Scottish Government closes petition to axe controversial school trans guidance

[IwantToRetire]

Teacher guidance that encourages the affirmation of gender identity beliefs in Scottish schools will not be axed and MSPs are under fire for their 'silence'

MSPs will no longer be exploring an update to transgender guidance in Scottish schools.

Holyrood's Public Petitions committee backed away from calls from campaign group Safeguarding Our School (SOS) who want the Scottish Government to axe its "Supporting transgender young people in schools" guidance.

SOS described the current guidance as potentially breaching teachers' duty of care and raised conflicts with the Equality Act's sex-based provisions. Critical of the brief conversation at the Holyrood meeting of MSPs, the group said: "They would appear to rather have bad, out of date & harmful guidance, than have to actually reflect on and have difficult conversations about the issue."

SNP MSP for Kirkcaldy David Torrance, who called for the petition to be closed after evidence was considered, said axing the guidance would be "detrimental to the well being of transgender young people."

https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/scottish-government-closes-petition-axe-31610508

They've got to get 'em young or they'll never believe it.

It was a farce from start to finish. Once the transcript from yesterday’s meeting is posted on the petition committee website I’ll outline it properly, but effectively all it showed was that the Scottish Tories are just as much ideologues as the other parties up here and support self ID for children in schools.

Jackson Carlaw is the Chair of the committee. He was one of only 3 Scottish Tory MPs to vote for the GRR Bill and he accepted the Deputy Chair (SNP MSP David Torrance) position that the Cass Review is not relevant to Scottish schools and dismissed the NHSE MindEd modules for educators which take a cautious approach to social transition in schools as opposed to the affirmation only approach of the ScotGov guidance.

He was also happy to ignore the fact that the ScotGov guidance now misquotes the EHRC Technical Guidance for schools (EHRC guidance was updated on 22 Sept) and misrepresents the EA.

It’s not surprising Jackson feels this way as he chose the organisations to get feedback from. He ignored the request from the petitioner to also approach organisations like Bayswater, TransgenderTrend, SSA etc, and only went to the lobby groups like LGBT Youth Scotland plus a couple of completely irrelevant places like COSLA.

It was a shameful day for all of the committee members. Fergus Ewing who has pushed back against the SNP on other aspects of gender ideology and voted against the GRR Bill sat in silence as did all of the other members as David Torrance moved to dismiss and Fergus supported.

The same as yesterday.

"No, we can't talk about the issues, we're too scared."

I dont understand how if they allow petitions, and they are signed by voters who elected the people the petition is addressed to, how they can just "close" it.

Or is this the wrong description. ie they read the petition and said we dont care we know we are right and petitioners are wrong.

(I am just asking this more as an issue about openess and accountability. If they can just "close" a petition its clear it is just an empty gesture.)

I think petitions only trigger a debate (assuming they have sufficient backing/signatures). There is no control on how the debate will be handled and no guarantee the points raised will be adequately addressed. It sounds ridiculous that they would dismiss Cass as not being relevant in Scotland though, and equally poor if they failed to address the fact that they are now quoting outdated guidance from the EHRC. Their arrogance and capture will likely cost some children in Scotland dearly.

Absolutely horrific.

I really hope the magnificent speeches in Parliament on Wednesday and in the hol yesterday have some sort of drip feeding impact.

Not least, a great deal has been actively spelt out in Hansard and is evidenced now. And law change/ clarifications in England.

If the Scot's gov is tone deaf, at least the general public and those in key professions working with children have more to draw upon in order to question and push back. The way Kemi et al spelt out the issues within safeguarding was very hard to challenge.

FFS.

The transcript of the meeting is online now. The petition discussion (or more accurately, lack thereof) is on page 23 here:

https://www.parliament.scot/api/sitecore/CustomMedia/OfficialReport?meetingId=15595

(Note- there was an entirely different petition by a different peritioner later in the meeting about gender ideology in schools which was also closed and is on page 27. Please don’t get the two confused and then tell me to fuck off when I point it out to you like someone did to me on X yesterday 😂 )

I’ve written to several of the committee members to ask why they were silent and happy to not only support self ID in our schools but also turn a blind eye to the fact that the ScotGov guidance now misquotes the EHRC and misrepresents the EA. None have responded to me yet, although another Scottish Conservative MSP has told me:

”Thank you for your message and for passing on your concerns about the stance taken by Jackson Carlaw in the public petitions committee last week. As you will know, when the GRR Bill came to the Scottish Parliament the Scottish Conservatives were the only party that granted a free vote to our members, and three of the thirty-one of us backed the Bill, one of them being Jackson Carlaw. He is therefore entitled to have his own view on the matter, but does not represent the Scottish Conservatives position on this.”

In other words, Jackson is fine to take actions based on his personal views of self ID in schools.

IMO, it’s easy for the Scottish Tories to say nice words, but it’s the actions that matter and there has been no public distancing by the party from what Jackson did last week.

it’s easy for the Scottish Tories to say nice words, but it’s the actions that matter and there has been no public distancing by the party from what Jackson did last week.

Its not just in Scotland unfortunately.

I suppose there would have been a majority of signatories saying, "Sod this rubbish," so they have decided to close it, in order to stifle dissent. Cheating, reckless bastards.

It was agreed by 5 men:

Jackson Carlaw (Convenor and Scottish Conservative MSP)
David Torrance (Deptuty Convenor and SNP MSP)
Foysol Choudhury (Labour)
Maurice Golden (Scottish Conservative)
Fergus Ewing (SNP)

Foysol is hopeless on the issue.
David Torrance would be fully in support of self ID in schools.
Jackson Carlaw voted for the GRR Bill so ditto to David Torrance
Maurice Golden voted against the GRR Bill so God knows why he stayed silent
Fergus Ewing was a vocal opponent of the GRR Bill and it is baffling as to why he stayed silent. It is possible he didn’t understand what we was agreeing, particularly the turning a blind eye to the EHRC/EA elements.

“We got a petition with over 10,00O people and organisations disagreeing with our guidelines, so we asked the six lobbyists who helped us write it and they are still happy with what they persuaded us to write, so we must be right.”

Well, there was only 4,800 signatures (which is not bad at all for a Scottish petition) but otherwise, yep that sums it up perfectly

I do think these men need to be publicly asked what it is about transitioning younger children and setting them on a pathway to infertility and bodily harm that they find so appealing?

Foysol is one of my MSPs so in theory he should respond to my email asking him why he stayed silent.

I’d emailed Liam Kerr (shadow education Secretary for the Scottish Tories) to raise concerns about Jackson and I copied Jackson into the email. Liam has responded to say he can’t speak for Jackson but he’s sure Jackson will come back to me “in due course”. We’ll see if he does.

I’ve also emailed Maurice Golden and Fergus Ewing but I am not a constituent of either of them so while I hope they respond, they are under no obligation to do so.

David Torrance will be a lost cause and is not worth writing to, IMO.

I fully agree they should be publicly asked why they support transitioning children - the problem is who will do it up here given that the decision was driven through by a Scottish Tory MSP!

My MP (SNP) no longer responds to any emails. Ever. He is busy inserting himself into every photo opportunity he can find. Lot of posturing to be done.

Deciding that the Cass report isn’t relevant to Scottish children is surely reckless in the extreme. Does anyone know if these men could be personally liable with respect to any future harm done in Scottish schools since the evidence is there, they just chose to ignore it?

I’m in this really surreal position where my SNP MSP is the only one to have shown me courtesy and compassion and taken actual action on my behalf. I only recently contacted them in a “I no longer give any fucks about how I’m treated” way and am now kicking myself for not having done so years ago. It was the last thing I expected. My Scottish Tory and Labour MSPs have been useless.

The Scottish Conservatives are using their debate time tomorrow to discuss Scottish education:

https://news.stv.tv/scotland/conservatives-accuse-scottish-government-of-neglecting-education-system-ahead-of-debate

Safeguarding Our Schools (Scotland) who launched the petition to remove the ScotGov school guidance are suggesting people write to the Scottish Conservative Shadow Education Secretary, Liam Kerr, and ask him to include gender ideology in the debate:

https://x.com/sos_scotland/status/1734538611758899683?s=61&t=8CxL28ZCFDq66yuIWhY6_Q

Tweet text is:

”We’ve written to @LiamKerrMSP to ask the @ScotTories to cover the school guidance during their welcome focus on education this week

The guidance poses a risk to children & their families, as well as dismantling trust between parents & schools

We urge parents to contact them too”

Liam’s email address is [email protected]

Thanks, rogdmum. Will do.

Just a quick update to say Foysol Choudhury refused to answer my questions about the EHRC and why he was happy to ignore the fact that the Scottish Govt guidance now misrepresents the EA and misquotes the EHRC.

Instead, I got a cut and paste job which included the statement that the Cass Review “has no significance to the provision of educational materials in schools in Scotland.”

Ie he dismissed Cass.

Which is an odd thing to say given that just today the DfE said:

“The upcoming guidance will help safeguard pupils & crucially ensure that parents are involved in decisions relating to their child, as the Cass Review has made clear that any degree of social transition could have significant consequences for children.”

So the question is why are our Scottish children different? Why are they less deserving of safeguarding?

I have responded to Foysol to say that he did not answer my original questions plus here’s another two I would like answered.

I’ve tweeted it all here but will attach a screenshot of his cut and paste response to me

https://x.com/rogdmum/status/1736727423670985102?s=61&t=8CxL28ZCFDq66yuIWhY6_Q

Thanks, rogdmum. This is really concerning. Why on earth woudl they choose to disregard Cass? It seems reckless in the extreme. That's a suggestion of how Labour would be in power, I suppose.

Pretty much

What a failing by adults

Staggering. Facts and reality and child safeguarding and even reports not completed yet are going to be abandoned if they threaten alternative reality.

Yes. Voters look and learn.

Have you seen the guidance released today by the Government re Public Authorities duties re the EA and letter from Kemi Baddenoch to PAs. Does it overlap / impinge on Scottish Government statements.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/public-sector-equality-duty-guidance-for-public-authorities/public-sector-equality-duty-guidance-for-public-authorities

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/public-sector-equality-duty-guidance-for-public-authorities/letter-to-public-authority-leaders-from-the-minister-for-women-and-equalities