DS is buying oestrogen off the internet

[Snowinsummer]

What do I do? DS told us at Christmas that he was trans (it had never come up previously).

He is on the spectrum & easily influenced.

He has had a friendship at uni with a trans man who is 20 years older.

I have always been gender critical & he knows this.

Tonight he has told us he's bought oestrogen off the internet from the Ukraine, as he doesn't want to wait for the NHS.

I am so upset & sick & feel like asking him to move out.

He has just graduated but has come home for a year before potentially starting a masters and he has a job in a coffee shop starting tomorrow.

Has anyone been through this & can offer some advice?

Injecting oestrogen is nuts. Women (the biological ones) who are using HRT either use gel, or patches, or take tablets. We do not inject ourselves with oestrogen, and definitely do not buy oestrogen off some dodgy internet site, even when your preferred brand of patches or gel is like hen's teeth!

I am SO glad that you have encouraged him to hand you the phials and not inject this stuff - he doesn't know what it is! Leaving aside the whole transitioning stuff, it's madness to inject anything without medical advice.

I hope you can encourage him to research all the negative consequences of these treatments. In fact, I think we should always google any medicine or treatment we are prescribed so as not to be surprised if things go wrong.

We all know that the mantra of ‘have a trans child rather than a dead child’ is abhorrent.
You still have a granddaughter as no one can change sex, no matter what drugs or surgery they take / have done to themselves. What a shame no one thought to investigate more thoroughly why a young woman felt the need to change her body so much.
Most common sense parents would do their damned to prevent their child falling down the path of gender ideology.

Soontobe60
Until you've experienced it don't even think you're entitled to express that opinion.

Of course she is entitled to express that opinion. I have experieenced that situation and it seems a pretty reasonable opinion to me.

We are all entitled to express our opinions. We are all entitled to not like other people’s opinions. I know enough detransitioners to be able to base my opinions on facts.

If Mumsnet had been round 50 or 60 years ago there would have been a similar discussion about people knowing they were gay from an early age.

For God's sake don't beat someone up for mourning a grandchild's future that has changed. I get it@llangennith
I have been called a trabsphobe and worse for fighting for my DD. I have lost friends, family and neighbours. Everyone has opinion and until you know this ideology you have little understanding. You are dammed if you question anything and it hadcost me my job and my home as I couldn't work. I needed to be there 24/7. We are not out of the woods but there is light. I hope your DGC has just socially transitioned. This is what TW do in the main. Very few have surgery. It's just a myth to control and feed political ideals.
My DD has two mtf friends. Neither want surgery just to wear dresses and make up. Most trans people are not diveants. They also don't want to use female loos just third spaces. Most new buildings have them.

https://www.bayswatersupport.org.uk/
This group have local meetings if you want IRL support

@llangennith No, because being gay , or as we would have said then, homosexual or lesbian is a real thing. It means that you have a sexual and emotional preference for people of your own sex. This preference can be fulfilled , emotionally and sexually, without having to take drugs, chop bits of your body off, attempt to graft non functioning and inappropriate features onto your body. It does not require other people to make any adjustments to their accurate perceptions of reality, however lovely or tolerant they may be.

BTW, I think you have an inaccurate timescale for acceptance of homosexuality. It was pretty much okay when I was at school, and that was fifty years ago.

This doesn't prove anything about transgenderism.

If Mumsnet had been around 80 years ago there would have been similar discussion about treating unhappy people with lobotomies.

If Mumsnet had been around 2,000 years ago there would have been similar discussion about young people choosing Christianity.

There are increasingly frequent discussions on here about the desirability of killing chronically ill or old people.

Unless your point was about the value of Mumsnet as a discussion forum, you have made no point at all.

I am autistic myself and sometimes wonder if telling a teen that their gender “dysphoria” is due to autism will make them dig their heels in more.

Because there’s no treatment for being autistic. And it doesn’t matter how much autism positivity there is now (superpower etc) - if you’re struggling, none of that means anything - IME it just makes you feel even worse about yourself because you aren’t achieving what some autistic people have (eg celebrities who have been diagnosed, amazing scientists etc).

It’s really difficult knowing that what you feel - not fitting in etc - isn’t going to go away because it’s just how your brain is wired. Made worse by the black and white thinking/lack of executive function to envisage how to work through bad feelings etc. It’s no wonder they reach for hormones as it’s presented as a cure for what they’re feeling.

It will be. That is Lena of Ukraine's stuff, who is notorious. There are pictures floating around on the internet of vials with hairs in.

An autistic person who transitions still is not going to fit in, though. Transition just means not fitting in with a different sex group.

50 years ago people were aware that there were health risks attached to male homosexuality (aids was not well known but there are other health risks ) but there was very much a "if you havent tried it, dont knock it" mentality. People were far more tolerant than they are now. Homosexuals did not seek to remove rights from other people, did not seek to prevent others holding the view that it was wrong, did not gaslight people and insist on biological impossibility, were not increasingly violent to those who disagreed with them. Not the same thing at all. This is more like anorexia - poor body image leading to deliberate self-harm. Anorexics try to tell other people they are fat when they are not.

It probably is legit. People who want cheap fertility treatments often get injectable estrogen from similar sources. Some countries even have excellent quality control & cottage industries in this. I imagine drugs from Ukraine etc would be coming from well known consultants and surrogacy / fertility clinics.

www.amazon.co.uk/My-Child-Trans-Guide-Parents-ebook/dp/B0C5Q276C2/ref=nodl_?dplnkId=19caae39-71b5-4de1-8d5d-bd5afd95b83b

Sorry, book not available yet. This podcast might be helpful:

podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/gender-a-wider-lens-podcast/id1542655295?i=1000621125790

And other resources from Stella and Sasha.

Transwomen mostly take their oestrogen in pill form.

Injections or gels are only prescribed for transwomen over the age of 35 or who have known heart problems.

It's transmen who take their testosterone by IM injection.

All that to say you honestly do not know what the hell it is he's ordered and plans to put in his body. Forget the whole transition thing for the moment, he's an adult....but you cannot have him storing or taking those drugs in your house.

You did the right thing OP if he's determined to go this route then he's going to have to move out.

An autistic person who transitions still is not going to fit in, though. Transition just means not fitting in with a different sex group.

Absolutely. Talk about false hope 😩

Why would the pack be empty then? Sounds like he is the one taking them. Did he explain the empty pack? Is the "friend" coming over every day and taking a pill? Sorry, sounds like crap.

I know, but as he isn't living at home, I can't really check. It was an old packet & I can't get to talk to his dp on his own. I'm housebound & can't go to his flat as it's on the top floor & I can't climb the stairs if I could get there. I've tried to look for signs but he is still shaving, his voice hasn't changed, he has always not been a typical male shape, he has always had hips & because he is chunky, he has man boobs. He is autistic & that is the big worry.

Has your son been watching trans porn OP?

Oestrogen doesn't change male voices. Only testosterone given to natal females does that (it grows the larynx).
Any voice changes you hear in transwomen are either through vocal training, or from them consciously altering their voices to a higher register to sound more feminine.
Oestrogen has no effect on the larynx.
If he is not taking androgen blockers in addition to the oestrogen, then he will still be producing testosterone and therefore needing to shave etc.