Clear distinction between DQ performances for consenting adults and inappropriate sexualised performances in front of children.

[Brisland]

While scrolling through, I happened upon this clip - Megyn Kelly discussing why drag performers are inappropriate and unacceptable around children.

I wish all those who think it is harmless, creative and joyful fun for children would listen, as she sums up the motive, result and reality of the damage to children very starkly.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=X-_fAOaQuZg

When you're relying on Megyn Kelly, you're losing the argument.

Drag is not inherently sexualised. End of.

Drag which is sexualised belongs in an adult context. Drag which is not-sexualised is fine in any context. Don't like it? Don't engage with it. Simple.

When you're relying on guilt by association and ad hominems, you've already lost the argument... I'm sure that Megyn Kelly and I, a left wing woman, also both agree that the sky is blue. Doesn't make it wrong if she says it, any more than all vegetarians being "literally Hitler."

Children don't have the choice of whether they "engage" or not with adult drag. What is the inherent benefit and inclusivity of presenting small girls with grotesque, and yes, often sexualised caricatures of adult women, exactly please? (And no, many of us aren't the biggest fan of panto dames either, before you go down that road. Although panto dames aren't specifically being promoted as a "diversity and inclusion" initiative for children, are they?)

I suspect you haven't actually thought about this very deeply or understood the issue.

On the contrary - I'm willing to bet that I understand drag and what it entails far better than you.

When you ignored my post which said that sexualised drag should remain for adults, but non-sexualised drag should be open to anyone. If the drag is not sexualised, it is entirely a matter for the child and their parents to decide if it is an art form they want to enjoy or not.

I'm willing to bet that I understand drag and what it entails far better than you.

Great, so you can enlighten me.

What does it entail for the children and how do they benefit?

What do you mean what does it 'entail'?

Also the premise of your 'how do they benefit?' question is wrong. Once there is no active harm from a particular art form, that is where public policy interests end. It is then up to their parents to decide if they want to expose them to that art form or not.

I don't have to demonstrate benefit to children from going to see the Super Mario movie - all that is needed is to establish that the film is not harmful to children (established via the rating system) and anything after that is a decision for parents.

‘Art form’ 🤣🤣🤣

I don't personally plan to engage with it or permit my children to engage with it. However, I don't accept that I don't have the right to say why. I'm going to avoid it like the misogynistic plague it is, I'm going to keep my kids away from it and I'm going to feel free to discuss exactly what I think is wrong with it.

Fine. But don’t be surprised if your generalisations (and they are almost always generalisations) don’t stand up to scrutiny.

What generalisations would they be then? The fact that drag is an outdated and misogynistic, grotesque representation of women by men stands up perfectly to scrutiny - much like the Black and White Minstrel show back in the 70s.

There was a drag convention recently that parents brought their kids to in LA, it doesn't look like a place kids should be to me. This is the trouble with normalising drag for kids.
https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1657872257409257472

I can almost smell the culture.

JFC

In theory this makes sense. In reality however, sexualised drag is being pushed on young children at ever younger ages. There was a drag panto (The Little Mermaid) on in Dorking Halls (Surrey) this year which was completely inappropriate for young Children. The venue ended up having to reimburse parents to the tune of over £3500 and they had over 50 complaints. Parents had no idea what they were exposing their children to.

https://www.getsurrey.co.uk/news/surrey-news/dorking-parents-appalled-after-kids-26326053.amp

In Melbourne councils are holding an emergency meeting on far-right protestors to drag story time.

The wilful blindness is incredible. It's also mothers, far right or otherwise, that don't like it, but no one seems to be capable of recognising that.

I have actually attended many storytimes, and while I agree that drag queens are sexualised by definition and they mock women, I also fail think they completely take away from what storytime is about, which is stories.

I have never seen a male librarian do storytime. It was women's work. It's so absolutely boring and predictable than when a man deigns to read to children he has to make it all about him.

The reader is conveying the story. Any decent author or reader or listener will know that. Story time is about developing children's love of literacy, which will in turn develop their empathy and open mindedness.

These people are narcissists and grifters and attention seekers and they just want an audience. It's boring.

*ignore the word fail in 3rd paragraph please!

Once there is no active harm from a particular art form, that is where public policy interests end.

Schools and libraries are paying for drag queens to perform to children, with public money. So this is simply incorrect.

And who are you to say there is no active harm to little girls, or indeed little boys, from seeing women being grotesquely caricatured and mocked?

I’m yet to hear a good explanation as to why having a man dressed as an offensive caricature of a woman, often sexualised in either dress or stage name, reading to children in a library helps advance the visibility and acceptance of gays and lesbians in society.

How do kids exposed to this, even if it’s not a twerking predator getting dollar bills stuffed in his G string, but a nice pleasant story from a normal person in drag, gain any education other than “some men dress funny to read stories”?

What is the actual point?

Notbadconsidering

Good question. I can't see a benefit. I have come across some fluffy talk about rainbow families but it's so much murkier now, I really don't understand why it's so important to these people. I mean, there's clearly a huge amount of opposition. Why keep pushing it? And why threaten people who say they don't want it, as this self proclaimed drag defender obsessively does?

https://theshot.net.au/general-news/drag-queens-are-the-latest-and-most-fabulous-targets-in-the-culture-wars-bigots-have-made-a-huge-mistake/

No it doesn't.

I'm old enough to remember seeing The Black and White Minstrel Show on TV. Drag is exactly the same gross parody.
I know that's an unpopular opinion and if adults want to watch it, fine, that's on you.

But how is it a) a positive representation of gay men and b) a positive representation of women to parade before children?

Have DQSH at care homes for seniors. But they never do. Why is that, I don't wonder.?

WickedSerious · Today 12:42

I can almost smell the culture.

Ah, sorry - that yoghurt was over a year old. It's wrapped up and in the outside bin now...

"On the contrary - I'm willing to bet that I understand drag and what it entails far better than you."

Actually, I very much doubt you'd win that bet. I spent the best part of my twenties and thirties in gay clubs watching drag acts, I'm very familiar, indeed, and with both its history and the oevre, but sure, keep making lazy assumptions. Familiarity with it doesn't mean I'm blind.

Did you answer my question about the 'inclusive' benefits to small children of drag story question time btw? I couldn't see you did. I'm not 'ignoring' your comment, I'm disagreeing that a) drag is 'fine' in other contexts and b) that it's not sexualised for kids currently. Perhaps you're less aware than you clearly imagine.

No you’re right - the back and white minstrel show was a grotesque racist representation of black people, whereas drag is a grotesque misogynistic representation of women. Plus ca change.

Do you not think that when they booked an event produced by the Adult Panto Tour that might have been a clue?