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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

FGM: 20 years & 2 convictions

16 replies

NitroNine · 26/10/2023 14:38

FGM was made a crime in the UK in 1985 & The Female Genital Mutilation Act was passed in 2003. The absence of prosecutions led to a Home Affairs Committee Enquiry in 2014.

The first conviction was in February 2019, when a mother who mutilated her 3yo daughter was convicted - her partner was acquitted though. (The previous 4 attempts to prosecute ended in acquittals).

Now Amina Noor has been convicted - and while she’s the second person to be convicted, she is the first person to be convicted of assisting a non-UK person to perform FGM.

It’s incredible that there’s finally been this progress - but frustrating that it’s such glacial progress. I think glaciers move faster, in fact. I so desperately hope this will encourage girls & [young] women to come forward & seek justice.

Female Genital Mutilation Act 2003

An Act to restate and amend the law relating to female genital mutilation; and for connected purposes.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/31/contents

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MargotBamborough · 26/10/2023 14:47

I mean, it must be difficult to get any kind of information about what anyone has had done to their genitals.

I used to be friends with someone who worked as an obstetrician in an area with a big Somalian population. She told me about patients having ten or eleven children. I wondered about FGM but it didn't feel appropriate to ask. I would imagine that doctors and midwives working in maternity units which serve these particular populations are the most likely people to be aware that a woman has had this done to her. I wonder whether their obligation of patient confidentiality prevents them from reporting it.

bombastix · 26/10/2023 14:58

It is good news but a law like this was made to be used otherwise its deterrent effect is limited. I think as girls get older, there will be more prosecutions. I will be glad to see it myself.

AnyFucker · 26/10/2023 15:05

I wonder whether their obligation of patient confidentiality prevents them from reporting it

No, you are obliged by law to report any actual or suspected incidences of FGM.

AnyFucker · 26/10/2023 15:05

And two convictions is pitiful

NitroNine · 26/10/2023 15:15

@MargotBamborough

Since 2015 HCPs who observe evidence of FGM have a mandatory reporting duty - further, if a girl “just” tells them she’s experienced it or says something that causes the HCP to believe she’s at risk of it, they also have to report. There are other professions who’re mandatory reporters too (including teachers) - the link has all the details about how it works.

I suspect HCPs might have concerns about parents not seeking care for their daughters & indeed young women not seeking care for themselves because they’re worried about [their parents] away being reported 🫤

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5a8086f2ed915d74e33faefc/FGM_Mandatory_Reporting_-_procedural_information_nov16_FINAL.pdf

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MargotBamborough · 26/10/2023 15:25

NitroNine · 26/10/2023 15:15

@MargotBamborough

Since 2015 HCPs who observe evidence of FGM have a mandatory reporting duty - further, if a girl “just” tells them she’s experienced it or says something that causes the HCP to believe she’s at risk of it, they also have to report. There are other professions who’re mandatory reporters too (including teachers) - the link has all the details about how it works.

I suspect HCPs might have concerns about parents not seeking care for their daughters & indeed young women not seeking care for themselves because they’re worried about [their parents] away being reported 🫤

Thanks for the information.

The guidance says it applies to under 18s though.

Although some of the women from the Somalian community who are giving birth might be under 18, I expect the vast majority of them are over 18. Does that mean there is no obligation to report?

A 20 year old woman from that community giving birth to her first child who is observed by HCPs to have undergone FGM may be a legal adult, but if she has lived in the UK for a long time there is still a possibility that it was done to her after her family moved to the UK and in contravention of this law.

Bigroundpear · 26/10/2023 15:57

I am absolutely delighted this law has been used appropriately in this instance. I too hope this signals a new era where this despicable crime is punished where it happens, and that the punishing of it results in a deterrent strong enough to protect little girls.

IwantToRetire · 26/10/2023 17:00

I suspect that the problems with this law actually having any impact are the same or similar to the under reporting of "honour" crimes.

A key finding in this research was that all victims/survivors the authors interviewed stated that they did not support the practice of FGM, and that they would not follow it for younger women in their own family.

Second, the authors found that none of the respondents had reported their experience to the police.

Third, they identified key barriers to reporting, which included: their belief that reporting their own experience would not serve any purpose because they had experienced FGM as children, and in another country; and that they did not feel able to report new incidents of FGM in the community because of a lack of trust in the police due to previous negative experiences.

Finally, they believed that FGM could be prevented only by work within the community, and not through engagement with the criminal justice system

Perception and barriers: reporting female genital mutilation
https://research-information.bris.ac.uk/ws/portalfiles/portal/154526508/JACPR_09_2017_0323.pdf

NitroNine · 26/10/2023 21:50

@MargotBamborough mandatory reporting extends to adults, yes.

Interesting to read the interagency report for which the WHO had overarching responsibility. They manage to write about women & girls & the UN, as contributors, can clearly cope with it. The NHS don’t prattle on about AFAB etc in their literature about FGM - whether for HCPs or the target population for information & public health campaigns either. Almost as if they consider gender identity not to be innate & organic; but rather the product of privilege that it would be gross cultural imperialism to inflict on women & girls whose sex-based oppression includes quite literal torture.

https://www.england.nhs.uk/north/wp-content/uploads/sites/5/2016/01/fgm-hp-guide.pdf

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Fink · 26/10/2023 21:56

MargotBamborough · 26/10/2023 14:47

I mean, it must be difficult to get any kind of information about what anyone has had done to their genitals.

I used to be friends with someone who worked as an obstetrician in an area with a big Somalian population. She told me about patients having ten or eleven children. I wondered about FGM but it didn't feel appropriate to ask. I would imagine that doctors and midwives working in maternity units which serve these particular populations are the most likely people to be aware that a woman has had this done to her. I wonder whether their obligation of patient confidentiality prevents them from reporting it.

I work in an area with a lot of Somalis and the large families are common. When I read this story I immediately wondered whether there were any other girls in the same family and whether anything was done to prevent the same happening to them before it was too late, given that it has been 8 years since the first suspicions were reported. I don't know what relation the convicted woman is to the victim, but presumably some kind of close relative.

It's an absolutely despicable practice. We need many more convictions and strong sentencing to get the message across how unacceptable it is. There is already a lot of community work around trying win people around, we need the prosecutions to go with it. And the law needs to be widened to prosecute everyone involved or complicit - I can't believe that this woman single handedly took the decision to have this torture inflicted on her daughter (or niece or sister or whatever), without any other family members' involvement.

NitroNine · 28/10/2023 22:51

@Fink
It’s always troubled me that the first conviction saw the woman’s partner acquitted. Unless there was rock solid evidence that she’d always told him she was opposed to FGM & would never do that/allow it to be done to the wee girl; he was aware there was a risk & should’ve sought help if not reported her.

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MrsOvertonsWindow · 28/10/2023 23:11

A doctor was prosecuted for FGM after stitching back up a woman who'd been subject to FGM after she gave birth.

He got off after a number of procedural failings by the hospital were cited in his defence.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30886077

Doctor 'performed FGM on new mother in hospital'

A UK doctor performed female genital mutilation on a young mother after she gave birth in hospital, a court has heard, in the first prosecution of its kind in the UK.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30886077

MargotBamborough · 29/10/2023 09:38

@MrsOvertonsWindow Surely there must be a protocol for doctors and midwives about how to treat pregnant women who have undergone FGM. It can't be that rare an occurrence, especially in areas with large immigrant populations from countries where FGM is still widespread.

popebishop · 29/10/2023 09:48

Interesting. I assume it's particularly difficult to get convictions because by the time any professional sees that it has happened, it's a long time after it has taken place? That's not to say care shouldn't be taken about suspected potential victims. I think there was an episode of No Offence about this....

AnnaMagnani · 29/10/2023 10:18

@MrsOvertonsWindow that case was very complex and basically should never have been brought (I knew one of the parties involved)

The woman had already had FGM and was having a post partum haemorrhage and needed stitches. The whole thing was based on one stitch and what direction it went in.

There were also massive errors made such as assuming that because the woman and the doctor were both brown he had colluded to redo her FGM, when in reality they were from totally different cultures thousands of miles apart.

There is protocol on how to treat these women and the expert who created it, spoke in the doctor's defence which is when the case finally collapsed.

It is possible the whole thing was brought because the CPS felt under pressure due to lack of convictions despite this not being what the law was for at all.

IwantToRetire · 29/10/2023 19:24

A mandatory reporting duty for FGM requires regulated health and social care professionals and teachers in England and Wales to report known cases of FGM in under 18-year-olds to the police.

The FGM duty came into force on 31 October 2015.

This document gives relevant professionals and the police information on the mandatory reporting duty.

(updated 2020)
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/mandatory-reporting-of-female-genital-mutilation-procedural-information

Mandatory reporting of female genital mutilation: procedural information

Gives relevant professionals and the police an understanding of the female genital mutilation (FGM) mandatory reporting duty.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/mandatory-reporting-of-female-genital-mutilation-procedural-information

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