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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Genuinely posting in good faith: Mumsnet Film Review

27 replies

BonfireLady · 02/05/2023 22:31

I have no idea how this will go or even if it's allowed (please don't delete MNHQ! 🙏 The link is in the public domain) but I've been involved in two really interesting threads over the last few days and have learned lots about how a) genuinely good faith discussions can and do take place, even when the subject matter is difficult b) it's pretty much impossible to define a "rules of engagement" that everyone can sign up to, but even though this isn't ideal, it's still possible for insightful conversations and exchanges of views to take place respectively (but it's not always easy). Some people don't like rules of engagement, some people think they are essential.

With that all in mind, I'd like to try something:

Can the brilliant minds on this board from the UK, US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and elsewhere collectively review and discuss the film Adult Human Female? Link below.

Rules of engagement*

  1. everyone who comments needs to have watched the film. If you don't like the idea of watching the film (I'm halfway through ATM so won't comment yet except to say I think it's very watchable) or the rules of engagement that's fine but please scroll on by to a different thread
  2. use whatever language works for you in your comments. If you have a gender identity and/or believe TWAW then use whatever terms work for you (cis, transwomen, women etc). If you don't have a gender identity and/or believe TWANW then use whatever terms work for you (woman, adult human female, biological woman, men etc). It's probably going to be clear from the style and content of the comment what someone's position is but some people may want to state theirs. Here's mine: I don't have a gender identity but I respect that some people do hold a belief that this is important. I believe TWANW. However, I'm happy to engage in respectful debate with someone who believes that TWAW. I'm not going to argue over the word "woman" and I'm not going to try and convince you that TWANW - I simply want to discuss the content of the film
  3. speak in your own style. If you break the MN rules your comment will probably get reported by someone and presumably deleted. If you set out to cause offence you'll probably achieve that. I'm not sure what else you'll achieve though.
  4. I'll come in to facilitate and moderate this post periodically but not continuously. It's not about me responding to each comment, it's a general discussion. I won't be making my own review comments until I've finished watching it anyway, as per rule 1 😁

*I should imagine this won't be enough to please everyone but please could we see how we go 🤞 If we can't get past discussing my admittedly limited rules of engagement, then at least I know I tried.

Adult Human Female

This is the first UK documentary feature to look at the clash between women’s rights and trans ideology. The film can also be watched (ad-free) at: www.adult...

https://youtu.be/94HFMSm-JBo

OP posts:
Catiette · 09/05/2023 19:56

I'm sorry I was a long time coming to this. I kept getting behind on the original "Good Faith" threads, and managed to forget about this one in my scrabbles to keep up. I'm sorry @BonfireLady.

Really good points above. I especially agree with @KalimbaMoon about it being a good way in, and @howdoesatoastermaketoast's I think a viewer who was part of the 66% of the population who haven't really been paying attention to the debate thus far would probably be most surprised by the fact that the things that were being said were actually so controversial. I find it deeply disconcerting how "niche" these issues can appear - legitimising their dismissal as culture-war-irrelevancies by so many, while wreaking such tectonic societal change. It's one of the facets of it that leaves me most uneasy and convinced our concerns are legitimate - rather paradoxically, as it leaves a majority in blissful ignorance or indifferent...

BonfireLady · 09/05/2023 22:21

Catiette · 09/05/2023 19:56

I'm sorry I was a long time coming to this. I kept getting behind on the original "Good Faith" threads, and managed to forget about this one in my scrabbles to keep up. I'm sorry @BonfireLady.

Really good points above. I especially agree with @KalimbaMoon about it being a good way in, and @howdoesatoastermaketoast's I think a viewer who was part of the 66% of the population who haven't really been paying attention to the debate thus far would probably be most surprised by the fact that the things that were being said were actually so controversial. I find it deeply disconcerting how "niche" these issues can appear - legitimising their dismissal as culture-war-irrelevancies by so many, while wreaking such tectonic societal change. It's one of the facets of it that leaves me most uneasy and convinced our concerns are legitimate - rather paradoxically, as it leaves a majority in blissful ignorance or indifferent...

No worries problem at all. There have indeed been a lot of (branded?!) "good faith" discussions to catch up on.

This one is definitely a slow burn conversation but on a plus note, it's not been baracaded by activists who refuse to let anyone see it 😁 Thankfully I'm not sure anyone has figured out how to baracade the internet yet.

I find it deeply disconcerting how "niche" these issues can appear - legitimising their dismissal as culture-war-irrelevancies by so many, while wreaking such tectonic societal change.
Absolutely. Aside from all the emotions that go hand in hand with such polarised issues, this is one of the key problems that holds it back from proper discussion. The impact is so great that calling out specifics seems to result in a seemingly disparate and unrelated collection of fringe niche problems. I had a deep concern in one area (autistic gender-questioning adolescent girls) and didn't have a clue how interwoven everything was for a long time.

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