be too difficult to manage, given their state of distress. The nursing home has a rapid turnover of staff, so there won't even be regular carers, and strangers are one thing that causes fear and distress in those with dementia.

Prison of drugs and miserable 'nursing' home or death? A lot of people would choose the latter when life doesn't become worth living and there is no hope of it getting any better.

It's definitely a debate that needs to be had, because social care is failing.

So sorry @Ginnyweasleyswand . You're right - these are discussions that we must have - both on families and in society.

I agree with most of the manifesto though possibly not in the same order. Although the top few are definite priorities.

I'd rather not have assisted dying, but decent care for people at end of life with conditions like dementia.

Suggesting that someone with dementia is a candidate for assisted dying is horrendous, unless of course they made a cognitif declaration for that at the same time as they gave power of attorney to a relative or trusted friend.

I commented on assisted dying being on the manifesto because given all the other issues women have throughout their lives, that weren't listed, this seemed strange to have made the list.

Although the possibility of being the carer of someone suffering a chronic illness whose pain is unbearable and / or has physically deteriorated so that they are dependent on others but is mentally aware, is unfortunately something any of us might have to undertake.

Put that in your (crack?) pipe and smoke it, Aston University!

Can anyone give a flavour of the Labour responses please - Rachel Reeves is in the article, but otherwise, without a Telegraph subscription or TwiX, it’s difficult to find them

Fabulous. Lurker here and quite political so this is great to see, well done HQ for representing the majority view on your site even when it's demonised. TERF Party FTW

Yay! About time.

This is great. Thank you MNHQ.

@Runor the quotes are pre-Cass, so don't know if position has changed, but here they are:

Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor “Most women share biological characteristics. We can go through the different parts of a woman's body, but there are also people who were born as a man who are going through the gender recognition process who identify as women, and I wouldn't want to exclude them, either.”
20 March 2022

Sir Keir Starmer, Labour Party Leader "A woman is a female adult, and, in addition to that, trans women are women, and that is not just my view, that is actually the law."
28 March 2022

Angela Rayner, Shadow Deputy Prime Minister "Transgender women’s rights are women’s rights."
18 July 2022

Yvette Cooper, Shadow Secretary of State for the Home Department. Asked the definition of a woman: “Yeah as you can see, I’m avoiding going down those holes. I just think this is pointless. I think we’ve had a great celebration of International Women’s Day”
9 Mar 2022

Ed Miliband, Shadow Secretary of State of Climate Change and Net Zero “The whole question of gender identity, and people who feel the sex they were born with doesn’t reflect their true identity – the tabloids are playing on people’s lack of knowledge about this to stoke up a kind of moral panic.”
20 Nov 2017

David Lammy, Shadow Secretary of State for Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Affairs Told a Labour Party conference fringe event that there are “some dinosaurs on the right” and also “in our own party” who want to “hoard rights”.
27 September 2021

Annelise Dodds, Shadow Secretary of State for Women and Equalities Asked to define a woman: “Well, if you need any clues, I’m one – I hope that helps. I’m an adult female. That’s my biological sex. Of course, there are people who have changed their gender who transitioned to being trans women.”
20 May 2022

Emily Thornberry, Shadow Attorney General. Emily Thornberry said it is “factually inaccurate” to say that only women have a cervix when some trans men and non-binary people also have a cervix.
27 Sep 2021

Lisa Nandy, Shadow Minister (International Development) “I believe fundamentally in people’s right to self-ID. I believe the gender recognition act strikes the wrong balance in relation to that. So I think that crimes that are recorded should be recorded as that person wishes, having gone through that process.”
February 2020

Ashley Dalton, Shadow Equalities Minister “I’m in favour of trans rights, believe trans women are women and trans men, men.”
4 March 2020

Sadiq Khan, London Mayor “Trans women are women. Trans men are men. Non-binary people are non-binary people. All gender identities are valid."
18 March 2021

Thanks @MNHQ