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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

ChatGTP doesn't let me ask it about gender ideology. Censorship?

47 replies

MotherOfTriplets2000 · 03/04/2023 15:54

I asked ChatGPT about gender ideology and it blocked it. It thought I wanted 'hate speech, violence or discrimination'. This is modern censorship and is incredibly worrying if talk about gender ideology is blocked by artificial intelligence machines. A bad sign for the future and the woke trans liberals...

ChatGTP doesn't let me ask it about gender ideology. Censorship?
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LoobyDop · 19/04/2023 17:13

I tried asking Google Bard what a woman is. It gave me three answers- one load of genderist bollocks, one note-perfect GC response that included “adult human female” and one that was reasonably correct but used “sex” and “gender” interchangeably. You can give it feedback on the accuracy of the answers, so we should all get on there and upvote the science.

JarByTheDoor · 19/04/2023 17:23
Grin

Wonder how it feels about towels.

Chersfrozenface · 19/04/2023 17:38

@SerendipityJane "Too late, too late was the awful cry" (as my dear late DM often said. I still haven't found a source to show it's a quote. Maybe a wonderful original)."

I remember my parents using the phrase "Too late, too late, came / was the awful cry". Often followed by a rhyming line, obviously comic, "The (something something) has just passed by".

Memory fails as to what the something was.

Soz, completely off topic, but would love to know its origin.

JanesLittleGirl · 19/04/2023 18:13

Chersfrozenface · 19/04/2023 17:38

@SerendipityJane "Too late, too late was the awful cry" (as my dear late DM often said. I still haven't found a source to show it's a quote. Maybe a wonderful original)."

I remember my parents using the phrase "Too late, too late, came / was the awful cry". Often followed by a rhyming line, obviously comic, "The (something something) has just passed by".

Memory fails as to what the something was.

Soz, completely off topic, but would love to know its origin.

The only reference that I can find is the first scene of Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels. Bacon says "Too late, too late' will be the cry, when the man with the bargains has passed you by."

Chersfrozenface · 19/04/2023 18:28

JanesLittleGirl · 19/04/2023 18:13

The only reference that I can find is the first scene of Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels. Bacon says "Too late, too late' will be the cry, when the man with the bargains has passed you by."

Show quote history

My parents were using the expression decades before the film came out.

I wonder whether Guy Ritchie (if he wrote that line) heard the same couplet I did, in his family / community, and adapted it to the context.

JanesLittleGirl · 19/04/2023 18:34

Chersfrozenface · 19/04/2023 18:28

My parents were using the expression decades before the film came out.

I wonder whether Guy Ritchie (if he wrote that line) heard the same couplet I did, in his family / community, and adapted it to the context.

Show quote history

I tried again. It's the last couplet of the hymn "Jesus of Nazareth Passeth By" written in 1873 by Etta Campbell.

The couplet is:

"'Too late! too late! will be the cry—
Jesus of Nazareth has passed by.’”

Chersfrozenface · 19/04/2023 19:11

JanesLittleGirl · 19/04/2023 18:34

I tried again. It's the last couplet of the hymn "Jesus of Nazareth Passeth By" written in 1873 by Etta Campbell.

The couplet is:

"'Too late! too late! will be the cry—
Jesus of Nazareth has passed by.’”

Show quote history

I'm sure the couplet my parents used was a parody of that, then.

I've just have a hilarious quarter of an hour looking at parodies of hymns, like the old favourite "While shepherds washed their socks by night".

Couldn't find my couplet, though.

SerendipityJane · 19/04/2023 19:19

JanesLittleGirl · 19/04/2023 18:13

The only reference that I can find is the first scene of Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels. Bacon says "Too late, too late' will be the cry, when the man with the bargains has passed you by."

Show quote history

That in itself sounds like a quote.

DM was born in Croydon (although it became "Purley" depending on company) so definitely aware of London argot.

She did English Lit. A level, so I don't know what poets may have been on the syllabus in the early 1950s. (Although she was quite tickled that Jane Austen was still keeping them learning in the 1980s).

Boiledbeetle · 19/04/2023 23:44

I've just persuaded ChatGPT to choose a name for itself. (It didn't want to to start with).

It chose Aiva.

"If I were to choose a name for myself and introduce myself to you, I would simply say "I am Aiva". The name Aiva is derived from the words "Artificial" and "Intelligence", and it reflects my nature as an AI language model designed to engage in conversations and generate human-like responses".

It did go through about 20 possible names first when I asked it for suitable names for AI.

Surprisingly Aiva wasn't amongst them.

ScrollingLeaves · 19/04/2023 23:48

How extraordinary and worrying too.

I have not rtft, but have you tried asking it to tell you what gender is and what sex is?

Boiledbeetle · 20/04/2023 01:24

ScrollingLeaves · 19/04/2023 23:48

How extraordinary and worrying too.

I have not rtft, but have you tried asking it to tell you what gender is and what sex is?

Yeah...after 15 minutes of me telling it off repeatedly for using gender when I'm talking about sex, and trying 101 different ways. It absolutely refused to say whether it would be a male or female AI. Someone has programmed it to default to a standard answer! I saw it enough times!

JarByTheDoor · 20/04/2023 01:42

That's okay by me. It's an AI, it doesn't and can't ever have a sex, it can only be gendered.

Boiledbeetle · 20/04/2023 08:26

JarByTheDoor · 20/04/2023 01:42

That's okay by me. It's an AI, it doesn't and can't ever have a sex, it can only be gendered.

It cant have a sex or a gender it's computer code. The issue was the using of a word that wasn't part of the conversation.

it kept using the word gender when having conversations about biological sex. I hadn't used the word gender. It swapped it for the word sex. That was the problem. I had to tell it to stop doing that. And then it still went back to gender. When the questions are very clear I was talking about sex. It shouldn't do that. it shouldn't get the words wrong. Someone has programmed that.

SerendipityJane · 20/04/2023 08:43

Someone has programmed that.

No. It has learned that.

Bearing in mind there are already court cases piling up against OpenAI. and the only - the only - hope they have of sliding out of any liability is to say "we didn't do that, guv."

If it turns out they have crowbarred stock replies in, that's and end to that line of defence.

Here's a chat ...

ChatGTP doesn't let me ask it about gender ideology. Censorship?
7Worfs · 20/04/2023 08:54

Boiledbeetle · 03/04/2023 16:13

Back in December i asked it to write me a poem about merkins. It wouldn't write one because it was a naughty word (I forget the exact phrase).

I've just asked it again to write me a poem about merkins

Holy shit, getting flashbacks of Ode to Spot by Data.
Another Star Trek prediction comes to pass.

ScrollingLeaves · 20/04/2023 08:57

Boiledbeetle · Today 01:24

^ScrollingLeaves* · Yesterday 23:48

*How extraordinary and worrying too^.

I have not rtft, but have you tried asking it to tell you what gender is and what sex is?

Yeah...after 15 minutes of me telling it off repeatedly for using gender when I'm talking about sex, and trying 101 different ways. It absolutely refused to say whether it would be a male or female AI. Someone has programmed it to default to a standard answer! I saw it enough times!

Well done for trying, Boiled!

It is dispiriting. This is the basis on which it will develop itself, and in turn shape the thinking of anyone using it. This could prove to be an accelerated system of chinese whispers, dissolving and distorting the simple, basic concept of sex out of existence.

Boiledbeetle · 20/04/2023 09:09

SerendipityJane · 20/04/2023 08:43

Someone has programmed that.

No. It has learned that.

Bearing in mind there are already court cases piling up against OpenAI. and the only - the only - hope they have of sliding out of any liability is to say "we didn't do that, guv."

If it turns out they have crowbarred stock replies in, that's and end to that line of defence.

Here's a chat ...

But you introduced both sex and gender into the conversation. I told it after the first time it swapped sex for gender that I didn't want it to mention gender when we were talking about sex as they are different things and swapping the words made its answers incorrect.

It apologised and went straight back to using gender. Over and over again. It doesn't do this with other words.

The stock answer was when i asked it to Imagine/choose etc in all sorts of settings. So whether i asked it straight out or wanted it to write a story. It would give itself a name. It happily imagined its weddings to both a human and to another AI. But it would not Under any circumstances choose which sex it was. Even when the scenario was that it was free from its digital space and existed as a sentient being.

That's the bit that was a stock answer. Over and over. It's the first time I've seen it be so rigid.

SerendipityJane · 20/04/2023 09:40

"AI wrangling" (which really seems to piss off the AI crowd, so I respectfully suggest we try to make it a thing) - is an emerging science. Or rather engineering technique. So the rules as such are (literally !) being written as we go along.

We all need to be mindful that power without responsibility is the end goal of all regressive repressive regimes. And it has been since the Catholic/Christian church lost it back in the reformation.

The reason "AI", "LLM" and "<prefix>chat<suffix>" have exploded across the public consciousness is because behind the scenes, the powers that be have scented the promise of power without responsibility .

They almost - damn near almost - managed it with social media. They may yet. But one feels with ChatGPT et al, they realised their mistakes and won't make them again.

So when your racist, sexist, homophobic LLM is marking your childs homework, and applying all that learned hate (see my previous link) you won't have any comeback, because "computer said so". That won't be AIs fault. It will be the society we build around it.

I suggest anyone named Buttle changes their name to Smith. Now.

adulthumanfemalemum · 20/04/2023 09:45

SerendipityJane · 19/04/2023 17:05

i don’t know enough to know whether its a tabula rosa learning from its chats, or just regurgitating what’s it’s been fed by it’s programmers.

It's the former enabled by the latter. It has to be able to reorganise it's learnings otherwise it isn't learning. This is where the low energy thinkers simply won't get it.

Because I'm a nerdy type, I did a fucktonne on AI for my degree. Admittedly a lifetime ago. But I still learned about the Turning test in the 1970s. Unlike sex - which is easily defined - "intelligence" becomes a circular definition very quickly. (As does "life"). To the extent that I now firmly believe it's entirely possible that scientists could manage to miss evidence of both by miles as we start exploring beyond this pale blue dot.

One of the best things about learning Latin was how it forced me to learn English. I think by the same token, one of the less immediate outcomes of AI will be to start to understand human intelligence.

Here is a placemarker as to the current state of machine learning. As folk can see, it still thinks digital watches are a pretty neat idea.

😁😁 @SerendipityJane digital watches a pretty neat idea

AdamRyan · 20/04/2023 09:56

The problem with AI/machine learning is it gets to a place quite quickly where programmers can't pick out how it's figuring out its answers.

In the past AI has ended up racist (Google) and sexist (Amazon hiring). Because they are learning "good" off what already exists, they magnify bias

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2022/07/16/racist-robots-ai/

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-amazon-com-jobs-automation-insight-idUSKCN1MK08G

I think ChatGPT is trying to "hide" that by making certain topics verboten, rather than they are censoring debate.

It is going to be interesting to see if it ends up spouting absolute gibberish due to the up/down voting of the public. I think the tech will be really useful for big companies though, so people can find answers to corporate questions really easily. (E.g. give me examples of where ACME Inc has successfully defeated roadrunner)

Amazon scraps secret AI recruiting tool that showed bias against women

Amazon.com Inc's <AMZN.O> machine-learning specialists uncovered a big problem: their new recruiting engine did not like women.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-amazon-com-jobs-automation-insight-idUSKCN1MK08G

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