Heads should stop teachers allowing children to identify as cats, says No 10

[IwantToRetire]

The spokesman said that teachers should not teach “contested opinions as facts” and called for headteachers to intervene in extreme cases.

“It would not be right to comment on the actions of a specific individual or a specific school without knowing the full details, but we understand why these reports will be concerning for parents,” the spokesman said.

“In broad terms, teachers have a responsibility to encourage their students to engage respectfully with those they disagree with.

“They should also not be teaching contested opinions as fact, shutting down valid discussions and debates.

“It’s important parents and carers are reassured that children aren’t being influenced by personal views of those teaching them. Any example that strays from this would be wrong and we would expect headteachers to act.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/06/20/rye-college-children-neo-pronouns-cats-moons-rishi-sunak/

Unlike the headline the article makes it clear that a "spokesman" (how old fashioned and sexist shouldn't that be spokesperson?!) has said this so Sunak may or may not have a public opinion about this ...

But the Telegraph seems to be keen to keep the issue of self identifying on their front pages.

When I first heard about children doing this I thought (hoped) that it was younger children making fun of the trans generation, but seems not.

NB article is behind a paywall but can be read at https://archive.ph by entering the Telegraph URL above into the box.

(The cat in picture below looks very cross. Probably feels the same way GC women feel - outraged at the notion that some young human could in any way know or speak with experience based knowledge about being a cat!)

You think I'm a TRA? 😂

So it’s alright to shout at your pupils, tell them that you think they should find another school and that they are ‘despicable’ , even though the basis for your opinion is your incorrect understanding of the issue.

But do you have the same attitude to marking ? ‘ oh I misunderstood, I thought 2+ 2 = 5, it’s complex…. But I still think you should go to another school because you seem to insist on 2+2 = 4’

I would hope that with the growing information about trans issues, whether cats or “changing” sex, that schools would be keeping as up to date as possible, as their pupils future health/rights are at stake.
The fact that they’re not is horrifying.
The language being accepted like “cis” is Orwellian newspeak, no one should be accepting it. Look into its roots. Look into queer theory - schools should be the bastions of sense here. I despair that they were so easily sold to the alter of Stonewall.

I was replying to @HipTightOnions , but if you are happily complying with TRA manifestos you might as well be.
You’re certainly not doing anything to protect vulnerable students, or on a wider scale the dismantling of women’s rights.

I’m not meaning you personally, but the education system that’s enabling this to happen, along with other organisations.

The pride about those girls astounds me. I'd be ashamed if mine bullied like that. I genuinely don't get it.

Its not pride, but its recognising that pupils are being told by pupils they must deny what they know to be true, ie that there are only 2 sexes.

Why aren't you worried that children are being bullied by adults into lying because one child is being validated at the expense of everyone else.

This is Emporer's New Clothes reality.

I would expect a teacher not to require childre to lie, not to threaten them when they maintain their right to speak the truth.

Of course it is a worry that a child has been led to believe they can "identify" out of their sex by assuming socially constructed gender norms, but it is totally wrong to expect everybody else to play along with that indiviudalistic view of the world. No dout the child was upseet. But that was only because they had been told a lie (about changing sex) and now someone was making them aware they had been lied to.

And in fact it is interesting that children are interpreting this lie about being able to identify out of reality, as meaning they have been given permission to identify out of their human reality into an animal one.

What a shame there aren't lessons in schools about biological reality but that as we are now living in the 21st century in a "free" country nobody of any age has to be caged by the gender stereotypes that society tries to impose.

I would have thought it could be a really interesting lesson to get children to look at what they think is true about being male or female, and how much is just odl fashioned bigotry.

"Happily complying with TRA manifestos"

Not a fucking clue what you're talking about.

My 'thing' is generally pointing out that the government are constantly dropping teachers in the shit.

This time it's because they've made it mandatory for schools to teach gender identity, not specified what they meant by that, recommended Stonewall as a source of info and are now getting VERY CROSS that teachers are doing it wrong.

And this teacher has also been a lightning rod for abuse from shitty people like Laurence Fox and his ilk because of the whole cat thing which now turns out to have been not true.

Which part of being pissed off about that makes me a TRA?

I genuinely still don't get it and am not trying to be inflammatory. I know I'm in the minority on this post. If someone wants to identify as someone from the opposite sex, so what? What is a TRA?

The PP who is a teacher - I agree. Sounds like teachers have been put in a difficult position.

Not bullying though is it, to just disagree with someone, even if it upsets them.

I didn't say bullying.

This time it's because they've made it mandatory for schools to teach gender identity

For the third time, noblegiraffe, we are not required to "teach gender identity". We are required to teach about gender identity - the facts and the law.

We can and should challenge any demands to teach this ideology as if it were fact. It isn't always easy to do so, but we are supposed to be intelligent adults.

No one knows the conversation before the recording started.

Based on the recording alone, even if no cat involved, the teacher dealt with it badly

So therefore it makes the teacher even worse. She bullied those girls over nothing.

@noblegiraffe I’m sorry, I hadn’t meant it to come across like that.

It’s worrying to me that guidelines are followed when they’re so clearly spreading an agenda that is not good for children.

My youngest is autistic and has spent his life identifying as one thing or other. As parents we can allow him to enjoy his hyper focus, but with a tight level of reality.
His school, whilst being pastorally amazing for autistic children, has a dreadful track record of going blindly along with the trans agenda (the political aim of making it true and legal that humans can change sex, when it clearly isn’t true at all) to the detriment of trans pupils (one pupil had clear sex abuse red flags from the start of her time at the school, but because she identified as a boy everyone involved was confused, including CAMHS, and the disturbing behaviour was dismissed as “he” is exploring “his” sexuality (at 11??). This continued until the child decided she was no longer a boy and moved school, where she is finally being helped.
This is one case where I know the family personally. This is the tip of the iceberg of children being let down because of the double standards around trans anything.

As a mother to a vulnerable child I’m horrified that any school would ever go along with any of this. We know that the vast, vast majority of transitioning girls are autistic, or abused, or are looked after children, or have a history of abuse, this is public knowledge, and I can’t understand why so many schools are still denying this and still following guidelines. From a parents point of view I can’t get my head round the apathy. I don’t understand how the majority of teachers aren’t standing up and saying “hang on a minute…”, when in so many cases they’re just sitting by, letting it happen. There are known cases where teachers are TRAs. We know enough now to say that the whole rotten thing should have no place in schools, but because it’s such a political hot potato and so many are sitting by doing nothing, saying nothing, here we are.

For the third time, noblegiraffe, we are not required to "teach gender identity". We are required to teach about gender identity - the facts and the law.

When I say 'teach gender identity' I mean as a teaching topic. Like teach WWII or Pythagoras.

But when they say that young people may be discovering their gender identity, what facts do you think they mean?

And when they recommend Stonewall, what facts do you think they mean?

Upsetting another pupil isn't "nothing". That's why statements were needed to be written. Saying that if you're not cisgender you're weird is also not "nothing".

I am not defending the teacher's tone, words or the way she dealt with the pupils. But trying to make out that the teacher just randomly picked on two girls to have a go at for no reason is unfair.

We all feel sorry for that kid. How they came to decide on whatever identity they chose, and who enabled it, is what is being criticised here - along with the teacher's response, the idiocy that brought us to this point, and the coercion of other pupils to go along with it.

How do you know she was bullied?

The recording is from when no one else was present, no one knows what was said beforehand.

But when they say that young people may be discovering their gender identity, what facts do you think they mean?

And when they recommend Stonewall, what facts do you think they mean?

Honestly, I don't think they know what they mean.

I do know that I was able to challenge my school's dreadful PSHE lessons by referring each line against the guidance.

Sex is a spectrum - not a fact.
Everyone has a gender identity - not a fact.
You must affirm people's gender - not a fact.
And so on.

Now we teach:
Sex is binary - fact.
You can't change sex - fact.
Gender dysphoria exists - fact.
Some people believe they have a gender identity - fact.
Etc.

Do you this was a change for the better?

People have identified with the opposite sex for years - why is someone to blame? What difference does it make?
The bullying thing was the teacher said they'd really upset them. They called her a weirdo or mental or something.

You don’t know this. No one knows the conversation before the recording.

Even the teacher mis represented it when she said asylum.

You have to hear the recording to know

But trying to make out that the teacher just randomly picked on two girls to have a go at for no reason is unfair.

Again another misrepresentation. Forget the cat. She didn't randomlly pick on 2 girls. She tried to get 2 girls who were brave enough to assert the reality of biological sex and bully them for stating these facts.

ie a teacher deliberately threaten 2 young women for speaking the truth because she has been Stonewalled and seems to think everybody else should play along with this unicorn fantasy.

She should have said you are entitled to your beliefs. And then, maybe talked about how to navigate that fact that another pupil has a belief set that is challenged by what they are saying.

I am not sure why you feel unable to acknowledge that the teacher is enforcing a scientifically incorrect opinion on 2 of her pupils, and then telling them they shouldn't be in the school for not believing in the trans narrative.

People with religious beliefs hear others say they dont belief in religion. They dont have a fainting fit, and the thought police dont move in and tell those who dont believe in religion you shouldn't say that because it upsets people.

Over and above the actual facts, this certainly isn't helping these young women grow up in a way that will allow them to survive in a world made up of numerous different belief sets.

I dont know if what the teacher said is the agreed position of the school but either way it is unacceptable.

I know this gets dragged out but just think of the parallels with the case of Rachel Dolezal. If for some mad reason everybody had gone along with the notion that you can "identify" as another race, and schools were enforcing this as acceptable behaviour, the fact that two young women thought they had to challenge this notion, they would be praised.

What is it saying to young people that to fit in and be accepted you have to deny reality.

What sort of role model is this for children.

The recording showed the girls in such a good light on its own merit that people had to make stuff up about a cat. I'm sure those two girls are much less traumatised by not having to accept someone identifying as the opposite sex now. We can marginalise a marginalised group a bit more....except that doesn't sit comfortably with me....it seems nasty.

Saying that if you're not cisgender you're weird is also not "nothing".

"Cisgender" is disputed political language which has no place in schools.