Richard O'Brien

[Ingenieur]

The Rocky Horror Picture Show was on telly last night and I found myself going back and looking at what Richard O'Brien has been up to recently.

www.theguardian.com/stage/2020/nov/05/richard-obrien-interview-rocky-horror-trans-crack-stroke-70s

I stumbled upon this article in the Guardian from 2020 and with all the sunlight that transgenderism has been getting recently, his thoughts are really refreshing.

His openness and inclusivity made it surprising when he remarked in 2016 that a trans woman “can’t be a woman. You can be an idea of a woman.” It felt like an inflexible statement from the man who in Rocky Horror preached the ultimate message of empowerment and self-actualisation: “Don’t dream it. Be it.”

Does he still hold that view on trans identity? “You and I have to be very careful here,” he says, sounding wary for the first time. “We’ve seen what’s been happening with JK Rowling. I think anybody who decides to take the huge step with a sex change deserves encouragement and a thumbs-up. As long as they’re happy and fulfilled, I applaud them to my very last day. But you can’t ever become a natural woman. I think that’s probably where Rowling is coming from. That’s as far as I’m going to go because people get upset if I have an opinion that doesn’t line up with theirs. They think I’m being mean-spirited and I don’t want that at all.” He came out as transgender comparatively recently, saying at the time “I believe myself probably to be about 70% male, 30% female … I think of myself as a third sex and it makes things easier.”

He seems to take a very sensible view on the reality of the issue, and extra love for him not throwing JKR under the bus.

Except there is no third sex.

I'm glad he isn't claiming that men can become women. I wish that he felt able to be himself fully, without having to claim the idea of a third sex. Actually, I don't even know if he'd claim that, rather all he's stating is that he thinks of himself as a third sex to ease his own mental health. I doubt whether he'd insist on anyone else agreeing with him on that.

I miss the days when blokes could be transvestites and stay out of my business. And any other woman's business.

@EamonsPalliativeCareTracksuit yes, there is indeed no third sex, but I think from the context of the article he doesn't appear to think he is literally a third sex, more that he thinks of himself as the idea of something in between...

@RoseslnTheHospital
Yes I agree it's a shame he doesn't feel comfortable expressing himself without resorting to the extra mental gymnastics.

Whilst I agree with him and applaud him for saying that TW cannot ever actually BE women, I dislike the "70% male...." bollocks, which is along the lines of Eddie Izzard saying they have both "girl and boy genetics"
Just say what you are. A man who enjoys feminine things.
Biologically male, no percentages involved.

I had a mild obsession with RHPS in my youth. It amuses me no end that Britain is called transphobic and yet gave the world Rocky Horror and Richard O Brien had a kind of national treasure status for a while.

I love his quote 'You can't be a woman, you can only be the idea of one'.

It also shows what pervasive bastards these gender stereotypes are that even Richard O Brien considers himself not all male. I'd like to think of RO'B as his own, unique kind of male, and all the better for it.

Gosh I watched it last night for the first time in years and I still love it. Things were much simpler then, its true. I never have got to the end of it though and I still dont know why! Imagine calling someone a sweet transvestite now 😃

He's still talking 70% sense, and in this day and age, I'll take it

He's still the best ever host of Crystal Maze. He must be well into his 80's now, if not his 90's, surely?

😂

I've read the whole thread through before realising I'd got Richard O'Brien confused with Richard Briars. I was picturing Tom from The Good Life in one of Margo's frocks

Brilliant - I can't unsee that now!

According to Wikipedia, "On 7 July 2012, aged 70, he proposed to Sabrina Graf, aged 35, a native of Germany, whom he had been dating for three years. They married on 6 April 2013 at their home in Katikati, Bay of Plenty."

Just another spicy straight by the looks of things?

Actually, I'm completely OK with this.

" I think of myself as a third sex"

And I think that's the crucial bit. He "thinks of himself". Because actually, we're not trying to stop people from thinking of themselves in whatever way they want, are we? That's the other side who are insistent that we accept their thoughts and feelings as fact.

I flipping love the fact he's backed up JKR and been explicit about the fact that you can't actually change sex. He doesn't believe he is ACTUALLY a third sex, he's just talking about how he views himself in his head.

He can think of himself as a sea lion, for all I care. As long as he's not actually claiming to be one - I think that's the important part.

And I guess - trying to see it from all sides, it must be strange if your identity in your head doesn't align with your biological sex. Maybe Richard thinking of himself as a "third sex" makes it easier for him to align everything. He knows there isn't actually a third sex - it's a fictitious entity that he embraces to live his life. I don't think there's much wrong with that, provided he's not quoted out of context.

Obviously, it would be a lot simpler and preferable if he just said I'm a man who likes to express himself in a gender non-conforming way. But I think that's roughly what he has said - just in a different way.

Interesting interview.

Tbh his position reminds me of (post all the ops) transexuals I knew about 20 years ago. They saw themselves as transwomen, not women. They would not have wanted to erase either their own transness, or the category of women.

I don't think modern trans ideology represents these people any more than liberal feminists do any good for feminist causes.

Agree.

It's rather like my friend who considers herself autistic. She has not had a formal diagnosis, but she is a much happier, calmer, fulfilled person since she came to this conclusion about herself. If she feels she needs a sensory break, she takes one. If she needs to ask to understand a social situation, she does. What she does not do is expect others to change what they do to accommodate her sensory needs, nor does she demand access to ASD-specific spaces or services.

This is true self-ID. Saying "This is how I feel about myself. This is my way of coping with life. This is about me, not you. This is my problem to deal with, not yours."