Detrans story from ASD woman — can you help me find it?

[Inamuddle36]

A few months ago I read an essay by a young (20-something) woman who had detransitioned and who now realises her feelings of discomfort with her adolescent body were related to undiagnosed ASD. She described in detail how learning techniques to live effectively with ASD and manage her symptoms had allowed her to develop comfort with her body and she had detransitioned. I don’t recall how far she had gone along the trans path.
Can anyone else remember this story and could you send me a link? Or can you share links to similar stories?
A relative has an adolescent daughter who has declared herself to be “a boy” and who very likely is ASD. I know the family well and (admittedly without specialist knowledge) think the declaration of “trans” is a symptom of underlying mental health challenges and/or “learning differences” rather than vice versa. I would like to be able to share links with my relatives which might help them understand the links between ASD and trans.
Would be grateful for any leads!

This young lady was in the Daily Telegraph but this is a YouTube video from detrans awareness day. Not sure if it is the person you are thinking of.

Thank you. Will watch the video. But what I am trying to find is a written story/essay by a 20-something year old woman — she described in detail what she felt as a teen, why those feelings (and outside influences) led her to think she was trans, and how she came to accept her body and learn to appreciate and understand her “different” ways of thinking.

There are quite a few young women who have told their story. Chloe Cole, Helena Kirschner, Keira Bell, Sinead Watson, Prisha Mosely - a google of any of their names will take you to interviews, blogs, clips etc.

To add, i am not sure which of those are ASD but it has come up quite a bit, though non-ASD girls are also affected so it might not just be neurodiversity driving this.

Thank you. I will keep searching. (Should develop the habit to save interesting links when I find them!)

There was this recent clip on Triggernometry, maybe it's her and you can Google around her name/story to find the article.

Pretty sure I know the one you mean... I'll try and find it now...

Apologies, I'm drawing a blank. I thought I had put a link to it in my list of useful info.
If it's the one I'm thinking of it's incredibly powerful and I'm kicking myself that I didn't keep the link.
It's got a graphic on the front with an " " abstract art" style photo from memory. Not that that helps you! Sorry OP. Hopefully someone will send the link 🤞🤞

Thank you @BonfireLady I am frustrated not to be able to find it because I think it would be very helpful for my relatives. Will keep searching and post link if I find it.

I'll keep searching too. I very much need that one in my library of stuff.
I have a few other things that I've found helpful and I've also written an article myself. I know it's not what you're specifically looking for but happy to put links in here if that would be helpful?

@BonfireLady yes, please! Any links would be helpful!

No problem. I'll have a look at everything I've got later and send anything that's not already on here.

Hi @Inamuddle36 this is what I have on autism and gender identity in my library of stuff (I'm still kicking my that I didn't save that article 🤦‍♀️):

This one is from a Christian publication (I'm not religious) but there is no religious angle in it and I found it valuable as a viewpoint to understand the autism/gender identity overlap:

https://crisismagazine.com/opinion/autism-transgendered-movement

The Tavistock reported that 35% of referrals were autistic. From the Tavistock's own clinical team, this figure is 48% if those who have autistic presentations traits (validated unofficially by the clinicians, who are experts in psychology) are included:

https://repository.tavistockandportman.ac.uk/1910/

Resources, including a really helpful pdf, on autism and gender identity:

https://www.transgendertrend.com/autism-gender-identity-introduction/

This is my and my daughter's story about how difficult it is to have an understanding of autism and gender conflation recognised in the medical profession (there is a whole extra story behind the EHCP, which is just a footnote in here):

https://www.transgendertrend.com/teenage-gender-identity-crisis/

Also, this is my theory from my own research and working through stuff with my daughter:

A resistance to change - your own body changing is the ultimate betrayal. How dare my body do this? It must need fixing.

Sensory - boobs feel weird in clothing. They get in the way. I don't need them.

Sensory - Periods are awful. What's the point in having them. I don't want children anyway.

Androgyny - Many autistic girls don't see any point in the impracticality of skirts, dresses, sequins, hair accessories etc. I like wearing "boys' clothes"

Anxiety/low self-esteem/being bullied for being a "weirdo".... and...

Social media combined with Be Kind - there is community out there that is calling me in. They don't bully me. They understand me and I can find my people here.

Exiting girlhood - girls are weak. If I was stronger I could stop those bullies.

Obsession/fixation/locked in thinking - There is an answer! I must be a boy! It is the only logical explanation. I'm not going to change my mind. I'm determined.

The bias in the medical and mental health professions - let's start by affirming your identity and take it one step at a time. Change your name, change your pronouns... Not feeling better yet? OK, let's bind your breasts. Still not feeling any better and your breasts are now getting bigger... OK, let's put you on puberty blockers to give you some time to think and pause your physical development before you feel any worse... Still no better? Have some hormones. Still no better and you've got back pain from all the binding...? Well, "top surgery" is your answer. Check out all these happy cool people who are posting photos of themselves with their surgery scars. Do you want to feel like that too? Instead of: let's explore why you're feeling at odds with your body.. and how that might link to your wider mental health issues and experiences.

Hope that helps. In the meantime, I'll keep my fingers crossed for both of us that someone can recognise and send the article you originally asked for 🤞🤞

@BonfireLady thank you for the helpful links!! The Crisis one has a link to this article https://4thwavenow.com/2016/05/06/social-work-prof-speaks-out-on-behalf-of-her-ftm-autistic-daughter/. which also is interesting.

Thank you also for sharing examples from your observations of your daughter. What you describe coincides very closely with observations we have made of my relative (“we” being I and the adolescent’s parents).
Many thanks!

Dr Az Hakeem who has extensive experience working with groups of trans patients said that those with ASD were more likely to be happy with their transition as they believe that as they are dressed like and act like the sex they want to be and people call them by the correct pronouns, that they are genuinely that sex and are accepted as such.

@NewDogOwner was it also Dr Az who said that because ASD prople might really believe they are the other sex because people are using opposite sex pronouns, they can't comprehend/have a melt down when people still recognise them as their real sex because they don't understand some people say things just to be polite?

You're welcome.

That is a fantastic article. It lays out the issues really clearly. It's also heartbreaking at the same time 😞
I'm going to add it to my library of stuff right now before I forget!

My view is that we really need to raise the volume of the autism part of the discussion. It impacts such a significant proportion of the cohort of gender-questioning adolescents who are making life-altering choices under "gender affirming care".

@NewDogOwner I should imagine that many of those people are still in a "locked-in" way of thinking. I should imagine that the "gender euphoria" period that many detransitioners report could be longer for an autistic person because of this. Also, it would be important to understand how long a period of time has passed between them transitioning and the question being asked about whether they are happy with or regret their decision.

I'd be interested to read some direct quotes or articles from this Dr. I've never heard of Dr Az before.

At this stage, from the bits I've read above, there are red flags everywhere and it sounds like this Dr shouldn't be allowed anywhere near autistic people.
However, I reserve judgement as I've not read anything directly from Dr Az.

I’m not sure about the article/essay but sounds like Laura Becker. She definitely has ASD

I follow her on Twitter @FunkGodArtist

Could it be part of this site?
https://post-trans.com/

Yes, it was. He believes that a lot of the vitriol we see from TRA is autistic meltdown. He also said that people with ASD as very strict with rules and need other people to follow the,; they act like policeman so will police other people's behaviour. This also leads to them bringing legal action against people.

He was interviewed on the podcast Gender: a wider lens. He is very insightful. He is the only person to have had therapy groups with groups of trans people.

Thank you for the helpful suggestions. Lots of interesting articles on the post-trans site and Laura Becker’s various posts are interesting, too.
I have found this story which is similar to what I read previously (but not as detailed): https://4w.pub/autism-puberty-gender-dysphoria-view-from-an-autistic-desisted-woman/

Ahhhhhhhhh. That makes more sense. I hadn't understood what you had been saying. Probably me reading it too fast. Also I tend to be over-sensitive about the conflation of gender identity and autism because of it being twisted around the wrong way (causality-wise) in almost every aspect of the information that is published by the medical and autism bodies.

OK. That's a very interesting perspective.
Yes, that would make sense. Having been on the receiving end of many an autistic meltdown myself, they tend to come from a fight or flight response to a challenge in the "logic" that my daughter holds in her head as true. I don't mean gender specially here, I mean anything. There is a (contested) type of autism called PDA. Pathological Demand Avoidance. Which is where a seemingly innocent statement or request can be perceived as something that will cause harm. For example, being asked to put your shoes on because it's time to go out can result in and inner turmoil of belief that something is going to go wrong when you go out because it went wrong last time, therefore this request must be resisted at all costs. The root of the response is the instinct to survive. The chance of a PDA response being triggered will also depend on the baseline level of anxiety that the autistic person is experiencing at the time. So the same request to put on shoes on a different day may not get the meltdown.

As far as I'm aware, the root of why PDA is contested is because many psychiatrists argue that it's a presentation in all autism at times. It is currently all under the same diagnosis of ASD.

But yes, if autistic TRAs are already feeling highly anxious and agitated, it's not going to take much to trigger a meltdown response.