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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
Igneococcus · 09/01/2024 08:06

There is abundant evidence using multiple opinion research methods that the majority of voters (female and male) do not rank this among their most important policy issues.

I occasionally get invited to surveys, mostly about Scottish politics. which ask me to rank topics according to importance to me and I'm never quite sure how to answer them. My top priorities wouldn't include this issue either but it is the issue I judge every politician and every party on. So I rank it quite low in my survey answers because I don't think it's the issue the Scottish government should spend so much time and effort on but it is one of the reasons why I will not ever vote SNP or SGreens. I'm sure the research you do is better designed than these surveys (used to be Panelbase which are now Norstat).

OP posts:
HPFA · 09/01/2024 08:21

lifelongwhatever · 08/01/2024 12:50

I think he’s right.

Most people’s views align with GC views. Even those who think they are TWAW, agree with the GC position when they have more information about what TWAW now means in practice.

But there is a question of how much do people care about it? And I suspect that most people don’t care as much as they care about cost of living, housing costs and a general sense of having competent capable government and pm.

I suspect the issue for NS and KS was less that people understood or cared about the women’s rights issues of GI, but more that it made KS look an idiot ( and weak and therefore not a capable potential leader) when he could not say what a woman is, and the more the question was asked, the more voters wondered why this was his focus and not the things that mattered to them. Same with NS, not being able to say the reason why Adam Bryson was moved from the women’s prison was because he was a man, made her look idiotic. It destroyed her plain talking, down to earth image, and made her look like just slippery, dishonest politician.

Maybe I am cynical and jaded, but that’s how I see it.

I agree with all of this.

I think that public opinion (as far as we can understand it) is genuinely "muddled" and doesn't fall into the neat dividing lines that people who have strong opinions expect.

It's why even though I can see the logic in the "don't respect pronouns" argument it worries me that it's taking the movement a fairly long way from where the median public position actually "is" - which by and large sees misgendering as unkind.

Keir Starmer probably is muddled and inconsistent on the issue but he's not really taking polling damage from it because in that he's largely reflecting public opinion.

Datun · 09/01/2024 09:38

My top priorities wouldn't include this issue either but it is the issue I judge every politician and every party on.

Yes, it's a bit of a litmus test.

Almost all parents know someone who is trans in their kids' class or school or peer group. But they may just see that as a fad like being a Goth.

Certainly anyone who reads the Daily Mail won't be unaware of the situation either, they're on an absolute mission.

I'm sure it's on most peoples radar, by now. But maybe they don't know the depth of it.

Which is why I think once the questions start getting asked, things might change. Certainly in terms of peoples' awareness of quite how far the ideology has gone.

When more people see Keir Starmer claim that one in a thousand women have a penis, for instance.

The point being that suddenly politicians everywhere will be electioneering and the best questions are always going to be those that they absolutely can't answer.

But that's all straying from the point about Hogwarts Legacy!

PaperWalkAndTalk · 09/01/2024 11:19

Hogwart's Legacy is an interesting one, because I've heard that the developers (once their strop at trying to get the game cancelled didn't work) went a bit excessive on trans inclusion in the game. So there could've been calls for a boycott of the game based on excessive "wokery", but as the boycott was based on the opposite side of the argument sales were incredibly high, and for many the game was seen as "anti-woke" even if the content was the opposite.

I think what we're finding is that in reality trans activists don't have much say with the public, that's why they influence the small minority of those in power to enforce these policies on the majority.

Essentially the activists and games media (that bowed to the demands of activists) lost out because the boycott didn't work, and there wasn't a genocide of trans people due to the massive sales of the game.

SaffronSpice · 09/01/2024 11:59

I think what we're finding is that in reality trans activists don't have much say with the public, that's why they influence the small minority of those in power to enforce these policies on the majority.

They have known all along that the public would disagree, which is why they had their NoDebate agenda, Denton report laying out that changes should be sneaked in so they wouldn’t be spotted, sneaking in policy changes without public engagement….

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