ITV News 21 June: "Conversion therapy ban awaiting PM’s sign-off"

[ResisterRex]

Saying "If the prime minister gives his sign off the earliest sight of the bill is likely to be next week, but this is not certain".

Let's see

www.itv.com/news/2023-06-21/conversion-therapy-ban-awaiting-pms-sign-off

"ITV News understands that a draft bill ending the harmful practice was sent to Rishi Sunak earlier this week.

He is now considering the exact wording of the bill before giving the Equalities Office permission to proceed."

And:

"ITV News understands that the draft bill will cover conversion therapy which either attempts to change someone’s sexuality or gender identity.

The latter has proven to be the more controversial element, with some MPs concerned that a ban could prevent parents, teachers and other adults from sensibly discussing gender identity with a child who is feeling conflicted.

Ultimately it will be up to the prime minister to decide the final wording, but campaigners are already concerned about a major loophole in the bill.

ITV News has been told that a consent clause has been inserted, meaning that conversion therapy could still be legal if someone volunteers for it.

The bill would only outlaw conversion therapy which has been forced upon an individual."

If someone wants to detransition or become celebrate and talk to people about that, it should be their right to live as they choose, a "community" as I know most have no interest , can't cling into to people who want to leave.

I don't want myself or family converted into Queer Gender identity ideology by public servants, I hope that is included.

Paul Brand has tweeted the same story, but with this text in the tweet:

twitter.com/paulbranditv/status/1676868010131292161?s=46&t=WHoOZ_3Kv5G6-FyQuvE0LQ

"NEW: The long-promised ban on conversion therapy has now spent two weeks in Rishi Sunak’s red box (as well as five years being formulated).

Campaigners tell me they believe No10 has “lost its appetite” and some want to wait for a potential Labour govt."

Stonewall on the Paul Brand tweet:

twitter.com/stonewalluk/status/1676930727340908544?s=46&t=WHoOZ_3Kv5G6-FyQuvE0LQ

"We have not and will not give up hope.

Every day this Bill is delayed, more LGBTQ+ people suffer abuse. This cannot go on.

There's still time for @ RishiSunak to save lives. We're calling on him to make good on his promise to the LGBTQ+ community and #BanConversionTherapy."

Maybe he's saving it up so he can announce his brave inaction just before the next GE.

Would it be unfair of me to notice that the government appears willing to find time to push this bill through Parliament before the election, even though it still seems unclear how it might affect counselling for children confused about their sex or gender, and yet from what I hear, they seem unable to find an opportunity to clarify the definition of 'sex' in the Equality Act?

If you're a Christian adult and you want religious counselling for your sexual feelings, then go for it. Whether it "works" or not is irrelevant. People should be free to try to modify or constrain their sexuality.

Paul Brand pushing it through again.

There are so many conflicts of interests with him, he is patron of the gay rights charity Just Like Us and his husband is a senior civil servant in the government.

Yes. They are fence sitting it out.
They need to poo or get off the pot.

Given some people say MAP (i.e. paedophilia) is a sexual orientation, will therapy that seeks to stop people who feel this way acting on it / stop them feeling this way be conversion therapy under this bill? Because that seems bad.

If the government finds the time to present this bill, even before the full report on the Tavistock comes out, and even though there is still, I believe, no definition of conversion therapy, and if women asking for a clarification of an existing law are told we'll have to wait until next parliament (when they probably won't be in power anyway) then I won't see it as fence sitting. I will see it as deciding where your priorities lie.

Sunak knows the ban is wrong, for all the reasons we do. He's just such a weak politician, and tbh weak as a man, that he'd rather say nothing, do nothing, sit on his thumbs, and pass the hot potato to Starmer, than demonstrate a flash of principle, and speak up against it.

Starmer has ideological issues, but Sunak has no such excuse. Right now, I'm ashamed and embarrassed about this govt, as someone who's always been a conservative.

To be fair I have never voted Conservative and had no intention of doing so. But they could have made it hard for me to stick to that.

https://www.stonewall.org.uk/about-us/news/which-countries-have-already-banned-conversion-therapy

A number of countries have already banned conversion therapy(including gender identity) and the sky hasn't fallen down.

As of Apr 2022 this includes:
Brazil, Samoa, Fiji, Taiwan, Ecuador, Malta, Germany, Spain, Australia, France, NZ, USA(20 states), Canada

Countries considering or in the process of implementing a ban:
Ireland, Israel, Norway, Denmark and Finland.

That the countries haven't collapsed hardly tells you whether it's a good idea or not.

When it comes to gender identity, I would say it's just wrong in principle, because the best thing in theory is if children can accept their biological sex and be cured of gender dysphoria. We should still be researching if it's possible to increase the number of children that recover.

When it comes to homosexuality, it's an unnecessary infringement on religious freedom, to be telling consenting adults what they can or can't do.

We've already got a worrying number of regretful detransitioners, this makes it much worse.

I've heard horrifying stories about the lack of talking therapy in the US.

And what do you call changing the sex of a gay person? That sounds a lot like conversion therapy to me.

Yeah, not being able to take your kid to a therapist in Canada, for fear they will facilitate socially contagious illnesses and delusions, isn't actually that great.

Anyway - as far as I can see, these bills are just bad legislation all around. It's already illegal to do most of the stuff we associate with forced therapy. Professional organizations already don't support this stuf.

It's virtue signaling type law and that's pretty invariably bad law, and always a waste o time.

Reportedly, the bill is to be delayed

inews.co.uk/news/politics/rishi-sunak-forced-to-delay-hs2-law-and-six-other-bills-until-at-least-2024-2464083