Drag...

[CurlewKate]

I have an issue with drag. I accept that most people disagree with me, and it's completely main stream. All fine- I'm old and the world changes. But I need someone to explain something to me. There's a drag artist on Celebrity Masterchef. Their name is Cheryl Hole. How can this not be read as offensive to women? Am I missing something?

I was thinking it was more like 'share all hole'

God knows what they are thinking when they come up with the offensive pun names

Leaving aside the cultural appropriation and misogyny issues for a moment (not for good, because they are important) - why did/would this person go on a cooking show in character/costume in the first place? Were the other celebrity performers also dressed/in character as their characters? Would, for example, Suranne Jones come and cook dressed as Anne Lister? Or Andy Serkis as Gollum? Would Mila Kunis to stay offscreen and project a cartoon hologram of Meg Griffin? Those would be the equivalents, and some of them would make it very hard to cook safely.

Purely anecdotal: I used to bartend in the Castro (San Francisco) circa early-mid 1990s and we had drag acts perform most weekends (all queens; I don't think we ever had a king - how many kings get a fraction of the attention, exposure, and money even now?) They were/are professional performers, playing a character on stage. When I had to interact with them on business or even when they were having a drink after their sets, I dealt/chatted with (for example) "Matt Smith", not "Jayne Mansfeeled". When Matt stopped in on a day off with some friends, he didn't dress up as Jayne. And I'm sure he didn't wear Jayne's clothes and makeup or use those mannerisms and voice to, say, attend a parent-teacher conference or his sister's wedding or to take his books back to the library. It was (is) a job, not a lifestyle, let alone a full-time personal "identity". And certainly not reality.

As for the names - sure, Cheryl Hole could be a one-off or have another "inside joke" meaning or even be a real name. (I went to school with a Richard Head; it happens.) But it's part of a really obvious widespread pattern that still exists and is problematic even if this particular queen really is the child of Mr. & Mrs. Hole. Back in the '90s I do not remember the type of names we see now that refer overtly to sexual paraphilias or viciously attack and belittle women as a group/class. The '90s queens had fun names that often referred to their "queerness" (as understood at the time) or outsider origins, or with the idea of glamour and aesthetic/sartorial excess: Pollo del Mar, Holatta Tyme, Glamamore, Cookie Dough, Doris Dazed, Fauxnique.

If anything the Kings - those few that were around even if not getting to perform at choice venues - were a little raunchier: Dick Dejour, Rod Lancet, Alex U. Inn, Fudgie Frottage. I sometimes wonder if there's some false equivalence going on now among nonwomen and nonfeminists thinking that these newer super-sexual queen's names are the eqivalent and ignoring the impact of the structural and systemic power differential between men and women and the way it so drearily often colasces around and manifests itself through heterosexual sex and (the normalisation of) sexual violence.

StaunchMomma: Maybe it means bum hole because he's gay? Oh no you did NOT!!!! Think you're reaching to take offence here a little. Think you're reaching very hard to GIVE it. 🙄

Watching Lily Savage earlier on TOTP tonight and the difference between drag then and drag today is like night and day. Drag then had a bit more affection for women. Drag today is grotesque, from the clown makeup to the porn-based humor.

POG also said he wasn't a fan of the American Drag Race style of drag. Another shite bit of cultural imperialism.

Because Cheryl Mole makes no sense and isn't funny?

@onlyamam "Because Cheryl Mole makes no sense and isn't funny?"

And Cheryl Hole makes sense and is funny?

@KnickerlessParsons Why would it be unacceptable to wear an afro wig?

@RichardDrankMyCoke brilliant post 👏

What is funny about Cheryl Hole?

Racist, apparently. Like blackface. White people can't have corn rows either.
Womanface is ok though.

We know that!

But the use of the word 'hole' is transparently misogynistic. Drag has always relied on the use of words such as 'slapper', 'dog' and so on to refer to women - the same words which have been used to demean and oppress women forever.

Obviously the insinuation that this drag character is an easy lay, a right old slapper.....and so on.

It's cringe that whenever there is a drag queen on any of these programs they have to do it in full drag...massive wig & several inchs of make up ..etc in a professional kitchen. ..As if the character IS them and nobody would be able to cope with them in normal get up...this is kind of offensive in itself (although not what the op was alluding to) especially when i'm rarely aware of who the other slebs are & could do with a bit of guidance!! (although full disclosure if Michael Praed fancies donning his "hooded man" attire I won't be complaining...😁)

to be fair if I saw him in a caberet club as part of a drag version of girls aloud, I probably would think it was funny

on masterchef? no thanks

the BBC don't seem to be able to figure out that some entertainment is suitable for adults who have chosen to be in a venue, and some entertainment is suitable to be piped into the living rooms of people who are obliged by law to pay for it

I have sent my first BBC complaint in and hope others do too. https://www.bbc.co.uk/contact/complaints

I am so fucking cross - the tide has to turn soon doesn't it?

Can I suggest that any complaints address the incontrovertible misogyny of the name rather than the presence of a drag artist at all, which can obviously be explained under the umbrella of inclusivity.

Men caricaturing women can only be mainstream entertainment in a society where misogyny is a deeply ingrained part of the woodwork.

I had a reply to my complaint today. It spoke at length about diversity and the history of drag, and explained to me that "Hole" was a play on Cheryl Cole's name. It did not address my actual point-which was the blatant misogyny of the name. I have sent a follow up question.

Why do they always bang on about diversity. Where outside of night clubs (and kids libraries) does one encounter a drag act in their daily life? Why not have strippers and pole dancers too then?

Ridiculous isn't it. A drag queen could never create a "Red Indian squaw" character (I used the term "Red Indian squaw" here purposefully to reference the crude US/UK cultural construction not the actual indigenous cultures and peoples of America) because they'd be rightly called out on the racism, yet totally get a pass on the sexism. It really is a case of the fish can't see the water.

Out of interest are there any drag queens whose drag persona is a trans woman, or is this yet another time when everyone knows who the real women are when it comes to sexism and degradation?

(I'm half tempted to do it myself. I have some really good smutty puns on famous or infamous trans women's names in the Cheryl Hole tradition. Can't see how anyone who supports drag could object to that, in fact I'm kind of surprised no one is caling out the transphobic lack of trans drag characters!)

Yes.

It's even worse today as it is seen as a progressive social justice movement, and if you don't support it then you are not progressive.

Worth asking what and who it is that drag acts ridicule.

It's ridiculing the whole female sex that is the point of the acts, by the extreme parodies of how women might look made up, the extreme sexualisation of the outfits and, in some cases, the openly misogynist language. Women are expected to applaud this or be deemed bigoted.

I hate drag and always have.

I used to go to lesbian and gay clubs and pubs at the end of the 80s/early 90s and there's always been a nasty side to drag, I remember comments from drag queens about why were lesbians so ugly as well as the usual "fish" stuff. They were mostly really not funny in my experience, yet terribly pleased with themselves.