Guardian Interview Christine Mboma

[NotBadConsidering]

Is taking oestrogen to suppress testosterone and admits it’s having no impact on performance, still just as quick.

This is the problem with silly rules. Everyone knows lowering testosterone doesn’t remove male advantage, the athlete and coach admit it too, but is eligible to be back in women’s sport in just 3 months’ time and will be eligible for the Olympics next year.

Are you paying attention Lord Coe?😡

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/aug/17/i-know-i-can-run-as-fast-christine-mboma-on-the-medical-minefield-of-world-athletics-dsd-ruling

I don't understand why 'she' isn't competing in the men's category - the article says that 'she' has XY chromosomes.

I fell down a little Internet rabbit hole after reading that, searching for info on DSDs. Many articles state that people like Christine are female, then go on to say they have XY chromosomes, internal testes and are sensitive to testosterone. Which sort of begs the question of how female is being defined. AFAB seems to be the answer.

From what I've read and heard on the radio (amazing Dr, forgot her name but spoken about on these boards) I don't see how this is any different to the doping scandals over the years. Nations go out, looking for vulnerable people who can be exploited for "national glory" via sporting achievements, but it's all just a big con isn't it? Bottom line, it's easier for a man to run faster than a woman, doesn't mean they will always be fastest, but it's certainly an advantage that should not exist if there is such a thing as male and female categories.

Mboma is 100% male in every way that matters for sport. Having under-developed external genitalia does not make a male female.

AFAB is technically incorrect but originated from DSDs before being co-opted by trans. There is still no “assignment”. It should really be incorrectly observed to be female based on external genital appearance and registered as such in error. Wordy, but more accurate!

And yes, there is a suspicion that certain organisations are seeking out these people to achieve athletic success that otherwise wouldn’t be possible.

13 DSD athletes according to that article. I wonder what percentage of the population are elite athletes, and what percentage have DSD. And whether statistically a person with DSD is more likely to be a (female) athlete .

Interesting that the tone of the article is much more neutral than usual. Lets the interviewees make the points with minimal comment. Points like:

“I can say I have been taking the [testosterone-lowering] medication and it’s had no impact. I know I can run as fast as before even with it.
And

there is no historic scientific data we can use anywhere for this.
And

“It’s crazy – it has had no negative effect,”
And that photo of Semenya! Usually these articles show ambiguous or 'flattering' photos.

Interesting that I didn’t read it as neutral! It’s reads like “Poor Mboma having to sit out the World Championships because of discriminatory rules. And look! It’s pointless having to take medication because it doesn’t work anyway!”

I think the author isn’t smart enough to realise the truth is damning there.

I wonder why they didn’t deal with this at the same time that they dealt with the trans issue. I’m sure one of the sporting bodies made a rule that said nobody who had gone through a testosterone fuelled puberty was eligible for female competition. This covers both men with a womanly identity and androgenised DSD individuals.

Many articles state that people like Christine are female, then go on to say they have XY chromosomes, internal testes and are sensitive to testosterone. Which sort of begs the question of how female is being defined. AFAB seems to be the answer.

Yes you often see trans activists referring to these athletes as “cis women”. I guess in their ideology where everyone is “assigned” a sex that assignation becomes a permanent fact whereas in reality this person was probably wrongly observed to be female and at some point it became clear that they were male.

There's a mass of discussion about DSD and sports on this board. Discussions about Mboma in 2021.

https://www.mumsnet.com/search?query=Mboma&date=custom

More generally, material here about the Olympics, competitions DSD/VSD/CAIS.

https://www.mumsnet.com/search?query=DSD+CAIS&date=custom&topics[0]=Feminism%3A+Sex+%26+gender+discussions

There's a lot more information, it's just tricky to find on MN.