What happened to no?

[ColinRobinsonsFart]

When I was a kid 'no' meant no.
Can I play on the train track ? - no
Can I be a boy? - no

I was told no.

We told people who made unreasonable requests- no.

Now I read about men wanting access to single sex spaces
Wanting to breast feed
Demanding to be Included in the sex class woman
Insisting on being allowed to participate in women's sports
Etc etc etc

And they are not being told no.... why?
What has changed?

I am an older woman - probably a little old fashioned ( I was a punk but now I am invisible). I do wonder if I have rose tinted specs on.

I know we say no, many people say no . But when they do say no, they are vilified.

Ah I think this is all garbled.... I have had codeine. And I am tired.
I apologise

Posie Parker is a very loud no sort of person. Up my street i would say.

'Tis a question I've asked myself many times.

Oh come on... we say no a lot:

Can i go to the loo? No.
Can I wear football shorts for PE instead of these indecent things that show my behind? No.
Can I roll my skirt up so it's the length I want? No.
Can i wear this little bracelet my friend gave me? No.
Can i wear socks over my tights? No.
Can i take off myblazer? No.
Can i doodle? No.
Can i sit next to my friend? No.

Okay miss, can you call me Oscar and refer to me as he/him and give me a toilet card as i can't be expected to use the loos during break with the girls, and will you let me wear football shorts for PE? Oh yes, of course.

I feel the same.

Why aren't they just told no?

Giving it some thought, it's probably because there's not a 'collective no'. If there was a collective no, there's fuck all they can do about it.

But because women (and men), have been targeted on an individual basis, it makes a collective no unlikely, because people are too scared to stand up.

Although, that is definitely changing.

More and more people are saying no. I believe we are genuinely hurtling towards critical mass.

I think this just about covers it

Decadence

God I do love you lot!
You understood my codeine inspired ramble.... and yes yes yes to all of you!

I love that, Datun. I had a very similar conversation with my mother 45 years ago and that was indeed what she said.

Perfect. No fuss, an understanding of child development, the dynamics of a child/parent relationship, and calm assertion of reality.

When I consider how HCPs and teachers, media and opinion formers have responded to this assertion, I feel queasy.

'Mum, i think I'm a boy'
'Let's call GenderGP and see what unlicensed medicine they will sell us'

Or perhaps

Okay Miss, if I ask you to call me Oscar and refer to me as he/him, then can I have a toilet pass and wear football shirts for PE?

Cant think why so many girls would be considering this 🤔

My mum said this to me. About 40 years ago. She smiled too.

I was told no.

Followed by “Don’t be so bloody daft."

You are right it's madness. Being told no is boundaries and should be normal. These people are like overgrown spoiled toddlers throwing tantrums when they don't get their own way.

Also love your username !

I think it's something to do with Gen X, they have the desire to say "yes" because they were told "no" to many unreasonable things. (eg due to racism etc)

I did a few months of teaching 10yrs ago, and felt (still feel) awful about it. I was the worst teacher in the world. Not because I wasn't popular. They loved me. I gave better grades than I should have because I couldn't say no.... (where's the facepalm emoji when you need it...?) I've grown up since then, thankfully.

But because women (and men), have been targeted on an individual basis, it makes a collective no unlikely, because people are too scared to stand up.

Is this an example of preference falsification?

Living their authentic selfs, innit?

We were always told no as kids followed by “don’t be so bloody silly” (60s/70s)

I want to say yes...

Yes. I asked my Dad when I was about eight if I was really their daughter as I loved visiting stately homes and thought I belonged in one, loved horsey stories and Enid Blyton’s St Clare books. I lived in a Sheffield council house and went to the local primary. No riding lessons or private school.

I got loads of laughter and a comment similar to the above.

Now, I could identify as a duke’s daughter.

Or, based on complaints overheard from my teens and their friends in recent years:

• Can I wear a T shirt rather than shirt and tie because it's more comfortable (child with mild sensory issues)- No, that's the uniform
• Can I wear a style of skirt/trousers that is not strictly uniform as my the uniform style is not comfortable for my body shape- No, everyone should wear the uniform (and maybe you need to look at your eating habits)
• Can I wear a slightly cropped T shirt in non-uniform day as it's hot weather- no, that is not appropriate for school
• Can I have access to the staff toilets during lesson times, when the pupil toilets are kept locked, so that I don't have to go to reception for a key when I have a heavy period and may be leaking- no, you should go at break time and/or double up on sanitary protection
• Can I sit out PE as my period has started and I have stomach cramps- no, you don't have a doctor's note
• Can I wear make-up as it makes me feel more confident, especially when I have teenage spots- No
• Can you stop other children making comments about my hair colour, where I live etc- no (unless it becomes serious enough to be bullying when we will all sit in a circle and discuss it)
• Can I have access to the staff toilets because I identify as a girl and using the boys toilets is 'triggering'- Yes!
• Can I miss PE because I'm questioning my gender identity- Of course! What would you like to do instead?
• Can I wear clothes/makeup etc that are not in uniform policy because I identity as trans/NB etc- Yes, wear whatever feels authentic. And by the way, you look Fabulous!
• Can I change my name due to gender identity- Yes, of course
• Can you make sure no-one misnames me- Yes! Anyone calling you by a 'deadname' will be dealt with very seriously

I actually think that some of the adjustments that this school allow to trans pupils are fairly reasonable but there is a stark contrast with the response when pupils (especially girls) want to do something outside the rules for other reasons

We aren't children anymore, we are adults, and we must deal with each other. I think it's worrying when people expect their children to accept a no without an explanation, any adult who does is in danger.

Edit: This is of course excluding personal boundaries, in that case a 'no' should be accepted without explanation. But refusing to share a public space with the public is not a boundary, it is an attempt to rule over others.