Why is Wales jumping on the self ID bandwagon?

[MoirasSaggyBundles]

The latest discussion from the people of Spiked Online, including the excellent Ella Whelan, who was so good on Question Time the other week. Wales is seeking permission to pursue its own gender reform to bring about self ID.

I really don't understand how any political party is pursuing this policy in good faith, now that everyone has seen in real life situations the logical conclusion of allowing bad faith actors access to female spaces via self ID. Nor do I understand how any devolved government thinks this policy helps them to sell independence, after the clusterfuck brought about by the SNP's GRR Bill, and the ensuing trigger of section 35. And on top of that, it's leading to huge ideological rifts within parties, leading to women like Rosie Duffield feeling unsafe within her own party - how is that giving voters confidence in their politicians?

Any Welsh posters here? Is there widespread, grass roots support for these policies? Why? Just Why is the Welsh Government - why are any politicians - pursing this?

I assume at this point the TRAs are trying to pass any law they can as quickly as they can. They realise people are starting to open their eyes.

The world has gone mad.

As someone in Wales, one reason seems to be that both Wales and Scotland's governments desperately want to do anything they can to be opposite to England. If England does it, it must be bad.
I'm sure there are more reasons but that's a big one in my opinion.

How childish.

I wonder if the trans container truck hasn't yet had time to turn around. There must be some real serious thinking going on because of this new Rapist gender and the public reaction. Labour has always thought it should dictate how people think but this backlash is surely going to stop them in their tracks. Then again, the trans lobby will be pushing for results as Controversial says I assume at this point the TRAs are trying to pass any law they can as quickly as they can. They realise people are starting to open their eyes.

But it's objectively a disaster! It's one thing opposing Westminster on a policy that will have a different effect on the local communities in devolved nations. But women don't stop being terrified of rapist men in their spaces, don't stop needing their privacy and dignity, just because they are Welsh. It's not even being kind. It's just ideological lunacy. The Tory government of Westminster are giving Scottish and Welsh voters enough reasons to despise them and want independence without bringing self ID into it. And it's not as if England and Westminster is in opposition. The Tories started down this self ID path in the first place, and abandoned it for good reason. Why does Wales think that taking the baton that the Tories dropped on the "shit policies" pile, that Scotland picked up, even though it was covered in poo and has led to an epic shit storm, is going to leave Wales with clean hands?

Vanity project.
No female prisons in Wales.

Absolutely boils my piss. Huge parts of legislative reform taking forever because of staff losses and gaps in departments but people will be made to move to work on this when it’s pointless.

What @OneLongSmorgasbord said
Drakeford and the rest of them are just trying to copy Mrs Sturgeon , desperately needing to be in opposition to whatever Westminster is doing

One thing all Welsh women should do is sign the petition Update the Equality Act to make sex= biological sex. This is our only hope in Scotland.

I am curious whether Wales have a section 35 or equivalent in their devolution paperwork. It's presumably different to Scotland as they have a Parliament and Wales has an Assembly with fewer powers.
Is there the same system of checks and balances?

www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_noticeboard/4722618-petition-to-update-the-equality-act-thread-2

They also think genderism is a popular ideology amongst young people and are hoping to get the youth vote. They are simultaneously hoping those over 30-35 won't notice/ don't care about the stuff they're bringing in.

This is a gamble for two reasons. One, will the genderist youth actually bother to vote? Two, will voters not notice the furore in Scotland?

I always come back to this. Labour and the other parties who promised to save the working class, solve generational poverty, revive the industrial heartlands, stop the NHS sinking, do something about the failing education system - they have no idea how to do it. None that will not take a generation or more of effort and heavy taxation and sacrifice. And it takes brains and vision, facing down unpopularity and hard graft, qualities sadly lacking in most modern politicians.

So in a small space of time they create a new class of "the most oppressed" , "the most important social issue that needs addressing in modern times", "the most urgent mental health issue" etc etc. They create the problem and solve it in one fell swoop. Not by creating new third spaces, no, just solve it by telling women to budge up and share, so give up their rights. Easy fucking win, let's all have a parade.

And if they don't "solve it" another easy win - the opposition are phobes, throw the phone phone book at them like Nicola Sturgeon did, it's not our fault we failed, it's all the nasty phobic women (and men) - who mysteriously changed from being left wing, LGB/anti racism campaigners, green warriors, anti poverty campaigners, feminists to being the OPPRESSOR.

I’m Welsh and also an ex-Welsh Government employee.

We are brought up with the history of English oppression over us. I think this brings about a certain intent to do way England wouldn’t (free prescriptions, reduced student fees etc). Along with a potentially more “caring” approach to the population that allows lobby groups like Stonewall an open door to spread their bile.

I’m furious about this. Have signed the petition etc.

It's Mark Drakeford and Stonewall and Labour. Years ago Stonewall took a group of poor, sad, vulnerable young transpeople to lobby Drakeford. He was overwhelmed with sympathy for their terrible plight and since then has refused to meet with or listen to anyone who doesn't think a bunch of white, middle-class young people are the most persecuted section of society. I've been told by my MS (my Welsh Assembly member) that Stonewall Cymru is separate from and quite different to Stonewall in London: it's very convenient for them to believe that. I wonder what happened to all those poor marginalised young people who lobbied him years ago? I wonder how many of them are still trans? My guess is that many of them grew out of it.

Drakeford is a former social worker and has a son with ASD who was sentenced to eight years in 2018 for tying up, torturing and raping a woman. Drakeford was married for 46 years until his wife's recent death and appears to have been a dedicated husband. How that squares with him his contempt for women's rights I don't know. There's been speculation that the son has transitioned while in prison but it's probably just rumour.

People who knew Drakeford when he was teaching at Cardiff University (which is up to its neck in queer and Pomo theory) thought he was a reasonable man who would respond to rational discussion on this subject, but as I said earlier, for the last four years he and his cabinet have refused to have any contact with women who dissent. He looks like a kindly, bumbling uncle but he's leader of Welsh Labour which has a total stranglehold on Welsh politics and therefore Welsh life for more than 20 years. He doesn't need to listen to anyone: he knows that Labour will always win and can do what they like and there'll be no consequences. Same as Scotland: it's the stranglehold of a single party that has enabled Sturgeon to go loco. Democracy in the devolved nations isn't working and the gender ideology debate is really showing this up. Both the Scottish and Welsh parliaments need a second chamber to keep them honest. There has to be major reform.

I also agree with the previous poster. Wales is determined to be different to England, which has its occasional benefits — free prescriptions and free parking at hospitals — but can also result in knee-jerk rejection of good stuff coming out of Westminster. I think this results in a lot of political virtue signalling. It's Wales's Achilles heel, this tribal attitude.

I completely disagree with this.
Wales has a Labour government and people in the Labour party as well as PC and Lib Dems have been persuaded by some trans arguments.

Wales also has a Parliament, but yes the powers are different.

"I also agree with the previous poster. Wales is determined to be different to England, which has its occasional benefits — free prescriptions and free parking at hospitals —"

Oh dear. Free prescriptions are not there to be 'different from England'. It's a socialist policy that makes sense in a national health service free at the point of use. Do you think that if England had free prescriptions that Wales would suddenly make theirs paid?

The whole point of devolution it to be able to make different decisions, where relevant (and possible).

@OneLongSmorgasbord i think you are right that does seem to play a part. I also think that it is largely driven by a woke be kind bubble in Cardiff. There is certainly no grassroots support here further west along the M4.

I was very closely involved with the free prescription policy. Jane Hutt was Health Minister and Mark Drakeford was her SPAD. There were absolutely talks about how it would never happen in England and the need to find the money to do it at all costs.

They didn’t protect the border in the first iteration meaning that people would travel from England to fill their scripts, costing the Welsh budget. It got revised pretty soon afterwards to needing it to be prescribed by a Welsh GP.

The Plaid leader Adam Price is firmly TWAW too. He and his same sex husband have had a child via surrogacy. I wonder how many trans women they considered for that role 🤔 Perhaps biology does matter after all.

And so what if it throws women under the bus. Like so many policies.

2 reasons to be different to England and to attract the younger voters

Wales has a Labour government and people in the Labour party as well as PC and Lib Dems have been persuaded by some trans arguments

They're not Tory though so the argument that they want to get one up on Westminster still stands. See also covid policies.