Sex (I.e gender) as a statement on an equality policy. I want to challenge it.

hannahwaddinghamsbiceps · 2023-07-04T06:42:11+00:00

Hi all. NHS trust equality and diversity policy has the phrase ' sex (I.e gender)' on its list of protected characteristics. Given that i.e means "that is" and sex is a protected characteristic and gender is not ( plus one is a fact and one is a feeling) I want to email the head of E&D to point this out. However it would be an email with my name on, to someone more senior than me. Who's whole job is based around getting this stuff right. Except I don't think he is on this point. Any suggestions for clever wording.? I notice the other protected characteristics don't seem to need an explanation, clarification or qualification on the list.

tourdefrance · 04/07/2023 07:46

They are using the correct word (sex) but feeling it needs explained for people who are used to seeing gender. Is it free text or 2 options only? If the latter I would leave it.

My HR mandatory interview training listed gender as a protected characteristic. I queried this, saying it was sex in the Equality Act and they said they’d have to check with the EDI lead!

Theeyeballsinthesky · 04/07/2023 07:49

sex And gender are not the same & organisations can’t go around unilaterally changing the words of acts of Parliament

There’s no qualifier in the equality act so I can’t see why they need one here

TeenDivided · 04/07/2023 07:49

This may not be appropriate in your situation, but I'd start with politely confused.

Dear <Head of whoever>

I was reading the EDI policy (found here) and I found this statement ..........

This doesn't seem very clear to me and I am sure others will be confused too. My understanding is that the protected characteristic is sex, and that these days gender is considered to be something different - for example people can change gender but not sex, some people think there are 72+ genders (link) etc. Is this not your understanding?

Would it not be clearer for all involved for the EDI policy to just read .....

<could also add> I feel it is important that our trust is clear on such matters and clearly follows the law as otherwise we could find ourselves open to legal claims of discrimination.

Kind regards

Zimunya · 04/07/2023 07:53

Love @TeenDivided’s email. Gender reassignment is a protected characteristic, but gender beliefs are not. Big difference. He is conflating two issues (perhaps deliberately?)

The 9 protected characteristics are: age, disability, gender reassignment, marriage and civil partnership, pregnancy and maternity, race, religion or belief, sex, and sexual orientation.

tanstaafl · 04/07/2023 08:00

Second @TeenDivided response.

Chersfrozenface · 04/07/2023 08:02

The Equality and Human Rights Commission explains the term 'sex' in the EA as below
https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/advice-and-guidance/what-equality-act-says-about-protected-characteristics-sex-and-gender

You can point out that the term 'gender' is now divorced from biological sex in many people's usage and even in dictionary definitions - e.g. Collins English Dictionary's definition "The state of being male or female as expressed by social or cultural distinctions and differences, rather than biological ones".

It is therefore incorrect to use the abbreviation "i.e." thus claiming that 'gender' has the same meaning as 'sex:, because it does not

The correct protected characteristic is 'sex' and that means biological sex as explained by the EHRC.

(It might also be worth contacting Sex Matters through their website to give them this example of obfuscation around the protected characteristic of sex in the EA.)

What the Equality Act says about the protected characteristics of sex and gender reassignment | Equality and Human Rights Commission

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/advice-and-guidance/what-equality-act-says-about-protected-characteristics-sex-and-gender

TeenDivided · 04/07/2023 09:08

I'd start with light touch as above, and then if needed follow up with more facts / assertiveness.

eg

Following my email of xxx I still haven't received a response / Thank you for your response to my email, however I'm still think our policy is wrong / confusing.

Since I first contacted you I have done some further reading. I have found <this> and <this> and <this> . I cannot see how our policy is clear / conforms with legislation. I really feel this needs a further review taking the above information into account.

sashh · 04/07/2023 09:14

Dear X,

I think there is a typo in the E and D policy. Sex' is a protected characteristic, so is 'gender reassignment' but tis isn't clear.

Thank you

OP

I emailed the head of equality and Diversity at my council this morning, the 'code of conduct for councilors'.

Before 9.00 am I received this reply

thankyou for bringing this to my attention .

I will certainly act upon this immediately and look to amend the code of conduct.

If you would like to meet me to discuss further – I am more than happy to do so.

I was quite shocked but pleased.

BinturongsSmellOfPopcorn · 04/07/2023 09:15

I think it's ta important to emphasise the possibility of confusion. Gender reassignment is a protected characteristic in ita own right. So including the word gender in the separate protected characteristic of sex makes it harder to understand which they're talking about. Which could lead to inadvertent discrimination, errors in choosing correct comparators etc.

Original poster

hannahwaddinghamsbiceps · 04/07/2023 09:44

Thanks everyone for your very helpful responses. I will impose an email and let you know how I get on.
It frustrates me that the E&D department need to be made to get their facts right. It's their job to know this stuff!

OP posts:

Original poster

hannahwaddinghamsbiceps · 04/07/2023 09:44

Compose! Not impose!!

OP posts:

Codlingmoths · 04/07/2023 09:48

I don’t think I’d do this. It says sex. Gender is widely understood to mean the same thing by a large chunk of the population and even when they understand gender identity as a separate thing people still use gender interchangeably with sex, a usage that predates the current gender soup world we live in. Anyone responding could easily do something like pull up a hundred examples and say we do use the legal wording but we like our policies to be easily readable by all our staff. I think you’d be flagged as a pedantic trouble maker to be honest.

FannyCann · 04/07/2023 09:54

It is a worry raising these issues with one's employer, and I know my trust will be ramping things up soon for certain reasons. Indeed, we have just been invited to add our pronouns to our emails (I won't be obviously but will be closely observing who does).
Being able to back things up helps.

As well as the nine protected characteristics there is the issue of sex based language and many trusts are going gender neutral, egged on by the Rainbow Badge initiative. Is your trust signed up do you know?

This FOI lists the 40 trusts that signed up in 2021 plus the ten in the initial pilot phase. I haven't seen a list for 2022/23 but you are sure to know if your trust is signed up as there will be plenty of rainbow signage.

I noticed a post on our intranet about people who get various gynaecological cancers and corrected the poster (an admin whose job is in communications and posting on the intranet) that only women could get these cancers. She did apologise and promise not to do it again!

FannyCann · 04/07/2023 09:54

Forgot the FOI link.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/cost offthe nhssrainbow badgee_pr

Forester1 · 04/07/2023 09:58

Codlingmoths · 04/07/2023 09:48

I don’t think I’d do this. It says sex. Gender is widely understood to mean the same thing by a large chunk of the population and even when they understand gender identity as a separate thing people still use gender interchangeably with sex, a usage that predates the current gender soup world we live in. Anyone responding could easily do something like pull up a hundred examples and say we do use the legal wording but we like our policies to be easily readable by all our staff. I think you’d be flagged as a pedantic trouble maker to be honest.

I don’t agree. This is the policy document so should be using correct language.

FannyCann · 04/07/2023 09:58

The other useful link, if you are not aware of it, is this paper OP.

Frontiers | Effective Communication About Pregnancy, Birth, Lactation, Breastfeeding and Newborn Care: The Importance of Sexed Language

www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fgwh.2022.818856/full

You will find plenty of quotable statements in here should you need to push back against gender neutral language. I keep a copy in my bag incase I need to back myself up at any time and hand out copies to certain people.

Delphin · 04/07/2023 10:00

"I don’t think I’d do this. It says sex. Gender is widely understood to mean the same thing"

In Germany people often say England when they mean UK. It's generally understood to mean the UK too, but in cases where it is important to know exactly what is meant, people will ask "do you actually mean England or Great Britain"? (which is still not entirely correct, but will be taken to mean "the UK").

It's the same here. Popular usage may be different, but documents that might be used as a basis for argumentation later on should be as clear as possible. In this case, the legal distinction between sex and gender should be observed.

Codlingmoths · 04/07/2023 10:01

Forester1 · 04/07/2023 09:58

I don’t agree. This is the policy document so should be using correct language.

Show quote history

I write policies and I would agree that I’d write it just referring to sex as more precise. I suppose to me though making this your complaint doesn’t necessarily put you in a good position to be listened to on bigger issues, I think whoever it’s sent to will probably dismiss it without a moments thought as pedantry.

AmuseBish · 04/07/2023 10:05

They can't say that sex and gender are the same thing, as trans people are people with one sex and a 'different' gender. So by saying they are the same, they are erasing trans people.

I think most people would agree that it is patently false to say that sex and gender are the same thing. Have they misunderstood what 'i.e.' means, perhaps?

lanadelgrey · 04/07/2023 10:06

It’s also an age thing - lots of references to ‘gender’ around pregnancy on the boards when obviously meaning sex and also American where gender has alway be used more widely. I think sex is coming back but after five years or more of stonewalling in various public bodies I think they are starting off by trying to clarify for those who were told sex didn’t matter or couldn’t be used

AmuseBish · 04/07/2023 10:07

The only other possibility is that they're clumsily trying to clarify that they mean sex of the body, not sex as in intercourse, although I have no idea how anyone could read that as a protected characteristic.

lifeinthelastlane · 04/07/2023 10:15

This is just wrong though.

Chersfrozenface · 04/07/2023 10:23

Well if it was a clumsy attempt to clarify the term 'sex' so people wouldn't think it meant 'sexual intercourse', they should instead have used the EHRC's wording "being a man or a woman".

Plus, how on earth could 'sexual intercourse' be a protected characteristic?

Given that this was in a list of protected characteristics.

AmuseBish · 04/07/2023 10:27

cher yeah, I dunno, I was trying to imagine what other reason they might need to stick 'i.e. gender' on the end of sex!

Chersfrozenface · 04/07/2023 10:43

AmuseBish · 04/07/2023 10:27

cher yeah, I dunno, I was trying to imagine what other reason they might need to stick 'i.e. gender' on the end of sex!

One might think it was yet another attempt to claim that 'gender' in its latest sense, that is, gender identity, is the protected characteristic, rather than biological sex. Having been told that repeatedly by trans activists and proponents of Stonewall law

Possibly