Misogyny law consultation opened in Scotland

[ArabellaScott]

www.gov.scot/news/misogyny-law-consultation/

'Misogynistic harassment could become a criminal offence as part of proposals aimed at providing greater protection for women and girls.

A consultation has been launched on the draft reforms, which would create five new laws to provide police and prosecutors with new powers to tackle the corrosive effects of misogyny.

The proposals are based on the recommendations made by the Working Group on Misogyny led by Baroness Kennedy. This concluded that the harmful effects of misogyny meant women and girls required new
protection through the criminal law.

Under the proposals, the scope of how current laws tackle misogynistic abuse would be expanded to include threatening, abusive or sexual behaviour directed towards women or girls – because of their gender– which is likely to cause them to feel degradation, humiliation or distress.

It would also be used to tackle situations where women or girls are subjected to threatening or abusive messages about rape, sexual assault or disfigurement – either in person, or online.'

I see so it's not about protecting women and girls but anyone with a woman's or girls gender well I guess that this law won't help gc women then

Hokay guys, I am opening the betting book here.

Odds on this ending up being a brand new and exciting way for male people to bully, harass, silence and punish female people for daring to contradict them or wanting rights? And on this mostly reframing 'misogyny' to mean 'female upset or said no to a special male person'? Well, they're not looking good.

Change of huge wins however should this actually turn out to be about women and girls and improving their lives as opposed to increasing their subordination and oppression. Huge.

Sadly, I share all of those concerns.

I'm also loathe to say it, but these 'consultations' seem to be a box ticking exercise to say they've done it, rather than an actual consultation in the original meaning of the word, which suggested they might actually take the public's views into account.

I've done enough of these consultations, painstakingly filled in by thousands of women who can ill afford the time, only for the Scotgov to blithely handwave them away and produce a report with some bullshit 'wordcloud' in place of any actual response and/or anaylsis. It's a fucking insult to democracy, frankly.

Sorry for the rant. Is it time for drink yet?

It's the process in many LAs. You come up with the decision on what you want. You run the consultation. You bin it. You do what you'd planned to do in the first place. You call that 'democracy'.

Yes, I see that now. I'm a bit bitter that I didn't before. To think I was actually hopeful that it was a chance to participate in decision making!

Live and learn.

We are very good at 'consultations' here in Scotland.

Shame we can't manage to make the analysis of them fair or unbiased.

It does end in very useful evidence however. For example that the SNP refuses to properly process or publish evidence it does not like.

yeah, I think it’s a bit nihilistic to say filling in the consultations has no effect

not filling them in would be less effective

I will have one of those margaritas though

I know, I'm sorry. I don't mean to be defeatist.

Have a GIANT margarita and some red wine.

FFS - “because of their gender” no because of their sex. If they can’t get that right!

“Under the proposals, the scope of how current laws tackle misogynistic abuse would be expanded to include threatening, abusive or sexual behaviour directed towards women or girls – because of their gender– which is likely to cause them to feel degradation, humiliation or distress.”

The numerous 'charities' and 'grass roots' organisations that the SNP govt funds will have armies of well paid young policy officers respond to the consultation. Which will then magically support whatever position the SNP administration wants.

How 'woman' and 'girl' is defined will crucial. It needs to be 'biological only' and so I am not sure it is legislation I want at all.

Huh depends entirely on how they define "woman". As they use "gender" and not "sex" I'm not hopeful. Very nebulous

Well i'm very hopeful for you lovely Scots ladies, i'm sure your concerns and worries will be top of the list for consideration.
Oh, hang on a mo...

😒

Whatever happens with the upcoming election I hope some of these rotten rackets are disbanded and there's a good clear out of all the gravy train passengers. They are doing nothing for the country at all, just taking. Living in a complete bubble while everything goes to shit around them.

It’s already illegal to harass and verbally assault women. Death and rape threats are not legal.

The problem is enforcement. JK Rowling has so many death threats she could paper her house with them. Number of arrests? Zero. Conviction rate for rape? 1%.

What we need is a specific expert division within the police force / CPS, with female-only staff, dedicated to investigating and prosecuting crimes against women and girls, including those crimes committed by police officers. And we need robust digital identity (sorry Mumsnet) so that the police can quickly find out the real names of men who send online rape/death threats and dick pics etc.

We can fill in consultations, and we can even change laws, but while misogynist male police officers refuse to investigate or prosecute them, what can you do. And while the internet offers complete anonymity many creeps will use that to harass women. Look at the female MPs quitting their jobs because of the daily misogynistic threats of violence. Women are literally being driven out of law-making because the so-called enforcers of the law let them down.

@ArabellaScott all govts fund shady outfits to lend credibility to their ideologies.

The media could expose these front organisations tomorrow, but for some reason they go along with it. Scottish outlets are themselves dependent public funding now, so understandable that they tow the line. But why not places like The Times Scotland edition? Do journalists fear being shunned?

A cursory glance at the OSCR accounts shows how much grassroots support these charities have, ie next to none. Some of them are frequently quoted as independent organisations but they don't seem to exist as separate charities or nonprofits at all.

But you're right, now would be an excellent time to expose the rackets while the SNP is in disarray. I guess they reckon on Humza winning.

nilsmousehammer · Yesterday 13:30

Odds on this ending up being a brand new and exciting way for male people to bully, harass, silence and punish female people for daring to contradict them or wanting rights? And on this mostly reframing 'misogyny' to mean 'female upset or said no to a special male person'?

My pessimistic and cynical nature leads me to the same conclusion, sadly.

Indeed, the legal position should be clear already. The consultation is to be seen to be doing something. Or worse, to keep conflating sex with gender.

It's Baroness Kennedy's project. She has form, wrt genderbollocks.

Or worse, to keep conflating sex with gender.

If they didn't understand the reasons for the public anger, the resignations from the SNP, the ousting of Sturgeon and the recent polls, which are mostly against tranw in women's spaces, there's not much hope, is there? Have they not understood that seeing Adam Graham in his pink leggings has woken up people, who previously didn't have this on their radar?