25 years on, how Viagra changed sex for older women forever

[IwantToRetire]

... there is another side to this story, one that is hardly ever told. It’s wonderful that Viagra allowed hordes of men to have sex once more, but who were they having sex with? What about the people, primarily women, who suddenly found themselves on the receiving end of their lover’s rejuvenated todger? Were they equally as excited that their partner could perform at the drop of a pill?

... In the story of Viagra, women really are the silent partners, and this bothers me.
Not only are their voices absent from almost all the early marketing and advertising around Viagra, but they are also missing from the voluminous research into the treatment of erectile dysfunction that launched it in the 90s, and after. This research is almost all about the penis. When the experience of partners is referenced, it’s usually to confirm that penetrative sex took place and to get them to rate the hardness of the penis in question once the pill has been popped.

... its primary demographic has always been the older gentleman who found his erection has decided to retire as well. No surprises there, but what this also means is that there is a hell of a lot of older women out there who potentially found themselves press-ganged into service aboard the SS Viagra.

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/foreplay-vanished-viagra-changed-sex-older-women-forever-2478126 ( you will have to create an account, ie your email to read this)

And before anyone jumps in saying why is this on "sex and Gender" it is because this is actually the Feminism and Women's Rights forum and this is an example of how medicine, like so much else, is based on what men think is important.

If you copy and paste the link into 12 Foot Ladder, you can read it. I'm not sure if my post will be hidden if I post the link so I'll put it in the next comment.
https://12ft.io

https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Finews.co.uk%2Fopinion%2Fforeplay-vanished-viagra-changed-sex-older-women-forever-2478126

Of more interest to me is the problem of vaginal atrophy, especially as HRT was stopped when I was going through the menopause. No-one seems bothered to research this. And Viagra isn't that good.

From the article:

And just as older men experience sexual dysfunction, so too do older women, and there was no blue pill on offer to help with that.

The menopause brings with it a whole host of physical changes that can impact sexual function. Your libido can crash through the floor, your vagina may become a husk of its former self, and even if none of this happens, sex changes as we get older. How many women who were quite happy with where their sex lives were suddenly found themselves dealing with a partner and his shiny new hard-on?

According to Potts’s research, quite a few. Many of the women she spoke to hadn’t had penetrative sex for a number of years and the renewed sexual activity caused them pelvic pain, UTIs, and repeated bouts of thrush. Worse, some women reported feeling pressured to have sex with their partner, so they didn’t “waste a pill”.
One participant said: “Sometimes there was no discussion about whether… the sex act was going to take place, so it would be… ‘I’ve taken the pill, OK, let’s go’. And this pissed me off because it meant that [sex] seemed to be a given: ‘I’ve taken the pill, let’s f**k.'” Despite the physical success of the drug, most of the voices in the study paint a very mixed picture of life with a resurrected erection.

Other women reported that the arrival of Viagra had signalled the end of foreplay, which they had rather been enjoying. One participant lamented: “After 20-odd years of marriage, foreplay is one of those things that goes by the way. However I was trying to maintain that this was, you know, quite an important part of making love, so when Viagra came along the whole foreplay thing just vanished. I mean it wasn’t even a suggestion, it was: “OK, I’ve taken the pill, we’ve got about an hour, I expect you in that time to be acquiescent.” Little wonder that Viagra has been cited in countless divorces since its launch.

Yes, Viagra has helped millions of couples have sex, but it is important to acknowledge that it is not always a welcome addition to a relationship.

And before anyone jumps in saying why is this on "sex and Gender" it is because this is actually the Feminism and Women's Rights forum and this is an example of how medicine, like so much else, is based on what men think is important.

And UK government policy apparently. In the book “Why Women Are Poorer Than Men” the author points out that the NHS’s budget for viagra was higher than the budget for healthy food for impoverished families. I can’t remember the precise example without looking it up, so would need to check the exact details.

It's a good point. Also consider the reluctance of GPs to prescribe HRT for many women even where they're in vulval and vaginal pain - and that it's almost impossible to get them to give testosterone to help women's libidos. Yet viagra seems to be handed out like smarties

the NHS’s budget for viagra was higher than the budget for healthy food for impoverished families

It seems unbelievable, but totally in line with male values that still dictate so much of what happens even in health.

And without looking for the link, does anyone remember when it was revealed that more women died from heart attacks because the male symptoms were supposed to be the norm, but in fact women's are different.

Not forgetting PPE made to fit men but not women.

But the viagra one seems so much about male entitlement ie no thought to who the female partner might be or what her experience might be. Just about the man getting his erection. But some might say that is all sex is to men, about their needs!

I'm very blase about Viagra, largely because I think coming to terms with normal ageing is generally positive.

But as far as the effect on women, I tend to think as many would regard more sex as a positive as would a negative. Anyone who has ever lived or worked in a seniors home where the seniors are relativly mobile knows that the women in that age bracket have some pretty hot competition for the men, who are fewer in numbers. Senior are one of the groups with the highest rates of STIs.

Within individual relationships, the only answer to unbalanced libido, as with so many other things, is to communicate and be gracious to each other.

It was actually acknowledged at the time of Viagra launch that this sudden return in interest in sex in one half of a relationship could cause issues for their (presumed female) partners, but it wasn’t as headline grabbing as the “stiffy in a jiffy” jokes. The clinical trials were only to generate safety and efficacy days on the drug itself as that’s what drives the license, so no measure was made on the social impact on relationships. It was a failed drug for heart problems that was found to work much better in other parts of the body, it wasn’t the result of research into male sexuality.

It’s easy to forget what a total game changer it was at launch, and introduced a whole new language to the general public (erectile dysfunction instead of impotence etc). It was also tested on women too with low libido but those trials didn’t show any benefit.

having said all of that, I would heartily agree that the default patient is still male and drugs to effectively treat female conditions such as endometriosis are a much lower priority - not necessarily because of the scientists doing the research but because the people paying for the drugs don’t see it as a priority. Because they are majority male too.

It helps endometriosis pain, doesn’t it? Viagra? Or it would if they researched it, it’s in criado Perez’s book, I think

Is it not the case that at present (and since 1998?) viagra is only available on the NHS to men with certain conditions (or treatments thereof) that cause ED - such as prostate cancer and neurological diseases??

Yes, I had to see a consultant privately to get started on HRT for VA and GPs won’t let you stay on HRT for more than 5 years. The pessaries are horribly messy and dilators are grim.
Its particularly a problem when you’ve had children via C-sections!

I remember my DSIL mentioning that the later years of life were natures way of giving women a rest (from sex) however this is not always the case!

was it Germaine Greer who wrote many women are happier with no sex, than bad sex?

I thought that it was available on the NHS to men who had ED caused by diabetes type 2 and/or obesity?

The British National Formulary lists the specific medical conditions where sildenafil can be prescribed for ED. (Viagra as such isn't available on the NHS).

I can't get hold of the BNF list - the Northern Ireland Formulary, which presumably reflects the BNF, includes diabetes but not obesity.

At work we've noticed quite an increase in men 80+ and even 90+ being prescribed sildenafil/Tadalafil.
My first thought is "the poor wives".

I have challenged about 2 GPs and 2 gynaecologists with the following long question (which I may create a separate post about) -

Why is is that every day in this country, teenage girls, who haven't even stopped developing yet, are provided with the contraceptive pill? It's not difficult to get and it is often suggested for a variety of ailments by GPs. The hormones they are prescribed as synthetic versions that are not risk free to take. They also completely stop ovulation.

Yet, women who are adamant that they are in peri-menopause, or even in menopause are treated as if they have asked for radioactive material when they ask to try HRT. HRT is also hormones and you can get regulated bio-identical hormones as well which are a closer match or identical to a woman's own hormones (unlike the contraceptive stuff). They are used in many cases to simply top-up a woman's existing hormones, not completely replace them and stop ovulation as in the pill.

You know what? All of them got a bit flustered when I asked them that and could not give me a decent answer.

The reason is likely because the government wants to stop teen pregnancy, which is related to women's wellbeing of course, but has more to do with economics and savings to the public purse. HRT......well......no one seems to really give a fuck about older women, who apparently have lost their minds when they too ask for hormones.

@EarthSight couldn't agree more. GPs untrained in meno. Still vaguely harking back to the flawed research. And govt disappears its HRT tsar by the back door after months and every woman on it can't rely on anything being available. It's a scandal...that only affects invisible older women.

I'm in my 30s and unfortunately I never thought I'd be in a position to say it affects me too. Some of it was due diligence because of my age, but some of it was just pure ignorance and lack of logic.

Sorry you're going through this crap decades earlier than you should @EarthSight

no one seems to really give a fuck about older women

wait till your told that as you are no longer a productive member of society you wont make the waiting list for a preventative procedure.