Not again, Jane and Fi

[Sizzlysausage]

I had another listen to Off Air last night, their podcast. They were talking about their problems with International Women's Day (with which I sympathise) but then read an email from a listener about a 'brilliant' event where a trans woman CEO came along to talk about their experiences as a man and then as a 'woman.' Apparently, this had opened 'her' (his) eyes to all the challenges women face, having seen it and critically EXPERIENCED it from both sides, and the most amazing thing (according to the listener) was that unlike typical IWD events, loads of men turned up and had their eyes opened too! Jane and Fi were ecstatic about this. Am I the only one to think I have less than zero interest in listening to a man telling other men what it's like to be a woman? If they're so bloody interested (they're not) why not .... I don't know, listen to an actual woman? HOW can Jane and Fi or indeed anyone be taken in by this? It's just astonishing to me.

I think you're being very unreasonable OP. Thay are complying with the special Rules of MIsogyny that all support humans are required to follow. In particular 2,3,5,7,8,9 and 12 which Jane and Fi have exemplified in sharing that letter. Well done them.
I have bolded the relevant rules as it appears you might be guilty of failing to appreciate how important it is that uterus havers / chest feeders / support humans comply with them and you are likely in need of re education. 😎

THE RULES OF MISOGYNY

1st: Women are responsible for what men do.

2nd: Women saying no to men is a hate crime.

3rd: Women speaking for themselves are exclusionary and selfish.

4th: Women's opinions are violence against men thus male violence against women is justified.

5th: WATM! [What about the Men] Women and Feminism must be useful to men or they are worthless.

6th: Women who go around being female AT men by menstruating and breast feeding babies deserve punishment.

7th: Women should always be grateful to men for everything.

8th: Men are whatever men say they are and women are whatever men say they are.

9th: Men always know the "real reasons" for everything women do and say.

10th: The worst thing about male violence is that it males men look bad.

11th: Basic pattern recognition skills are cruel and evil when they hurt men's feelings.

12th: whatever women suffer from, men suffer from more.

When women speak, some (not all) men are simply incapable of listening. This has been proved time and again - for example, in a boardroom meeting a woman speaks up with an idea and is ignored, then a man voices the same idea a little later and is applauded. That’s why transwomen are more likely to get listened to than the original dinosaur type of woman.

Women really ought to know better though, than to pander to men. The patriarchy won’t dismantle itself, sisters!

You are forgetting OP the frequency of women’s voices make men run away.

Ignoring the whole physiological aspect, this person can't know what women experience in society because nobody thinks he is a woman and so nobody treats him like a woman.
He can talk about what it is like to be a man claiming to be a woman, if course.

He knows what it's like to be an opposite sex impersonator,which is nothing at all like being a woman.

This person can talk about what it’s like to be a transwoman because they have lived experience of transitioning. I can’t talk about what it feels like to be a transwoman because I’m not a transwoman. So why do transwomen think they are qualified to talk about the female experience? They’re only qualified to talk about the transgender experience, which may have its own challenges but is different in every way, shape and form to the lived experience of being a woman.

I know. They make themselves sound so ... THOUGHTLESS (that is the kindest word I can think of, there are others) when they do this. I think it drives me mad because I'm disappointed in them or something.

Oh my goodness, thank the Lord for that transwoman, voicing what it’s like for us women!
It’s such a shame we never thought of that!
And of course we must thank Jane and Fi for bringing this hero to our attention. 🙏

Yes. In the past I'd have been quite patient about a transwoman wanting to muse over the experience of dysphoria, transition, and how it all influences ongoing thoughts about sex and gender. Why not, different perspectives, etc.

It's the heedless gate crashing of womanhood and patronising "allyship" in return that has slowly but inexorably put me off.

I haven’t listened to this one but it drives me mad too OP. I’m big fans of them otherwise, but it seems they like to represent all people, they’re forever saying of course we must hear from these people too and this opinion must be heard but GC women must never be represented and if they ever say anything slightly GC it must be balanced out immediately and listeners must be reminded how extreme and niche those women are with their STRONG FEELINGS. And they don’t even work for the captured BBC anymore so it’s clearly their opinion.

Sorry for the rant, I am clearly one of those women with the strong feelings so do feel free to do a Fi and Jane and ignore me.

I sent them an email after they interviewed Caster Semanya, having offered no context to the listener to explain that he is in fact biologically male. They seemed to allude to it shortly afterwards but as if someone rather ridiculous had been in touch with their strong feelings, which were obviously WRONG. Of course, it may not have related to my letter at all, but whoever they were referring to, it felt really patronising. When I was young the worst insult my DF could throw at me is that I was being 'silly.' If I made a crap argument or went on a teenager-y political rant with nothing to back it up. I often hear myself saying the same thing when I hear Jane and Fi discuss this subject. They are being so - silly!

I'm going to start identifying as a transwoman. I am biologically female but as gender has nothing to do with sex, apparently, female women are equally capable of transitioning into the identity of "woman".

My pronouns have moved from she/her to her/she. My reborn name is the same as the old name, with an added silent consonant. So if you call me by my name or pronouns you are simultaneously deadnaming/correctly naming and misgendering/respecting my new identity.

I look forward to leveraging my most-oppressed-and-stunning-and-brave status soon!

Exactly this. I went from being a big fan of their podcast and live shows to not being able to listen to them any more. I feel personally let down which I know is rather over-sensitive of me but there you go. Same thing happened with the High Low podcast.

Good luck with your new identity,do let us know how you get on.