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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Monroe Bergdorf's curious interpretation of the Equality Act

47 replies

ArabellaScott · 17/02/2023 13:53

www.instagram.com/p/Cor5cDRoCex/

'“There’s so much misinformation going around about trans people being in women only spaces, when legally, we’ve been allowed to use whatever spaces are in alignment with our gender identity since 2010 with the Equality Act. The talking points don’t reflect the law.”

Monroe seems to proves Monroeself's own point in that last sentence.

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CryptoFascistMadameCholet · 19/02/2023 16:42

Brokendaughter · 19/02/2023 15:28

It's barely managed to scrape into the top 5000 books with a trad publisher behind it & they've tried to put it in some pretty sludgy categories for kindle to improve it's poor ranking.

I suppose at £8.99 for a 152 page kindle book by a nobody, you can't expect to sell well though.
Who would pay £13+ for what is basically a novella? (listed as 224 pages in hardback. Wonder what it's padded out with to get those extra 72 pages?)

I see there are already second hand copies available, which is fairly impressive for a book that only came out 3 days ago.

Doesn't mean any man is wanted or welcome in womens spaces though.

Big font?

hryllilegur · 19/02/2023 16:52

TRAs always claim that trans people are paying with their lives or their lives are at risk.

At risk of what exactly? What is the actual risk to trans lives?

And no, evidence about sex workers being at risk of violence don’t count because that’s a risk derived from sex work generally.

Nor do arguments about suicide count. That’s a completely different issue to how these things are framed by TRAs.

ArabellaScott · 19/02/2023 17:06

I like Big Fonts and I cannot lie

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BlueHeelers · 19/02/2023 17:33

TRAs always claim that trans people are paying with their lives or their lives are at risk.

Compared with average of 2.5 women murdered each week, for being female, yes, trans people are very might the ones at highest risk.

<sarcasm font off/>

Rightsraptor · 19/02/2023 17:47

It's interesting how books that go on to sell well, such as Abigail Shrier & Helen Joyce's books about trans issues have such problems finding a publisher, while ones such as Bergdorf's don't seem to. One might almost think the publishing industry is captured.

Rightsraptor · 19/02/2023 17:53

I was trying to remember, when I was tapping out my last post, whose book it was that was told the publisher 'wouldn't get it past the junior staff'. I think it was Hannah Barnes' book about GIDS. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Please, someone - where are the fucking adults?

hryllilegur · 19/02/2023 17:56

BlueHeelers · 19/02/2023 17:33

TRAs always claim that trans people are paying with their lives or their lives are at risk.

Compared with average of 2.5 women murdered each week, for being female, yes, trans people are very might the ones at highest risk.

<sarcasm font off/>

Well exactly.

There is absolutely no evidence of the trans ‘genocide’ we’re constantly told about.

All the claims of trans people being the ‘most vulnerable’ seem to boil down to a vulnerability in terms of very poor mental health. Which is a real vulnerability (and there should be much better mental health support available) but the problem (and its mitigation) is very, very different to how TRAs want to present it. In fact, many of the proposed solutions may well make things worse.

In some of the noisiest cases, the ‘vulnerability’ seems to be not just getting to be in control of everything and everyone. The loud on SM types are probably not representative in the least, but many of them seem to be throwing a tantrum and playing the victim when they don’t get to decide what everyone does and think. When they’re shouting about ‘vulnerability’, it’s often pure DARVO.

All of that loud TRA activity actually stops proper discussion of the real vulnerabilities: teenage girls horribly uncomfortable with their pubertal bodies in a horrendously sexualised society and/or internalised homophobia who are very vulnerable to online rhetoric trying to urge them towards a lifetime of medical and surgical intervention in particular. We’re not supposed to talk about that kind of vulnerability.

Florissant · 20/02/2023 07:02

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Florissant · 20/02/2023 07:06

So, without specifically mentioning anyone: sex is determined at time of conception and is immutable. Men, ie adult human males, are of the class that produce small mobile gametes. Women, ie adult human females, are of the class that produce large immobile gametes.

Florissant · 20/02/2023 07:26

Can someone please clarify for me? On this board, are we required to use pronouns that refers to an individual's gender not their sex?

Thank you.

ArabellaScott · 20/02/2023 07:31

You may be deleted for 'misgendering' someone. So if you call a male a 'man' when they have chosen a different descriptor due to their feelings.

Only if someone reports your post, though.

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ArabellaScott · 20/02/2023 07:32

We are permitted to use correct sex descriptors- 'male' is generally okay for males.

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Clymene · 20/02/2023 07:35

"The first book by Munroe Bergdorf, a manifesto on gender by the black transgender activist and model, has been bought for a six-figure sum after a bidding war between 11 publishers."

  1. Wa this before anyone realised that the blue haired brigade a) don't put their money where their mouth is and b) aren't interested in anyone but themselves so that the number of people who will want to buy MB's witterings is very small indeed?

@Florissant - the monitors on here insist we use chosen pronouns unless a man has been changed with a crime against a woman or child

BlueHeelers · 20/02/2023 07:44

the monitors on here insist we use chosen pronouns unless a man has been changed with a crime against a woman or child

Which is why I say "they." There's enough cognitive dissonance in the world happening by accident, without adding to it.

ArabellaScott · 20/02/2023 07:44

Oh, yes, I forgot about the criminal exceptions. God, its mad.

I remember at the time of MB's bidding war people described this as a virtue signal book deal. The publishers weren't ever that fussed about the end product, was the story, the deal making enough headlines to allow them to look supportive of said social activism.

IDK, publishing is a very odd industry.

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Florissant · 20/02/2023 07:51

Thank you for the clarification. I have autism and so this lack of logic and consistency is confusing.

My post was deleted for misgendering, I believe.

hryllilegur · 20/02/2023 07:51

ArabellaScott · 20/02/2023 07:32

We are permitted to use correct sex descriptors- 'male' is generally okay for males.

its amazing how ‘be kind’ means ‘walk on eggshells and heavily police everything you say’. Isn’t it?

Florissant · 20/02/2023 07:52

ArabellaScott · 20/02/2023 07:44

Oh, yes, I forgot about the criminal exceptions. God, its mad.

I remember at the time of MB's bidding war people described this as a virtue signal book deal. The publishers weren't ever that fussed about the end product, was the story, the deal making enough headlines to allow them to look supportive of said social activism.

IDK, publishing is a very odd industry.

From the sales reports, it sound like they are losing money on this.

Clymene · 20/02/2023 08:06

Brendan O'Neill reviews it here: www.spiked-online.com/2023/02/19/the-return-of-gay-shame/

Almost makes me feel sorry for Bergdorf. Almost.

Clymene · 20/02/2023 08:06

Brendan refreshingly doesn't use chosen pronouns.

AlisonDonut · 20/02/2023 08:09

There is absolutely no evidence of the trans ‘genocide’ we’re constantly told about.

Well, I'd suggest that when a majority of 'trans kids' end up sterile or with shorter lives due to the horrendous effects of drugs or who opt for assisted suicide because they cannot live with the effects of the surgery, all of which contribute to 'genocide' then the only direction this genocide is coming is from their own side.

People who are campaigning for kids to NOT have all these, are the ones who are accused of this genocide.

It is the ultimate DARVO.

hryllilegur · 20/02/2023 08:15

AlisonDonut · 20/02/2023 08:09

There is absolutely no evidence of the trans ‘genocide’ we’re constantly told about.

Well, I'd suggest that when a majority of 'trans kids' end up sterile or with shorter lives due to the horrendous effects of drugs or who opt for assisted suicide because they cannot live with the effects of the surgery, all of which contribute to 'genocide' then the only direction this genocide is coming is from their own side.

People who are campaigning for kids to NOT have all these, are the ones who are accused of this genocide.

It is the ultimate DARVO.

This is a fair point.

But they’re not going to be open to exploring the horrible fact that children are very vulnerable to trans activism and the medical intervention being championed within.

Much better to imply that GC people are forming death squads to hunt people
down or something.

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