Tavistock patient feels like experiment gone wrong..

[Lightningstrikess]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/06/20/tavistock-transgender-patient-mastectomy-regret/

The Telegraph are all over this too.

Chilling read. Well done to the Telegraph.

I don’t subscribe so can’t read the full article but that poor, poor girl.

Every single adult who abdicated their responsibility to say “let’s slow down and look at why you might be feeling like this, and then explore all the options that might help you feel better” and instead fast-tracked these children - CHILDREN - into extreme body modification surgery is culpable.

@HarpyValley how the hell was this ever allowed to happen? Trans children have no protection.

Copy the link into printfriendly.com and you’ll get the text (doesn’t work for Times links as far as I remember but there are share tokens for those).

One thing that’s really disturbing about cases like Jasmine in that article is the speed with which the gender clinics discharge detransitioners. These are people who need support and follow-up at least as much as they ever did.

Agree. This is an absolute scandal. And what about that poor boy (trans girl) who said they just wanted to have kids and live a normal life. Has no one told him he will now probably never have kids?

That poor child.

It is appalling to say to a distraught 15 year old 'well you wanted this' or that it's ok she is now struggling with distress and bitter regret, because most other kids will be happy afterwards.

These children are proving the point that they cannot consent to this. We cannot listen to those shouting about 'we must do this because if it saves even one life/we must listen' when they just dismiss saving the ones saying inconvenient things without the faintest compassion or interest. It was the attitude of the TQ+ lobby towards detransitioners that convinced me of the utter irresponsibility of the movement.

Archived here:
https://archive.fo/c6v0F

@manontroppo thank you for doing this, I could read the article but other mns couldn't.

It is interesting to compare with my situation when I enquired about sterilisation after I had my second child.

I was 34. In a marriage of over a decade. Had two children. (One of each sex.) For both births I had haemorrhaged - one so badly that my life was at risk.

I was told sterilisation was not appropriate as the “risk of regret was too high”.

And yet we allow 15 year olds to take drugs that could have implications for future fertility.

@Mumoftwoinprimary this is what needs to be highlighted more & more. How was this allowed happen to this child? A child. Yet you were 34 & it was completely your choice if you had wanted it yet was deemed inappropriate due to the risk of regret.. I think personally that the rush to trans children surgically is that they want to capture them in the earliest stages before the child gets the chance to evolve & grow out of whatever phase it's going through. So scary. Then there is also the fact that this is a billion pound industry which you count all the different companies,
"experts", hospitals & phamacutical companies making money. They need to catch them as early as possible. Frightening.

It is appalling to say to a distraught 15 year old 'well you wanted this' or that it's ok she is now struggling with distress and bitter regret, because most other kids will be happy afterwards.

This has been one of my biggest bugbears with this whole scandal. We know 85% of gender-questioning children will reconcile with their birth sex IF they are supported with watchful waiting. There is not - and no apparent desire to work towards, which speaks volumes in itself - any diagnostic test which can identify which are the 15% who will remain unhappy in their sexed body and who may, as adults, benefit from more radical physical interventions. But the TRA method is to trans them all anyway and to hell with the detranistioners.

I have said all along that it is unethical, abhorrent and a medical scandal to have fast-tracked so many children onto a medical pathway which has a high chance of removing their future capabilities to have children, to breastfeed, to have a fulfilling sex life, and which could have serious and lifelong adverse effects upon their general health, without even a robust way of differentiating between the children who will grow up to be transgender and the vast majority who would not.

"In June, NHS England published a new interim specification for gender services for young people. It said that, from now on: “Puberty blockers will not be made routinely available outside of research” and “the primary intervention for children and young people who are assessed as suitable for the [new] service is … psychological support and intervention”."

This gives me hope that we are moving in a better direction with the new provision, even if the cynical side of me thinks the new clinics will probably employ all the ex-Tavi staff.

What do we reckon are the chances that the interim specification will survive the advent of a Labour government after the next general election, as seems likely?

If you’ve worked in healthcare you know 100% drs are experimenting, esp surgeons.

The threshold for striking off is high, they aren’t going to get struck off.

I think what is also being neglected in all this (it's something I saw Hannah Barnes touch on in an interview) is that gender dysphoria is a perfectly normal stage of early adolescent brain development. It's known that different parts of the brain develop at different rates (it's why teenagers as a group are more prone to risk taking behaviour than everyone else, which is why they do so much daft stuff). The feelings of gender dysphoria are another thing caused by this. The fix, obviously, is puberty, because the hormones cause the maturation of the brain, so when all the parts catch up, the feeling usually goes away. Feelings are just nerve pathways firing in the brain. Teenage brains aren't fully wired yet, therefore some of the pathways are missing a few steps and create odd or difficult feelings.

One key thing Barnes said is that when you put children on 'puberty blockers' (I hate that euphemism), and stop the normal hormone cascade, you stop the very thing that would cause the distressing feelings to abate, which is brain development. There's a theory that that's why so many children put on puberty blockers then go on to cross sex hormones. It's not a harmless 'pause' or watchful waiting at all. It locks children into those feelings by preventing their brain from growing out of them.

@MadamPickle that is such an interesting post & exactly why they are desperate to transition kids so quickly so they can't grow out of their feelings..
If you see all the comments about the teens identifying as animals the comments & psychiatric advice is they'll grow out of it & it's a phase. Why is this logic not applied to kids who are currently identifying as the opposite sex.

I have a concern which is even more specific than that. Phrasing this very carefully:

If you took your child to an eating disorders clinic and found that a significant number of the staff were themselves obsessive undereaters and overexercisers, would you be happy they were able to provide appropriate therapy for your child?

If you went to a smoking cessation clinic and found that a significant number of the staff were chain smokers who don't accept that smoking is a health problem, would you be happy to have them treat you?

I was very surprised to learn that some of the therapists working at GIDS are themselves trans or nonbinary. Wouldn't that, at a minimum, put a bit of a constraint on the conversation?

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g that is a very good point and I didn't realise that was the case. It does concern me that these people will just be redeployed because they're the only people with anything looking like "relevant work experience" so their CVs will be top of the pile.
@Chersfrozenface Hmm yeah slim to none. I don't know who I want to win less at the next election anymore, they're all awful options as far as I can see.