On embracing being a TERF and the propaganda (gender wars)

[Karensalright]

I want women and our supporters to take this term as our own from the men who try to steal our safety and our identity and our gay children. But i am not a radical feminist. I am not a feminist. I am not gay, i am a Marxist, a miners wife who supported gay pride back in the day. I want a bigger women’s umbrella that we can move forward on unite around, So I am a Trans Exclusionary Real Female, as a headline, and put under it whatever the issue is. Eg leave my bogs and kids alone all in all your just another brick in the wall…

I'm not a TERF as I don't treat anyone differently for being trans (I genuinely don't even know who that includes any more, as apparently someone who rejects gender identification completely is also trans).
Where relevant, I treat people according to their sex. What their gender feelings are probably doesn't affect this and vice versa.
Where not relevant, gender might be relevant I suppose but being trans or not wouldn't come into it.

Basically, I'm a MERF (m=male) not a TERF.

But really, 'gender critical' is more accurate - I think the concept of gender is broadly harmful, and actually a fair few trans people used to say exactly this to me as well, before GC became a widely used term.

No, no, just no.

This has been done to death. TERF is used as a four letter word to abuse women and even if we change the acronym into different words that's how it will be used and continue to be used.

Also, I'm not "trans exclusionary" I just believe in same sex spaces. Female born trans or non binary identified people are not excluded from my feminism.

“Also, I'm not "trans exclusionary" I just believe in same sex spaces. Female born trans or non binary identified people are not excluded from my feminism.”

This.

Objecting to women’s right to the privacy and dignity of single-sex female-only male-free spaces being removed from women is not “trans exclusionary”. Campaigners for retaining female-only single-sex facilities include those individuals who are female but declare a masculine or a non-binary gender identity.

Sadly, those individuals who are female but declare a masculine or NB identity are being lied to by the male sexual entitlement campaigners lobbying for access to women in a state of undress. And the use of the inaccurate term “trans exclusionary” is the foundation stone of those lies.

I hope you can be bothered to read this i have given all you assertions due thought.

Thanks for the contributions and thoughts on my post. As an aside i have been clicking on info provided on various posts locating research publications for quite some time now.

I was alerted to the whole issue because of the consultation on the GRA.

This is because i used to be the CEO of a Women’s Aid service. I cannot recall exactly when but one of the trustees in a meeting flagged up the trans right to access our residential service. My response was i will ask the women who live in the refuge if such a referral arises, but in principle we are for women by women.

Thus far in this thread there seems to be a general consensus that there is such a thing as a trans gender person, and that you are all not exclusionary by wanting sex based spaces which excludes a group who you all seem to accept are trans gender women. I do not accept that there is such a thing as a trans gender man or women.

The cohort of trans people appear to now include

None binary who don’t adhere to any gender based stereo types in terms of dress sexuality and relationships. That i am comfortable with.

Perfectly reasonable people such as Debbie Hayton and others who go about living their lives and managing their own disorder.

Men who fetishise women's bodies (sexuality issue)

INCELS who are infiltrators and joined the gang in the hope of obtaining sex from women(oversimplified)

Some very strange distorted men who hate women, seek to shut them down.

Minor interest people. ( by the way this came up back in the 1980s as a valid component of gay pride by some)

Women who dress and identify as men

I have probably missed a group out.

So in short it is not a coherent group.

It is all complicated with psycho babble plenty of which i have read.

I am with Stock et al..

I would go further men are men women are women. People are gay or straight or fluid. End of. It’s that simple.

I embrace the TERF label. It no longer has any meaning past woman who dares to have an opposing opinion to the TRAs on... well anything really!

So no matter what I say or do I'm always going to get TERF thrown at me by clueless people!

So I'm a happy TERF in my terfy terven of like-minded TERFs.

Thus far in this thread there seems to be a general consensus that there is such a thing as a trans gender person, and that you are all not exclusionary by wanting sex based spaces which excludes a group who you all seem to accept are trans gender women. I do not accept that there is such a thing as a trans gender man or women.

There are transwomen and transmen. They exist because that's what they call themselves!

Doesn't mean I actually think they are anything more than people who either think stereotypes are an actual thing and that if you reject the stereotypes of your sex you must automatically be the other sex, or that they have a bad disconnect with what they actually are and what they think they should be and somehow think clothes surgery and pills can fundamentally change your sex.

So I exclude men no matter what those men call themselves, think they are or feel they are.

Still men!

I think Terf is a slur and inaccurate. As a previous poster said women and girls who claim that they are men, boys or nonbinary, I still see as female. I mean, they are. No matter the wrong sex hormones, the surgery, the clothes, the hair, the names, it's impossible for humans to change their sex. I don't care what's on their paperwork, if it's different from their biological sex it's a lie, although in a very few cases it might be a genuine error.

So, I don't exclude all transpeople from feminism just the male ones. The female ones may self exclude but that's their decision.

Having said that, if they're going to call me terf, I'll be terf. One of the terven. I'm not thinking of the haters when I use the word. I'm thinking of the amazing women who are pushing back.

But on the lips, the signs, the stickers, the socials, the t-shirts of the gender zealouts it's still a slur.

still am a self identifying as a TERF

Unfortunately your position gives TRA such ammunition.

"See, it's not a slur, it's not an insult, it's just descriptive, because look terfs even call themselves terfs and don't consider it offensive"

I don't think you understand how dangerous it is to self identify as a TERF given that the TRA archetype of a TERF is:

Someone who wants to kill trans people/erase trans people/hates trans people/hates gays/wants all trans people to conform to gender stereotypes instead, get excluded from absolutely everything etc etc.

This "TERF" archetype obviously doesn't really exist, it's only in TRA ideology that it does. But it underpins and justifies so much of their woman-hating activism. It drives certain male groups of people to become actually dangerous to women.

This then gives them the justification to want to punch a TERF/ tell a TERF to choke to death on their cock/get cancelled etc etc because it's entirely justified given these mythical "TERF" people are all waiting to attack us

• obviously actually there are only feminists wanting same sex spaces who recognise biological reality but it's far more effective to create a demonized group based on untruths.

I'm not going to support giving a deranged ideology any more ammunition.