Big argument. Feeling horrible

[BlueIbex]

I've read here for months. I'm closeted GC and I know some will say I'm selfish for that but honestly I just can't burn bridges yet. Never posted before so please be gentle.

I just had an argument with my sibling. Our close relative died yesterday and the family are all gathering. We're all grieving and it's absolutely horrible - emotions already running very high.

A different relative was talking about how they read something about how young people shouldn't be encouraged to transition because when you're a teenager you're already questioning everything. My sibling, who works in a field related to LGBTQ+, got agitated and started talking about how all healthcare is transphobic, we have to trust that people know themselves, there are almost zero detransitioners.

I really, really tried not to engage. I know that's selfish. We're all grieving and everything is already completely shit and we just didn't need this.

Then she said that puberty blockers were a harmless pause on puberty and I couldn't let it sit. I (fairly calmly, I hope) tried to explain what I'd learnt about the medical damage of blockers...

It was like a bingo card. "Is it better to have a living person with osteoporosis by the time they're 30 or A DEAD SUICIDAL TRANS TEEN". "The medical sector is mainly transphobic." "The only children being put on puberty blockers at age 12 have known that they were trans since age 4 and their parents are supportive and that's AMAZING". I was attacking the sector they work in. I was completely uninformed.

My relative has gone to bed in tears and certain that I'm the biggest transphobe. Other relatives shouted at me for upsetting everyone and making the whole thing worse.

I'm sorry. I am ashamed to say I said oh I bow to your experience, you know better than me, I respect your expertise.

I just feel completely devastated and I'm already in bits from grief and now I've made everything worse. It feels like I'm a terrible person.

[Defiantlynot41]

Ah , the worst combination, deeply felt grief and strongly held beliefs mixed together.

Deepest condolences for your loss

[continentallentil]

so sorry for your loss. Emotions are bound to be running high.

Don’t beat yourself up or allow anyone else to. Your sibling sounds perhaps a little vulnerable / unbalanced themselves (?) which is perhaps why people directed their ire at you.

Get a good nights sleep, treat your sibling as normal in the am (if they are licking their wounds then give them room), if anyone has a go at you, just deflect and move away ‘no I wasn’t being insensitive, I made a perfectly normal comment’ and move away.

I hope the next few days go and well as they can. Get support from friends and leave the sibling / trans stuff be for now. Prioritise looking after yourself.

[Ereshkigalangcleg]

Sorry for your loss, I imagine there's an element of deflection of her grief in your sister's response, plus she's clearly very invested in the affirmative approach. Agree with the advice given,

[Circumferences]

Is she normally so histrionic?

[ILikeDungs]

Welcome, lurker. Similar experience but my sibling was not working in the field-- he is a transwoman. The whole death/aftermath was a complete and utter mess (and I did not shower myself in glory nor did my sibling who is very NPD) but really, when somebody elevates identity above the loss of a family member...well. Nuff said.

[ArseMenagerie]

You’re in the right. You are right in what you are saying. You know that.

Forgive yourself (and your relative) and accept that you disagree but that’s aOk. Because it honestly is - the two of you arguing over this isn’t changing anything so look for areas that you agree on.
probably: acceptance of trans people
a desire that people live freely
a support of young people
You’re coming from the same place: a desire to support vulnerable people.
sorry for your loss x

[dropthevipers]

@ArseMenagerie

You’re in the right. You are right in what you are saying. You know that.

Forgive yourself (and your relative) and accept that you disagree but that’s aOk. Because it honestly is - the two of you arguing over this isn’t changing anything so look for areas that you agree on.
probably: acceptance of trans people
a desire that people live freely
a support of young people
You’re coming from the same place: a desire to support vulnerable people.
sorry for your loss x

Uhm. They are not coming from the same place though, are they? The Kool aid drinker thinks anything other than full capitulation to the TWAW mantra (and all the puberty blockers, cross sex hormones, surgery etc. that come with it) is genocide. Bollocks to that.

[aweegc]

I'm impressed you stayed quiet at first, so give yourself a pat on the back about that. You also didn't bring the topic up, that was someone else.

Yes it turned into an argument, but the one who is crying was at least as much at fault, if not more. You offered a different opinion to hers and that's what started the argument, from how you describe it. You didn't go off on one first. But she pulled the "victim tears" and you're now the bad guy. So, note to self: be the first to cry and act like a less than grown up grown up and you "win".

Don't apologise to anybody for this. Don't be ashamed. Shit happens. She's supposed to be professionally allied to this and that's how she acts? I know you're all in shock and grieving, but you were able to keep quiet to start with, but not her? If you want to say anything, just say you found it hurtful, but you don't want to dwell on it. And then stop speaking. If they mention it more than once, then repeat it ad infinitum. And do not carry on with another sentence or gentle apology or anything. Full stop, mouth closed.

And don't worry about being called a transphobe: welcome to the clan..or coven 😉

[SelfPortraitWithHagstone]

Argh, OP, you are NOT a terrible person! Not on this evidence, anyway. Obviously we don't know whether you're sneaking out at night to steal vegetables from people's allotments and write rude words on lavatory walls, but absolutely nothing you have said here suggests that you are anything but thoughtful, sensible and kind.

As well as grieving, it sounds like you're negotiating the conflicting urges to speak up vs. keep quiet about all this stuff, which is hard at the best of times - I think it's pretty universal to worry about the best moment and way to speak out. But remember, on this occasion you didn't launch yourself recklessly into a rant out of nowhere, you kept schtum until you could not bear to hear any more lies go unchallenged, and then you spoke up. That's not a bad thing. You are not responsible for other people's feelings, only your own behaviour, and unless you can honestly say that you were unreasonable or unkind, you have nothing to be ashamed of. Your sibling (and probably your female socialisation) is trying to trick you into thinking that your current anxiety means you've transgressed social norms/family bonds/basic human kindness. You haven't. I suspect that what you're feeling (apart from grief, which must be overwhelming already) is the discomfort that comes in the aftermath of bravery, and it will feel horrible, and IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU'VE DONE ANYTHING WRONG.

I'm so sorry for your loss. Look after yourself. 💐

[ArabeIIaScott]

OP, I'm so sorry for your loss.

Sounds like everyone is a bit raw and sensitive at the moment. Of course you're not a terrible person, and neither is your relative - emotions run high and people say daft things.

Take it one day at a time and be extra gentle with yourself.

[BlueIbex]

Thank you all so much for your replies. It was so comforting when I was feeling hopeless in the early hours. Predictably, things have blown over today. Just felt hard to see that in the middle of the night, especially when emotions have been painfully heightened.

I think those who've suggested this is part of a broader dilemma for me about speaking up vs. staying silent are on the money. My sibling has a tendency to be a (loving but) very black-and-white person, and has completely bought into 'be kind', endless flags etc. I tend to be conflict avoidant, quite probably because I've grown up with someone so all-or-nothing, if you're not with me you're against me type personality. Someone who is fiercely loyal and I love dearly, but find hard to be around sometimes.

I'm also aware that until a year or so ago, I would have trusted that medical interventions really were always in best interest, we needed to trust children to know themselves, "I don't really know much about it all but let's all be kind". I trusted things to work themselves out without my having to form a coherent opinion, take a stance etc. Having the scales fall from my eyes has made me feel like a terrible person, even if I know rationally I'm not. I'm sure some of my friends would be horrified if they knew.

Yet I'm also aware that I have people in real life who are sensible, sane and of the same feelings as me, and voices of people like Stella O'Malley and JKR - and of course all the amazing women here. I find so many wise and thoughtful contributions on this forum topic, and thank you for talking me down about this last night and today. Xx

[ArabeIIaScott]

I totally understand, OP. This issue has led me to question and reassess so many things. Its not always easy.

You're not suddenly a bad person for not believing in a new ideology that makes extreme claims and demands.

Take care and I hope you find solace and comfort in the days to come.

[TheBiologyStupid]

@continentallentil

so sorry for your loss. Emotions are bound to be running high.

Don’t beat yourself up or allow anyone else to. Your sibling sounds perhaps a little vulnerable / unbalanced themselves (?) which is perhaps why people directed their ire at you.

Get a good nights sleep, treat your sibling as normal in the am (if they are licking their wounds then give them room), if anyone has a go at you, just deflect and move away ‘no I wasn’t being insensitive, I made a perfectly normal comment’ and move away.

I hope the next few days go and well as they can. Get support from friends and leave the sibling / trans stuff be for now. Prioritise looking after yourself.

Absolutely this.

My own sister is full-on TWAW and we have to avoid the subject. She is British but lives just outside Portland, Oregon now - the latter probably explains a lot...!

[Redbird87]

It's very hard to bite your tongue when you're hurting, and I know from experience that bottling this particular issue up for years, feeling gaslit by the world, makes for an explosion eventually.



I'm sorry you're hurting, and I hope you find a way to make your heartache less❤️

[dunBle]

Nope. The person who brought up a contentious issue like that should have thought better of it, as should sibling before they went off on one. No-one has covered themselves in glory here, but it's not uniquely the OP's fault.

[dcbc1234]

Sorry for your loss but the reason this genderwoo has progressed as quickly as it has, is precisely because people have been too afraid to speak the truth. You are right, and no one is born in the wrong body. Everyone is born in their own body of course. Ask them all tomorrow if they agree with the flat earthers as well.

[TeenDivided]

Can you apologise for upsetting them, and ask to agree to disagree?

[TeenDivided]

No she didn't. The different relative brought the subject up, and then the sibling started going on about transphobia and puberty blockers etc.
If they weren't open to hearing the other side calmly they shouldn't have brought the subject up.

[BusterGonad]

The Op didn't bring the subject up, so what are you talking about?

[ArabeIIaScott]

Attacking a woman who is grieving is not on. Leave the OP alone, landofconfusion, and have some damn compassion.

[PlantingMarigolds]

You're not a terrible person op.
I'm sorry for your loss 💛