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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Scheme to give Barbie dolls to primary school children

234 replies

ArabeIIaScott · 21/07/2023 09:18

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/21/scheme-to-give-barbie-dolls-to-150000-children-is-alarming/

'Primary school scheme is ‘gender stereotyping’ and ‘stealth marketing’ by Mattel, experts say'

'Mattell's "Barbie School of Friendship" programme, in which free dolls are given for children to carry out role play exercises, has been rolled out to 700 schools across the UK, "with the potential to reach more than 150,000 pupils", according to the company.'

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20230720/Mattel-accused-of-stealth-marketing-after-giving-away-free-Barbie-dolls-to-schools.aspx

'experts have criticized the programme, raising questions about potential negative effects of Barbie dolls in terms of gender stereotyping, questioning the use of research to justify the programme, and asking whether companies should be able to freely market their products through schools."The project makes me suspicious that it may be exploitative", said Philippa Perry'

Scheme to give Barbie dolls to 150,000 children is ‘alarming’

Primary school scheme is ‘gender stereotyping’ and ‘stealth marketing’ by Mattel, experts say

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/21/scheme-to-give-barbie-dolls-to-150000-children-is-alarming

OP posts:
Thread gallery
20
Rudderneck · 21/07/2023 16:45

IsleofDen · 21/07/2023 13:29

I see the issues with the traditional Barbie doll, but honestly so few children are capable of imaginative play now (to the point that teachers and TA’s have pointed it out to me) that any help for this should be appreciated.

I’d probably feel more comfortable with playmobile or something similar, but given that they aren’t offering free toys and schools are literally skint, the point is pretty moot.

I am with you on the imaginative play issue. When I was working in schools a few years ago, part of what I did involved having children create a story or narrative, and we used play to get things moving. Many had a lot of trouble when they were much older than you'd expect.

Playmobile is funny. Part of why adults feel it is healthier is that it is more abstract looking, but for kids, I think they don't read quite as "real" people, and not quite adults either.

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 16:47

Screamingabdabz · 21/07/2023 16:12

My mother literally used to ask the hairdresser to cut my hair into a “paige boy” style. I hated it.

I’m sure there were plenty of girls that liked climbing trees, having short hair and dressing in brown. I didn’t. And lots of other girls didn’t.

This is the whole point of Barbie - a lot of the misogyny that feminine women encounter is actually from other women that sneer at beauty aesthetics and ‘bimbo’ insults. You’re not a superior type of female because you have short hair, play sport and don’t like make up. Other types of women exist - ones that are ok with dresses and lipstick and still have brains, qualifications, families and professional jobs.

But being feminineine does not necessarily equate with pink plastic toys and Barbie dolls.to my mind that is just a consumer version of femininity.

Being 'feminine'can mean liking to nurture your teddy bear or tuck it up into bed; or liking pair bonding types of play.

By the way, I personally wear skirts most of the time because that is what suits my body shape. If i had a slimmer more androgynous figure I'd wear very different clothes to the ones I do. That is because I am very conscious of aesthetics; love beaitiful objects, design, and like my home to be comfortable and so on. I appreciate beauty. I also contribute to an almost exclusively male soecialist interest forum which focuses on urbanism and architecture.
I reckon they see many see as having a 'feminine' sensibility.

Critiquing Disney, Barbie and american consumer culture is not to suggest I am a better feminist than you. I don't even call myself a feminist anymore, actually. I'm just interested in women's isues - naturally.

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 16:47

BinturongsSmellOfPopcorn · 21/07/2023 13:57

They may be more varied but I'm still not seeing a single physically achievable body. Even a catwalk director would send all of those to a doctor to be checked for eating disorders.

Try following my link. Barbie comes in petite, curvy and plus size and none of them have giant fake titties any more.

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 16:49

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 15:38

Before the Barbie craziness this pink -princess obsession just wasn't a thing, though. American consumer culture packaged up gender and sold it to people in the form of expensive plastic toys and hyper stereotyped role models.
Mattel and Disney.

In the 1970's girls didn't wear pink, toy aisles were not segregated in the way they are now - there was far more uni-sex styles of clothing and girls often had short hair..

What? That’s not the 1970s childhood I remember at all.

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 16:51

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 16:49

What? That’s not the 1970s childhood I remember at all.

What was your experience?

Iwasafool · 21/07/2023 16:51

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 16:49

What? That’s not the 1970s childhood I remember at all.

I was a mother in the 70s and it isn't how I remember it either except girls with short hair wasn't unusual.

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 16:52

Iwasafool · 21/07/2023 16:51

I was a mother in the 70s and it isn't how I remember it either except girls with short hair wasn't unusual.

How do you recall it, then?

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 17:00

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 15:58

I grew up during the 1970's; played netball, rounders, rode my bike, climbed trees, made dens, constructed cities out of lego; had short hair; enjoyed school; did well; went to an all girls grammar school - continued with sport; and being aspirational was encouraged.

Things changed in the early 1980's - and that was down to the arrival of American style consumer culture and the corportate culture. It was very marked.

Well, I also grew up in the 1970s and

  • wasn’t allowed to wear trousers or shorts only dresses and skirts.
  • wasnt allowed a boy haircut
  • I had the bad old blonde Barbies plus one dark haired Barbie that my blonde Barbie would bully.
  • wasn’t allowed boy toys like lego
  • couldn’t join the Boy Scouts, so made do with girl guides which Red Cross certified me in infant care, infant and child CPR and babysitting along with teaching me skills like more sewing and crafting. None of the fun stuff the boys got to do.
  • wasnt allowed to take wood/metal shop classes with the boys- was forced to take home economics which was sewing and cooking class
  • wasnt allowed to do football, rugby or netball as those were boy sports
  • was told university wasn’t for me, but rather marriage, babies and maybe if I’m lucky a job at the village co-op because girls don’t need to earn a living but boys do,
and so on. And yes. Many of my non uniform skirts and dresses were pink or floral. Every Easter we had a brand new frilly dress for church and it was like a mini princess dress for each girl.
Iwasafool · 21/07/2023 17:01

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 16:52

How do you recall it, then?

I recall my sons having chopper bikes in dark colours and their girl cousins having pink bikes with a basket for their "shopping." My sons wanted guns, Jedi swords and to play football/cricket/rugby and their girl cousins wanted baby dolls and dancing lessons.

Girls definitely wore pink, not all the time but pink was popular for girls.

Iwasafool · 21/07/2023 17:06

Oh and First Holy Communion dresses were very elaborate for little girls at Catholic schools. The boys would basically wear school uniform, if they didn't have a smart blazer the nuns would lend one but the girls needed a big white dress, tiara on their head, nice white gloves as obviously girls had to have clean hands and if their mother wasn't too strict the little 7 year olds loved glittery shoes with heels.

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 17:07

Iwasafool · 21/07/2023 17:01

I recall my sons having chopper bikes in dark colours and their girl cousins having pink bikes with a basket for their "shopping." My sons wanted guns, Jedi swords and to play football/cricket/rugby and their girl cousins wanted baby dolls and dancing lessons.

Girls definitely wore pink, not all the time but pink was popular for girls.

I remember this too. Blue is my favourite colour but there was no girl bike in the colour blue and no way could my parents allow me a boy bike with a banana seat or in the BMX style. No it had to be a girl cruiser type bike (yes with the stupid white plastic basket, big tinkly bell and tassels on the handles). I had to settle for a light pinky-purple Raleigh girls bike as that was closest I could get to blue.

We also still did the maypole dances on May Day so much of my girlhood included dressing in long white dresses, hair in braids, flowers in my hair skipping round a May pole both to practice every week and on May Day itself where one of us might be the May Queen (there are set patterns you weave and we girls were all taught the dances to weave those patterns with our ribbons).

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 17:10

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 17:00

Well, I also grew up in the 1970s and

  • wasn’t allowed to wear trousers or shorts only dresses and skirts.
  • wasnt allowed a boy haircut
  • I had the bad old blonde Barbies plus one dark haired Barbie that my blonde Barbie would bully.
  • wasn’t allowed boy toys like lego
  • couldn’t join the Boy Scouts, so made do with girl guides which Red Cross certified me in infant care, infant and child CPR and babysitting along with teaching me skills like more sewing and crafting. None of the fun stuff the boys got to do.
  • wasnt allowed to take wood/metal shop classes with the boys- was forced to take home economics which was sewing and cooking class
  • wasnt allowed to do football, rugby or netball as those were boy sports
  • was told university wasn’t for me, but rather marriage, babies and maybe if I’m lucky a job at the village co-op because girls don’t need to earn a living but boys do,
and so on. And yes. Many of my non uniform skirts and dresses were pink or floral. Every Easter we had a brand new frilly dress for church and it was like a mini princess dress for each girl.

Wow! Were you brought up in avery traditional or religious household?
There were so many 1970's fashions that involved trousers for girls and lots of girls had shortv hair styles were i grew up - that was perfectly normal.

Netball was a boy sport? I can't ever recall that. My junior school must have been very progressive for its time because it even had a girls' football team - though I never took to it, and ended up instinctively catching the ball, rather than kicking it. Boys certainly didn't do netball; they did cricket; although we all played rounders.

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 17:16

Iwasafool · 21/07/2023 17:01

I recall my sons having chopper bikes in dark colours and their girl cousins having pink bikes with a basket for their "shopping." My sons wanted guns, Jedi swords and to play football/cricket/rugby and their girl cousins wanted baby dolls and dancing lessons.

Girls definitely wore pink, not all the time but pink was popular for girls.

Yes, boys have always tended towards swords and guns - they still do. They'll even create one where none exists - out of a stick they find in the woods or wherever.

I certainly wasn't one for dolls as a child, though I did have a Tippy Tumbles. I had a red bike - no shopping basket. My parents did not impose lots of gender onto me , though I think many working class families do more readily impose gendered roles and streotypes - and still do.

I imagine upper class aristocraic girls also had more obvious gendered codes of conduct imposed upon them - and still do.

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 17:18

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 17:10

Wow! Were you brought up in avery traditional or religious household?
There were so many 1970's fashions that involved trousers for girls and lots of girls had shortv hair styles were i grew up - that was perfectly normal.

Netball was a boy sport? I can't ever recall that. My junior school must have been very progressive for its time because it even had a girls' football team - though I never took to it, and ended up instinctively catching the ball, rather than kicking it. Boys certainly didn't do netball; they did cricket; although we all played rounders.

Yes I was in a traditional and religious household in a rural area. But my family was not more traditional or religious than the larger village. In fact, we are Black so we were consciously blending in as much as we could to integrate into British culture. I think though that this pressure also meant my parents were afraid for us to be a hair different or trend setting.

anyolddinosaur · 21/07/2023 17:19

Barbie may be less sexual fantasy than she used to be but most barbies are still almost anorexic with short hair while all the Kens I've seen have short hair. And when the kids google barbie they'll find porn sites.

Btw I have donated a lot to my local primary - mainly books, pens, pencils, erasers, animal shaped pencil sharpeners. Imaginative play can be drawing your ideal home and family, making up stories, creating a junk masterpiece, building a den, having animal toy battles - doesn't have to involve playing with dolls at all.

Iwasafool · 21/07/2023 17:42

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 17:16

Yes, boys have always tended towards swords and guns - they still do. They'll even create one where none exists - out of a stick they find in the woods or wherever.

I certainly wasn't one for dolls as a child, though I did have a Tippy Tumbles. I had a red bike - no shopping basket. My parents did not impose lots of gender onto me , though I think many working class families do more readily impose gendered roles and streotypes - and still do.

I imagine upper class aristocraic girls also had more obvious gendered codes of conduct imposed upon them - and still do.

I was a child in the 50s and my favourite toy was my Zorro sword/mask/cloak outfit. No one batted an eyelid at a little girl in that sort of outfit. I think the 50s was less concerned about pink and sparkly than the 70s was.

Dontsparethehorses · 21/07/2023 17:46

We received some in September (long before movie hype) we got Ken and barbie dolls, whole range of physical disabilities and skin colours. I was really impressed and have used them to normalise disability and discuss issues of race with small children in a very white small primary school

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 17:57

Dontsparethehorses · 21/07/2023 17:46

We received some in September (long before movie hype) we got Ken and barbie dolls, whole range of physical disabilities and skin colours. I was really impressed and have used them to normalise disability and discuss issues of race with small children in a very white small primary school

Yes, in the right hands (like yours), these sets could be really good for primary school teaching.

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 18:13

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 17:18

Yes I was in a traditional and religious household in a rural area. But my family was not more traditional or religious than the larger village. In fact, we are Black so we were consciously blending in as much as we could to integrate into British culture. I think though that this pressure also meant my parents were afraid for us to be a hair different or trend setting.

A lot of pressure to conform to the culture then, and to be 'respectable'? Tht must have been tough, and also a lot to carry as a child.

SinnerBoy · 21/07/2023 18:14

HadalyEve · Today 17:00

wasnt allowed to take wood/metal shop classes with the boys- was forced to take home economics which was sewing and cooking class

I went to high school at the age of 11, in 1981. The first term, boys did Home Economics and the girls did woodwork. I'd say that 80% of both cohorts were disappointed!

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 18:17

Iwasafool · 21/07/2023 17:42

I was a child in the 50s and my favourite toy was my Zorro sword/mask/cloak outfit. No one batted an eyelid at a little girl in that sort of outfit. I think the 50s was less concerned about pink and sparkly than the 70s was.

The main glitter and sparkles I recall from the 70's were those of glam rock.

Iwasafool · 21/07/2023 18:20

SinnerBoy · 21/07/2023 18:14

HadalyEve · Today 17:00

wasnt allowed to take wood/metal shop classes with the boys- was forced to take home economics which was sewing and cooking class

I went to high school at the age of 11, in 1981. The first term, boys did Home Economics and the girls did woodwork. I'd say that 80% of both cohorts were disappointed!

That reminds me of my sons at a boys school, the Head told us the boys did cookery/sewing/ironing and it was called Bachelor Survival rather than domestic science.

HadalyEve · 21/07/2023 18:24

RebelliousCow · 21/07/2023 18:13

A lot of pressure to conform to the culture then, and to be 'respectable'? Tht must have been tough, and also a lot to carry as a child.

Yes, you’ve got it in one. I suppose there are as many girlhoods as there are women when it comes to the past.

AliceMcK · 21/07/2023 18:29

Boiledbeetle · 21/07/2023 09:22

Just what schools need lots of plastic Barbie dolls! Id have Hated that as a kid. But then I hated dolls full stop

But a can of Coke would have been gratefully received!

Haha I’m with you, I hated dolls especially barbie growing up but would have loved a can of coke 😂

I have 3 girls who have and do play with dolls and Barbie which I grudgingly bought, I much prefer to watch them play with dolls than watch them sitting on their tablets all day which they would happily do if I didn’t stop them. My youngest has loads of Barbie dolls and accessories, she will spend hours playing with them and uses her imagination.

I don’t see anything wrong with this, my DDs school already have Barbie dolls anyway.

Riapia · 21/07/2023 18:53

All over the country there will be MN mums waiting at school gates ready to snatch the dolls out of the hands of their sobbing children.

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