Trying to understand Brand supporters

[mids2019]

I am trying to understand why some people are actually trying to support Russell Brand.

I think a lot of it is down to disappointment that a figure they may have once liked has brought himself into disgrqce. My partner liked Michael Jackson and the accusations by the two men about him at the time really did disillusion them about her youthful admirations; Brand is not Jackson but there may be a similar thought process.

I think it also makes people feel 'who's next' and realise that the media has been adept at covering the behaviour of big star names (Schofiled, Spacey, etc.). Possibly people would rather have

the idea of Brand being innocent than let go of cherished views that we a celebrity circuit of people who are 'the good guys'.

I have noticed that a lot of the celeb circuit in radio and television are a little reluctant to speak about the subjects Brand has brought up. A few programs have touched upon the topic tangentially and it obviously makes the main news but a lot of the morning DJs such as Chris Evans.etc haven't mentioned it all on their shows which I feel is quite strange. It all lends itself to a view that the celebs who we all invest in are fallible and we could be waking up one morning to find another has a strong of allegations against them.

Possibly there is part of human nature that allows the elite to have led way iin their behaviour towards others?.There have been historical cases where rich men (aristocracy) have basically had the right to assault lower class women and maybe this is a modern extension of this?

There are obviously the misogynist conspiracy theorists but I think there are also others that may be looking to defend the antics of men in the 2000s as they were of that period and they don't particular like the whole era being stained in their memories. There are also a few that think Brand is being judged by 2023 standards when a lot of the alleged crimes happened in the 2000s where although the law was the same , in my opinion, the culture wasn't and Brand was maybe an extreme of behaviour shown by many men.

The above was all written about by him in his own memoir published in 2007.
No corroboration needed. It was in there in black and white read by more than half a million people.

Ash is excellent in that podcast above. Thanks for posting.

Wtf... is anyone printing extracts from his book?

No idea but I remember that one because he was meant to sleep with the wife but couldn't go through with it as they'd got to know one another and it felt desperate and iiirc he had a half-hearted grope, said her breasts felt like lard in a polythene bag and all parties seemed relieved when they didn't sleep together.

That's kind of the point. Some of the anecdotes in the book were grim, grubby and immoral. You probably could have taken him down at the time by going through it line by line, like journos have been doing in the last four years.

But it won awards and at the time many readers, including myself, thought it was bleak but honest.
Perhaps in light of the fact that RB had had a libel pay out after the reporting on Trevor Lock's arrest for rape (they shared a flat at the Edinburgh Fringe) which was later dropped by the complainant , journos were not going after him.
I note that nobody is mentioning the aforesaid dropped case as it pertained to TL and not RB and it didn't go to court but it is relevant only because I'm sure RB said the false accusation could have happened to any of them and that TL was innocent.

There were deleted tweets of late suggesting that RB's conduct when performing at the Underbelly wasn't whiter than white that year. The tweets called out the venue's management and claimed that a woman had complained of being pushed against a wall/groped but Underbelly said and did nothing after the complaint was received.

All that said, I remain surprised that in the last week you haven't had hundreds of complaints as happened with Saville. I believe only a couple more have officially come forward hence the press printing anything and everything they can from past shows, appearances and from colleagues in a bid for more clickbait (that in itself doesn't undermine the women's testimonies but it does show the media's motives and hypocrisy in being all over it now when all these appearances were in the public domain).

You will not know whether there were many complaints. The police are not obliged to tell the public, Brand wouldn't, and the woman would have not gone further to say much.

He is scumbag. Bleak yes, honest? Really doubt that any celebrity biography is that. People are too gullible really.

i'm not a supporter of him, don't watch any of his stuff and he's really a none entity to me- however he's not been arrested. Police haven't made a case- trial by media and all this witch hunting is not an effective justice system. Why haven't police even interviewed him yet??? it says a lot really

Why do you expect to know if the police have spoken to him? Some sort of rolling news service?

Chris Evans is friends with RB IRL, he interviewed him on the show and they talked about their friendship.

podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-chris-evans-show-with-cinch/id1450650136?i=1000551550641

So many posters chirping in with whether they did or didn’t like Brand. Your opinion is irrelevant!

The only similarities between Saville, Harris and Brand is that they’re celebrities. Do not lump Brand in with those two just because he’s also famous

Exposé fatigue

Schofield/spacey/Huw Edwards and now RB. It's like well "who next?". especially since some of them seem to be made into a much bigger deal then they actually are (like Huw, two consenting adults etc).
There has been no complaint to the police before.

Also, these were 10-20years ago. And I don't think you should judge a 2000's misjudgment but a 2023 standard. I made a few unsavoury decisions back in the early 2000s when I was young and struggling with undiagnosed mental health. I would hate for those misjudgments to be brought up and destroy my now professional job, home and family. I'm not the person I was back then, and I think that's the same with RB (don't like him though, but I don't agree with cancel culture)

Fuck, I've agreed with ash twice in a month 🤯

Also, these were 10-20years ago. And I don't think you should judge a 2000's misjudgment but a 2023 standard.

Sexual assault standards haven't changed in that time.

It's the same offence! Jesus. Sexual offending and the law has been governed by the same law since 2003.

Wow. You can see why Brand got away with his open misogyny. Apparently it is bleak and honest and he has changed because he said so.

The MO of many a sex offender. Really depressing to read.

@soberfabulous

They seem to have a lot in common. I wonder if he regrets the podcast or was this a surreptitious show of support? They both seem to have liked flashing, bullying, being promiscuous and treating women badly. What were they discussing, wellness?

I'm wondering what you think has changed in the last 10-20 years ago?
I'm middle aged and i think things have gone backwards in terms of women's rights since the 2000s. As demonstrated by the "trial by media" posts.

In the 2000s Angus Deayton was sacked from HIGNFY after having an affair, using prostitutes and taking drugs. John Leslie was sacked over allegations he raped Ulrika Johnson. Hugh Grant's career took a huge hit after he was exposed using prostitutes.

I don't think any of that would happen today. We are far too mired in patriarchal "false accusations"/"innocent until proven guilty" bullshit

at the moment he has paparazzi outside his house 24/7. if he had gone to the post office it would've been reported let alone police station.

Savile was still at large in 2000, Max Clifford was still controlling reputations, all of the Yewtree abusers were still BBC darlings. With hindsight, Dayton’s punishment looks almost performative - scapegoating - to make it look like the Beeb gave a shit while all the abuse was still rife.

I recently rewatched Buffy the Vampire Slayer with my dd. I loved it in the late 90s.
Today though? The way Xander leers at girls? Yeah, standards HAVE changed.
See also Hugh Hefner and the playboy mansion - also big in the late 90/early 00s. Bums being pinched, wolf whistling etc etc. there has been a change in what people think is acceptable (and rightly so!)

I think the biggest change is coercive control becoming a crime. Obviously it's always been bad, but I remember in the 00s that as long as you said yea, even if coerced and given no option, was considered consensual sex. I am glad that is no longer the case

Looking at some of the old news about Chris Evans it was interesting that after a number of accusations of bullying and assault one anonymous close friend said that eventually you feel the accusers would 'f#ck off and die'. I guess that attitude probably prevails when a star is at his peak. I wonder how derogatory Brand sycophants were about the building number of complainants?

Years ago the BBC could whitewash reports and the accusers implicitly demonised. Evans at the time complained on the effects on his family after being questioned about sexual assault and I guess Brand at some point may be making the same point.

The abuse is still rife now. That's my point. Nothing has improved so the whole "it was 20 years ago" is a deflection from the issue.

*In the 2000s Angus Deayton was sacked from HIGNFY after having an affair, using prostitutes and taking drugs. John Leslie was sacked over allegations he raped Ulrika Johnson. Hugh Grant's career took a huge hit after he was exposed using prostitutes.

I don't think any of that would happen today. We are far too mired in patriarchal "false accusations"/"innocent until proven guilty" bullshit*

Kevin Spacey was cancelled immediately/fired or replaced in all projects
Morgan Freeman was let go from visa card campaign after allegations
Tim Westwood stepped down from Capital Xtra
Phillip Schofield resigned from Good Morning
Huw Edwards has been suspended
Russell Brand has had charities disassociate/demonetised channel
Kutcher/Kunis had to step down from abuse charity after their character reference for a convicted rapist

So there is accountability albeit at least two of the above allegedly got pay off/suspension pay

I think thinks have changed a lot since #MeToo.

Think that's bad - I've just found myself agreeing with Nigel Farage https://youtube.com/shorts/XN69szEfC1o?si=fvUt9joaO3fHN4Q-

I read the autobiography "I'm such a loveable cunty wunty" to paraphrase another poster at the weekend (partner is a compulsive book hoarder; had bought it years ago from a charity shop but never read it).

All of the disgusting behaviour is there, in plain sight, but he also describes the sex and drug addiction programmes he's been on. He got away with it at the time because he was charismatic and enabled by wider culture; he got away with it up until recently because he successfully rebranded himself as a survivor of dark times dispensing wisdom only available to those who have struggled with demons. He's very skilled at making it all about himself; it's the only thing he's good at.