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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

College of policing consultation on recording of non crime hate incidents

34 replies

eleanorwish · 29/03/2023 15:13

Tell them what you think:

www.college.police.uk/article/recording-non-crime-hate-incidents-have-your-say

OP posts:
Arapawa · 29/03/2023 15:17

Is there such a thing? I thought that had been thrown in the bin.

Arapawa · 29/03/2023 15:18

...where it belongs

eleanorwish · 29/03/2023 15:28

I got the link from Lisa Townsend's tweet:

https://twitter.com/lisaa_townsend/status/1641003796061888514?s=61&t=ir6IQm5aMvGdWQV34wv4QA

The consultation is dated yesterday. I agree, I'm not sure why they're consulting when they've been told to stop.

OP posts:
yourhairiswinterfire · 29/03/2023 15:38

eleanorwish · 29/03/2023 15:28

I got the link from Lisa Townsend's tweet:

https://twitter.com/lisaa_townsend/status/1641003796061888514?s=61&t=ir6IQm5aMvGdWQV34wv4QA

The consultation is dated yesterday. I agree, I'm not sure why they're consulting when they've been told to stop.

I don't trust them one bit. The changes to guidance, such as prioritising freedom of expression and not punishing people for engaging in political debate, sounds good, but that relies on the police being unbiased, having common sense, and not being off their tits on Stonewall.

Dinopawus · 29/03/2023 16:00

OMG I'm raging. So stickers at PRIDE are a hate incident.
but complaints about removal of stickers on the grounds of religious hostility are not a hate incident?

The clock just struck 13 didn't it?

College of policing consultation on recording of non crime hate incidents
SweetCoriander · 29/03/2023 16:48

There's a lot of definitions need providing there. What, for example, are 'concerns about ...'? What does 'anti-transgender' mean?

Dinopawus · 29/03/2023 16:57

Exactly what I'm putting in my response funnily enough Grin

Dinopawus · 29/03/2023 17:03

And now the questions have disappeared. Am I not supposed to complete it I wonder?

Leaving this here to see if anyone has more luck,

forms.office.com/Pages/ResponsePage.aspx?id=PWMNaEQXfkWEQGDWlPaeezyERBa6EYhOsBTnCO1Q3hxUMTkyVDVLWlQ1QlUySDE0VlZCT09aWUhDUi4u

IwantToRetire · 13/04/2023 23:14

Complete the online consultation questionnaire by 11:59pm on Sunday 16 April to have your say. https://www.college.police.uk/article/recording-non-crime-hate-incidents-have-your-say

DarkDayforMN · 13/04/2023 23:36

Wow, it’s set up so that it’s very easy to agree with and rubber stamp everything they say but to disagree with them requires a shitload of typing. That’s clearly going to bias the responses. Are they allowed to run consultations this way?

Bosky · 14/04/2023 06:21

Arapawa · 29/03/2023 15:17

Is there such a thing? I thought that had been thrown in the bin.

Looks like it has been watered-down rather than binned entirely.

Did the previous system cover all EA2010 Protected Characteristics or just the five "Monitored Strands"?

Non-crime terminology

2.16 Non-crime terminology should be used to refer to the parties involved in a non-crime incident (for example, ‘complainant’ for the person making the report and ‘subject’ for the party being complained about). Trivial, malicious, or irrational

2.17 A non-crime hate incident must not be recorded if the complaint is trivial, malicious or irrational, and a hate and prejudice qualifier should not be added to the record in these instances. For example, if there is no evidence to support the perception of the complainant – or any other person – that the incident is motivated by hostility against a monitored strand or protected characteristic, a non-crime hate incident must not be recorded.
(my bolding)
Page 11

Personal data may only be recorded where the incident:
> ‘presents a real risk of significant harm to individuals with a particular characteristic(s) and/or a real risk that a future criminal offence may be committed against individuals or groups with a particular characteristic(s)’.
> If the incident does not reach this additional threshold, the personal data of the subject should not be recorded. Where the personal data of the subject has already been recorded, it should be deleted.

> When making a record about a non-crime incident, call takers should always use non-crime terminology for the parties involved, such as ‘complainant’ and ‘subject’ (do not use ‘victim’ or ‘suspect’). Seek advice from Duty Silver if required
Page 17

When the personal data of the subject has been recorded and they are identified, they should be notified that a complaint has been made and should be given a right to reply. The only exception is if there is a reasonable belief that such a notification could present a safeguarding risk to the complainant. Following review, the incident record should be updated accordingly, in order to:

> confirm or remove a hate and prejudice qualifier, as appropriate

> update and close an incident that has been identified as trivial, irrational or malicious

> remove hate and prejudice qualifiers where they have been added in error, or where the facts do not justify the addition of a qualifier

> delete personal data where no lawful basis for retaining it exists.
Page 19

Step five – retention of police information

Officers and staff must retain, review and dispose of records, including personal data, in line with all relevant legislative and regulatory requirements. This includes, but is not limited to:

  • Management of Police Information (MoPI) Code of Practice 2005
  • UK General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR) and the Data Protection Act (DPA) 2018
  • The Human Rights Act 1998
The maximum period for retention prior to review is six years. See also Management of police information.

Managing existing records of non-crime hate incidents
2.32 Where records do exist and if in any context they are discovered, particular care should be taken to review the record before considering disclosure. Examples may include general policing enquiries, an enhanced criminal record certificate or when a person makes a subject access request (SAR).

Reviewing existing records
2.33 Where an existing non-crime hate incident record is identified during any process, the record should be reviewed to consider whether it should exist (consider Step four – review in the process for recording non-crime incidents).

2.34 If the record has been made or retained inappropriately when applying this guidance, it should be deleted and discounted for all other purposes.

2.35 If it is considered that the record should exist, where the record is being considered for disclosure – including a subject access request or enhanced criminal record certificate – the appropriate guidance for those processes should be followed. See also Statutory disclosure and barring provisions.

2.36 The subject of an enhanced criminal record certificate may have the opportunity to make representations against disclosure during the disclosure process. They also have access to the Disclosure and Barring Service (DBS) dispute process and a right of appeal through the Independent Monitor for Disclosure and Barring. For more information, see Statutory disclosure and barring provisions and Report a problem about a criminal record check or barring decision.
Page 20 - 21

Malicious calls
2.57 For the purposes of the NSIR, a malicious call is classed as a hoax call.

2.58 Some people may be motivated by malice, and may try to distort the truth and misuse the reporting and recording process in order to target individuals or communities. Malicious calls may be more likely to target those engaged in political speeches or legitimate debate on potentially controversial subjects because they have a public platform. Callers may do this to further an ideological (or other) agenda or will seek to undermine the efforts of authorities to uphold the rights of others. Some reports are intended to promote bigotry that they purport to be complaining about.
Page 25

Responding to non-crime hate incidents

3.1 Not all incidents that are perceived by the complainant as being motivated by hostility should be recorded as a non-crime hate incident. A record should only be made where it meets the requirements set out in Recording non-crime incidents perceived by the reporting person to be motivated by hostility.

3.2 When considering the proportionate response to a non-crime hate incident, officers and staff should first consider whether the incident meets the threshold for recording the personal data of the subject of the complaint.

3.3 Under the Code of Practice on the Recording and Retention of Personal Data (‘the Code’), the personal data about the subject should only be recorded where the incident: 'presents a real risk of significant harm to individuals with a particular characteristic(s) and/or a real risk that a future criminal offence may be committed against individuals or groups with a particular characteristic(s)'.

3.4 Non-crime hate incidents that do not meet the recording threshold, and that do not include the personal data of the subject, will rarely require a call for service or further investigation.

3.5 However, these incidents should not be dismissed as unimportant. They can still cause distress to complainants and communities, and forces should ensure that the circumstances of the incident are recorded without the personal data of the subject, so that intelligence can be developed and monitored. Non-crime hate incidents may be the precursor to more serious or escalating incidents.

3.6 An incident may form part of a series of incidents that, together, may constitute a crime (such as harassment). A retrospective review of crimes will often highlight earlier non-crime hate incidents that could have presented opportunities to intervene to reduce threat, risk and harm.

3.7 Where there is a real risk of significant harm to individuals with a particular characteristic(s) and/or a real risk that a future criminal offence may be committed against individuals or groups with a particular characteristic(s), a record should be made and should include the personal data of the subject.

3.8 Although police officers have limited enforcement powers to intervene in non-crime incidents, they do have a general duty with statutory partners under the Equality Act 2010. See Partnership working.

3.9 Some incidents would amount to a criminal offence if committed in public, but not if they occur in a private dwelling – for example, some public order offences. A complainant is likely to suffer the same harm, regardless of the location. Where appropriate, complainants should be referred to appropriate support services. See Victim and witness care and support.

3.10 Forces should ensure that information on non-crime hate incidents is analysed so that preventive activity can take place, identified community tensions can be monitored, and activity can be implemented to reduce tensions or potential harm.

Page 26 -27
https://assets.college.police.uk/s3fs-public/2023-03/Recording-and-retention-of-non-crime-hate-incidents-APP-consultation.pdf
----

I should get on and do the survey!
https://www.college.police.uk/article/recording-non-crime-hate-incidents-have-your-say

Bosky · 14/04/2023 19:17

Dinopawus · 29/03/2023 16:00

OMG I'm raging. So stickers at PRIDE are a hate incident.
but complaints about removal of stickers on the grounds of religious hostility are not a hate incident?

The clock just struck 13 didn't it?

I'm raging too! If this guidance goes out as proposed then we can expect every police force in the country to be trained that people (mostly women) who are "gender critical" are "anti-transgender", actively wish harm on them, want to threaten them in some way (not explained in the example) and are probably homophobic too since the example refers to a Pride event.

Copying and pasting from part of my reply on another thread:

Look at this example of a "trivial complaint" in the proposed "Authorised Professional Practice (APP)" for the Police and see the propaganda machine still at play, demonising women and seeking to undermine women's rights:

Example
The local authority and the police respond to community concerns reported to them about anti-transgender posters that were posted at the scene of an LGBT+ Pride event. The local authority removed the posters and the police recorded the complaint as a non-crime incident, adding a hate and prejudice qualifier on the grounds of hostility towards transgender identity. This was because the posters were assessed as containing threatening material. A person sees an online article about this and reports a hate crime on the grounds of religious hostility, saying that by removing the posters, the local authority have offended their philosophical faith around biological gender. The police review the complaint and decide that the actions of the local authority do not amount to a crime, and that it is irrational to record a non-crime hate incident. The complainant is asking the police to record legal activity by the local authority. Furthermore, this activity is not motivated by hostility. To record the complaint as a non-crime hate incident would not be rational

The police notify the complainant about their decision not to record a non-crime hate incident. In addition, they review the record and delete any personal data of the subject.

Page 11 - 12

The "subject" in this example is the Local Authority. There is no mention of deleting the personal data of the complainant, the person who has a "philosophical faith around biological gender", who is portrayed as approving of "anti-transgender posters . . . assessed as containing threatening material".

assets.college.police.uk/s3fs-public/2023-03/Recording-and-retention-of-non-crime-hate-incidents-APP-consultation.pdf

That is the sort of propaganda that underpins the now routine accusation by anti-woman activists that advocates for women's rights are "Nazis". Plus a bit of sleight of hand about the retention of personal data on such a complainant.

There is probably less emotive shorthand but this along with so many other examples (eg. the College of Justice refusing to disclose who advised and trained it on production of the very unequal "Equal Treatment Bench Book") smacks of the 'Deep State", with so many institutions of State being captured and working against women.
----

@Mummyoflittledragon on that other thread you were asking about the College of Police consultation.

It took me at least an hour to complete and I had to skimp on reading the related documents that they say you also need to read. They say 15 - 30 mins to complete the survey, which is ridiculous.

I raised the Example above under Q16 in the Survey and answered as follows:

16. Do you think the APP content could have any potential positive or negative impacts on individuals, groups or communities (including those who share protected characteristics)?

Please tick all that apply.

Negative impacts

Example for 2.17 Implies that the complainant (PC Belief in Biological Sex) approved of "anti-transgender" posters that were threatening and had been deemed a non-crime hate incident. The whole scenario is unrepresentative of the usual state of affairs, where typically it is male transgender people who place posters and display placards threatening women who have the PC of Belief in Biological Sex with death, decapitation, rape, etc. This means that the Police will be primed to perceive people, usually women, with the PC of Believe in Biological Sex as the aggressors when the usual situation is that they are threatened with violence, rape or death by males who are transgender. This makes it less likely that the Police will recognise these acts as motivated by misogyny and hatred of women and instead consider that they are justifiable retaliation. This puts women's safety, well-being and lives at risk. The whole framing of this issue demonstrates the institutionalised misogyny of the higher echelons of the Police, brainwashing by transgender lobby groups and explains why the police fail to protect women when they are physically threatened by transgender activists and enable VAWG. I am disgusted and horrified that the Police have been so thoroughly captured by transgender ideology that you could think it remotely acceptable or sensible to include an example framed in that way. This is vile. You are supposed to police without fear or favour. Is it fear or favour that drives you to demonise women in this way?

I am not saying that is a perfect answer but it might give you some ideas.

For the rest of the Survey I answered as follows - but if others can chip in with suggestions that would be great:

Please indicate the extent to which you agree or disagree with the following statement

  1. The APP is easy to understand

Disagree
(3)
It is not clear whether the police would still record an incident that caused someone concern even it was decided that it was not a non-crime hate incident.

  1. It is clear what Chief Constables need to do as a result of the APP.

Agree

  1. It is clear what Police Officers and Staff need to do as a result of the APP

Agree

  1. The processes for recording non-crime hate incidents is clear

Strongly disagree

  1. You have to refer to several other documents, each of which asks to refer to yet more documents and it is impossible to work out what the process is - or what "personal information" is recorded about the complainant or subject.
  1. The section on Incidents in Schools is clear

Disagree

  1. There is no explanation why incidents on school trips are treated differently

  2. There is enough information on impact factors to support decision making

Agree

  1. In the APP, is there anything you think should be

Added - Not Sure
Changed - Not sure
Removed - not sure

(16 as above)

  1. The estimated time to complete of 15 - 30 mins is hopelessly unrealistic given the amount of material to be considered including all the additional documents that need to be consulted. -----

I've had a scout around social media and I can't find anyone making a fuss about the Example pitting implicitly "hateful" people who believe in biological sex against the poor oppressed trans who have never been known to threaten women, although I would be surprised if Fair Cop had not had something to say about it.

Paging @spero and @FairCop

VillieManillie · 14/04/2023 19:51

bump

IwantToRetire · 14/04/2023 20:44

Thanks for the detail. As usual I suspect I wont get to it until the last minute, so seems like I need to allow a fair amount of time.

And also, have found it strange that no women's groups or activists have commented.

Am now wondering if someone should send a link to Standing for Women or ... ?

Spero · 15/04/2023 00:03

Thanks for the thread - it has flown a bit under the radar but I will be drafting the Fair Cop response tomorrow. It seems utterly pointless given the Code of Practice published in March but I agree the example given is really troubling.

Please join us for the NCHI day of action on May 20th!

twitter.com/wearefaircop/status/1645854955432038411?s=46&t=b8Lm751Gn-H9ve9Z2d5cBw

SweetCoriander · 15/04/2023 05:56

Spero · 15/04/2023 00:03

Thanks for the thread - it has flown a bit under the radar but I will be drafting the Fair Cop response tomorrow. It seems utterly pointless given the Code of Practice published in March but I agree the example given is really troubling.

Please join us for the NCHI day of action on May 20th!

twitter.com/wearefaircop/status/1645854955432038411?s=46&t=b8Lm751Gn-H9ve9Z2d5cBw

Thanks, @Spero

Bosky · 15/04/2023 19:10

Please RT - I contacted Fair Cop and they have picked this up:

https://twitter.com/WeAreFairCop/status/1647013028884299778

ChristinaXYZ · 15/04/2023 19:28

Bump

Spero · 15/04/2023 20:41

I have cut and pasted Fair Cop's response here

https://twitter.com/SVPhillimore/status/1647314718686625793?s=20

Its a very odd consultation document in many respects.

https://twitter.com/SVPhillimore/status/1647314718686625793?s=20

Shelefttheweb · 15/04/2023 21:14

Can we report their consultation as a hate incident stirring up hatred for those who pro-women?

oldwomanwhoruns · 15/04/2023 21:46

Just finished. I just kept asking why the APP makes no mention of the disproportionate and real dangers that women and children are in, from males. Rape threats, death threats. These are real, terrifying threats. But the police are running after 'hurty feelingz'.
And why is the document attempting to silence women by ignoring the obvious conflict between the rights of women and the current demands of the trans lobby? The emotive use of 'Anti-Transgender' has no place in such a document.
A;so, why is the APP encouraging the recording of trivial 'thought' incidents? It initially tells police not to record 'trivial' things, but then proceeds to tell them to do exactly this. It's like the different bits of the document don't hang together?

DarkDayforMN · 15/04/2023 22:04

What regulatory body/Ministry does the College of Policing report to? Or is it a law unto itself?

It seems like there needs to be some kind of investigation and probably some major personnel changes. They’ve learned nothing from the court case. And I bet they’re not doing much if anything to address the serious problem of police misogyny, even while they encourage the cops to keep tooling around with “hate incidents” to protect males from hurty feelings.

Who would you even write to about that? The Home Secretary?

SweetCoriander · 15/04/2023 22:07

DarkDayforMN · 15/04/2023 22:04

What regulatory body/Ministry does the College of Policing report to? Or is it a law unto itself?

It seems like there needs to be some kind of investigation and probably some major personnel changes. They’ve learned nothing from the court case. And I bet they’re not doing much if anything to address the serious problem of police misogyny, even while they encourage the cops to keep tooling around with “hate incidents” to protect males from hurty feelings.

Who would you even write to about that? The Home Secretary?

The Telegraph has picked up on this tonight.

It refers to the College of Policing as 'a taxpayer-funded quango that provides national advice to forces'.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/04/15/college-of-policing-free-speech/

College of Policing accused of watering down Suella Braverman’s free speech charter

Draft guide differs from Home Office code of practice on non-crime hate incidents

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/04/15/college-of-policing-free-speech

IwantToRetire · 16/04/2023 00:50

If you cant access the Telegraph link as it is behind a paywall it has been reproduced by yahoo at https://uk.news.yahoo.com/college-policing-accused-watering-down-200757607.html

... the College of Policing, a taxpayer-funded quango that provides national advice to forces, has been required to update its own manual for officers on how to record NCHIs, called “authorised professional practice” (APP), which police in England and Wales rely on day to day.

But it has been accused of deploying an “Orwellian” and “woke spin” in its new draft. In the Home Office code, there are 11 scenarios provided where officers should or should not record an NCHI, 63 per cent of which advise explicitly not to record one.

However, the college’s new guidance has only eight scenarios, all different to the Home Office ones, just 12.5 per cent of which advise explicitly not to record.

Seven out of eight of these were in the college’s old guidance. This was found in 2021 to be unlawful in the Court of Appeal and to disproportionately interfere with free expression in its section on how police should record incidents.

It followed a High Court victory for Harry Miller, a former constable who successfully sued after Humberside Police officers visited his workplace and recorded an NCHI because of a “transphobic” limerick he shared on Twitter.

In one, the Home Office provides a scenario where a xenophobia complaint is made about a journalist’s views on immigration, but police do not record it as it “would represent a clear chilling effect on free speech”. .....

Its strange that the article doesn't refer to the consultation.

Is the publice being used to provide some sort of feedback that the CoP want to present to Braverman to show that people do want them to arrest, after she said it was a waste of time.

I am totally confused and now feel the consultation is just a manipulative paper exercise

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