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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
YouJustDoYou · 20/01/2024 17:17

I don't think Gen Z are smart enough to comprehend that back then/now just because yo uwear male/female clothing doesn't mean you think you are the opposite sex.

OneMorePlant · 20/01/2024 17:26

Ugh the guy who made that video is the same guy that goes out to eat and films himself getting misgendered and he harasses the waiting staff and puts the poor waiters on the internet to be harassed more.

He also made a tiktok where he stated he's not the easiest customer and the servers deserve his attitude because they are only servers.

He's disgusting.

SerendipityJane · 20/01/2024 17:28

Ay Uni I shared a house with an English guy who had been bought up in Kenya. When it was very hot, he'd wear a traditional Kenyan garment like a skirt (annoyingly I can't be sure of the name). (He also had a pair of shoes made from old car tyres they called "thousand milers" showing the is nothing we can teach Africa about recycling).

That's going back 10-15 years before Nirvana ....

ApocalipstickNow · 20/01/2024 17:37

SinnerBoy · 20/01/2024 17:12

ApocalipstickNow · Today 13:10

Kurt spoke in interviews about wanting to piss off Jocks by being provocative in appearance and behaviour as he wasn’t seen as macho as them.

I wonder how much of a thing that was? I started a job in 1988, aged 18 and was invited to the pub by the crew. One bloke arrived in pink spandex leggings, winkle pickers with heels and a flouncy shirt, complete with eyeshadow. He affected a camp air.

The reason was soon apparent, he was hoping that someone would start a fight.

I think Kurt Cobain had probably put up with a lot of shit from the macho kids for being weird, short, not sporty, weedy etc. I can totally see all these things contributing to arseholes trying to make that kid’s life a misery.

I think he wanted to throw it back at them, show defiance- I think he’d been called gay by some sporty guys, he wanted to show he was a man like them, who dated women, like them, but could wear a dress or eyeliner or hug a man unlike them, because he wasn’t hung up on homophobia, unlike them.

It’s basically “im a man, however you perceive me, however you feel i fit in or not. “ which is the opposite of what we see now.

nothingcomestonothing · 20/01/2024 17:37

Kurt Cobain was very clear about wanting to distance himself from misogynist, homophobic rock fans, and wearing dresses was one of the ways he tried to do that.

I saw Nirvana headline the Reading Festival in 1992, Kurt arrived on stage in a wheelchair pushed by the journalist Everett True, and wearing a dress. Was he also trans-disabled, or are we just picking and choosing? (rhetorical question, obvs).

LentilFaculties · 20/01/2024 18:24

I grew up in that grunge/greebo world. Loads of my male friends wore dresses and skirts and eyeliner and nail polish. Some are gay, some are straight. All are now middle-aged men, and absolutely no sign of any of them being trans.

This with fucking bells on!

If TRAs didn't navel gaze so much they could investigate the very recent past and discover all this.

StoorieHoose · 20/01/2024 18:30

Has no one Trans'd the ever gorgeous Nicky Wire yet? Oh yes he is still alive so they won't even try it

StoorieHoose · 20/01/2024 18:31

ApocalipstickNow · 20/01/2024 13:06

Kurt Cobain, Ritchie Edwards, Nicky Wire, Brian Molko, even Brett Anderson and Jarvis Cocker were “expanding the bandwidth” of what being a man was back in the 90s.

And they were far from being the first.

It’s so sad that there’s a generation of kids who think if you’re not Pitbull (although they probably don’t even know him lol) then you’re some new, indeterminable gender.

I blame ALL this on the ending of Top Of The Pops.

I blame the loss of ToTP too

TempestTost · 20/01/2024 18:37

Men wearing dresses to push boundaries was already old when Cobain did it.

I do think it's a bit ironic though - I am not convinced any of the gender-benders of the 70s and 80s actually wanted to get rid of gender norms. Quite the contrary, I think they needed those boundaries so they could be edgy and cool and play with convention.

PinkSweatshirt · 20/01/2024 18:37

I would just like to wade in and make it clear that this is one trans womans opinion. Don't paint every single trans person or trans supporter with the same brush.
Some people will have extreme (or silly views), as with all groups.
It just feels like another thing for everyone to dogpile on a whole group for. This is ONE person who even other trans people have laughed at.
Leave off.

Random30 · 20/01/2024 18:41

Seasmoke7 · 20/01/2024 12:58

Does the Daily Mail turn it into a headline every time someone says something on tiktok which someone else disagrees with? How sad. And how even sadder some people read their shit and eat it up. But I guess that's the model, they know as long as they put "trans" in the headline they'll get outrage clicks from the pearlclutchers of middle England, and that feeds their advertisers and makes them money I guess.

So do you think Curt Cobain was a woman then?

SerendipityJane · 20/01/2024 18:55

You got your mother in a whirl;
coz she's not sure if you're a boy or a girl.

hellsBells246 · 20/01/2024 19:19

That TikTok idiot was clearly not around in the 80s when every man wore eyeliner and nail polish!!! What a twat.

ApocalipstickNow · 20/01/2024 19:24

I’ve just realised the thread title says Kirk.

StoorieHoose · 20/01/2024 19:46

PinkSweatshirt · 20/01/2024 18:37

I would just like to wade in and make it clear that this is one trans womans opinion. Don't paint every single trans person or trans supporter with the same brush.
Some people will have extreme (or silly views), as with all groups.
It just feels like another thing for everyone to dogpile on a whole group for. This is ONE person who even other trans people have laughed at.
Leave off.

It's not the first time Kurt has been trans'd though

ColinRobinsonsFart · 20/01/2024 19:46

OneMorePlant · 20/01/2024 17:26

Ugh the guy who made that video is the same guy that goes out to eat and films himself getting misgendered and he harasses the waiting staff and puts the poor waiters on the internet to be harassed more.

He also made a tiktok where he stated he's not the easiest customer and the servers deserve his attitude because they are only servers.

He's disgusting.

I agree - the guy is a total arsehole who makes a living making waiters and waitresses lives a misery - putting them at risk of losing their jobs.

Abhannmor · 20/01/2024 20:02

There is a video of Jimi Hendrix where the drummer , Mitch Mitchell, is wearing a dress. That wasn't yesterday.

ApocalipstickNow · 20/01/2024 20:53

There’s a Hendrix track where Jimi suddenly shouts “MITCH MITCHELL!” and it sounds like “Miss Mitchell!” So maybe he knew something we didn’t 😉

Pocketfullofdogtreats · 20/01/2024 20:58

WyrdyGrob · 20/01/2024 13:12

Posted without comment.

(mainly because I might have to go for a cold shower and a lie down after searching through all his best photos before choosing that one )

I'll comment - "Sexy as fuck!'

Ellysetta · 20/01/2024 21:16

IDontHateRainbows · 20/01/2024 11:49

I wish this could be how it is now.

Men wearing dresses, make up etc and it doesn't mean they have suddenly turned into a girl!

This!!

I really miss when people could just wear what they want. A man wants to wear a sparkly dress and high heels? Brilliant, crack on.

Why did trans activists have to decide that a man in a dress is not a man? It’s so limiting.

PrawnDumplings · 20/01/2024 22:28

Kurt. And no. He wasn't.

PrawnDumplings · 20/01/2024 22:28

IDontHateRainbows · 20/01/2024 11:49

I wish this could be how it is now.

Men wearing dresses, make up etc and it doesn't mean they have suddenly turned into a girl!

They can.

Changingplace · 20/01/2024 22:33

StoorieHoose · 20/01/2024 18:30

Has no one Trans'd the ever gorgeous Nicky Wire yet? Oh yes he is still alive so they won't even try it

Oh I wish they’d try just to see his response! Really good point that they only try this nonsense with people who aren’t around anymore to tell them to f*ck off.

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