National Trust AGM

[PRAMtran]

I’ve received an email from the National Trust inviting me and all other members to vote in their AGM. Does anyone know if there are any things a woman’s rights advocate should vote for or against. Eg TWAW by stealth.

Once you start trying to make all people experience and think what you want them to get out of something, you've started down the road of classism that you and your views are the right ones and you have a duty to make the unenlightened do what's better for them. And that's the kind of attitude that colonialism was built on.

FroodwithaKaren has just got my first 'hidden gratitude' click for this. Nicely put.

There are horrendous working conditions for many people, today. Bonded labour exists all around the world, and people are still trafficked into slavery.
Those Nike sweatshirts and trainers that people seem so fond of ( like one of the BLM rioters who was responsible for the policewoman being knocked off her horse in London) come at a cost. Wherever there are cheap goods, someone is paying the price. That is how it works.

Exactly it’s a lot easier to blame the past than it is to do something about slavery in the current days

The International Slavery Museum in Liverpool often has special exhibitions which look at contemporary practices of slavery and bonded labour, as well as looking at the historical Atlantic slave trade.

https://www.antislavery.org/slavery-today/modern-slavery/

My interest in the NT is mainly for access to outdoor spaces. I'm less interested in historic mansions but I'm pleased that when I do visit them that they acknowledge the work put into them by those who built and maintained them and their rich occupants.
Contrast that with Chatsworth House (not NT) which is full of how the Duke of La Di Da and his ancestors themselves built that great house and furnished it with treasures pilfered from across the world with no recognition of how they gained their riches or who actually put the work in (beautiful grounds though).

On a separate note those saying the NT exists to maintain beautiful architecture what about the Southwell workhouse and the Birmingham back to backs? Their primary focus is the history and rightly so.

From that website:

• “22 million people are in forced marriages. Two out of five of these people were children”

No mention of what proportion of “these people” were female and what proportion were male.

Yes, it is only at the end that the fact that this relates primarily to girls is stated. It is implicit, throughout, that we are talking about girls, though this seems to be hiding behind the more neutral 'children'.

OP - as you may have gathered from the thread, it's a hot topic!!

Restore Trust are a pressure group opposed to any change at the National Trust - whether that's exhibits exploring lesser known people associated with buildings (often women) or acknowledging the links between the the people who created and furnished stately homes and the slave trade. I don't know what their stance is on the trans issue, but I'd hazard a guess that they are probably anti the currently fashionable LGBTQ+ stance.

Personally, I enjoy the exhibitions highlighting a wider range of voices associated with NT properties, and think it's important to highlight links to slavery and colonialism, particularly in order to make BME visitors feel welcome, so I have voted against the Restore Trust candidates. I support what the National Trust are doing as an organisation to modernise and reinterpret their collections, and don't find in any way that it spoils my enjoyment of a great day out (in fact, it makes it more interesting, particularly for my teenage DC).

You might take another view of course.

Chatsworth is still owned by the Duke of Devonshire so I guess he had considerable input into how his family is portrayed in his ancestral property. The 1st Earl of Devonshire was killed in the Peasants Revolt. A lot of their initial wealth was acquired ‘irregularly‘ from the dissolution of the monestries.

Interestingly pretty much every banana sold in the west comes from a single plant grown in the greenhouse at Chatsworth.

Wasn’t it the National Trust that was putting ludicrous and of course misleading ‘gender neutral’ captions on exhibits?

I filled in some kind of form or online consultation a few years ago (sorry I’ve forgotten the details), to point out that I want to know about this specific place and its occupants as they were, not seen through a 21st century genderwoo prism.

What do you do if you accidentally dig up the bones of a rich white man? Chuck ‘em back in the hole? 😆

I disagree that Restore Trust are opposed to any change at the National Trust. They are currently campaigning for the Trust to restore Chandon Park which was destroyed by fire. The Trust has the money to do so from the insurance but have chosen to consolidate the shell and make it into some kind of exhibition space. Those who remember the restoration of Uppark after a similar devastating fire will know that restoration can be very successful, help keep heritage craft skills alive and be very interesting to visitors. Uppark used to have an interesting exhibition about the restoration which showed how even scraps of damaged wallpaper were saved and reinstalled. There was also a very good TV programme which showed the crafts people at work.
I think it used to be more recognised that such houses and their contents formed complete works of art and that our country was unique in having so many of these wonderful creations still intact. To call them ‘Theme Parks’ as a previous poster has done seems strange from someone who says they care about history.

Just looked up the definition of Theme Park: an amusement park with a unifying setting or idea

Given how these big houses were used I think they would pretty much all meet that definition. They were mostly buildings where their wealthy owners could amuse themselves and their guests, often designed around ‘themes’ that they picked up on their grand tours.

It might be an idea to have a separate exhibition space for the SJ stuff then people can visit v if they want to be educated

“I disagree that Restore Trust are opposed to any change at the National Trust. They are currently campaigning for the Trust to restore Chandon Park which was destroyed by fire. The Trust has the money to do so from the insurance but have chosen to consolidate the shell and make it into some kind of exhibition space.”

What RT are proposing doesn’t sound like “restoration” to me. It sounds like building a facsimile from scratch to match what the original was like before it completely burned down.

Personally I’d prefer membership fees to be spent on protecting the rest of the NT estate from fire risks and preserving the buildings currently most at risk, rather than throwing millions at an ‘after the horse has bolted’ recreation.

But thanks for that info, it’s the kind of specifics I’m interested in knowing about in order to decide how to vote.

Have you got info on any of their other campaign proposals?

"WARNING: Contains History"

Not everyone is a member for the history, I like the parking and the gardens

DatumTarum Exactly how many times have you read How to Make Enemies and Alienate People?

Whatever the number, it's proven effective. I'm not sure I've even ever been to an NT property in my life, and you had me wanting to join the NT just so I could vote for the Restore Trust (that's what RT stands for, right?) candidates in every AGM. Is RT paying you to drum up votes for the group?

The problem for the nt is that it depends on the very people it despises (to pay subs and volunteer). Rather like the c of e.

The NT have £46m of insurance money to spend on the reconstruction if they so wished. It wouldn’t come out of the membership fees. Since you say you don’t agree with RTs stance you must have read their proposals and I’m therefore unsure why you need me to tell you that their only other campaign issue for the AGM relates to voting administration.

it's important to highlight links to slavery and colonialism, particularly in order to make BME visitors feel welcome,

Does it?

The National Trust also maintains the childhood homes of John Lennon and Paul McCartney, in Liverpool. Both very modest homes decorated in the typical style of the day.

That seems to be a pattern. Personally, as I've already hinted, the NT has been historically outwith my budget (and that doesn't seem likely to change), but I do know some people who are members and go regularly. To a woman, they are all retired professionals who go there so they can tramp around the gardens of stately houses.

I know the presumption is that customers, especially female customers, should feel grateful to pay for the privilege of being insulted, but not all members of the British public have agreed to that. In fact, although I'd forgotten about it until now, I think I've overheard one lady complain about the issues in this thread. I can't say I followed the conversation at the time, because I lacked any and all context, but various remarks make more sense in retrospect. I suppose I should presume now that she is sympathetic to this RT group?

Civica seem to do the voting for everything.