If your husband joked you were ‘nattering too much'

[AshTreesEverywhere]

Would you think this is an example of sexism?

Nattering is sexist as I dont think it's ever really applied to men, is it? Gossiping, nagging, same ball park.

I was more struck by the fact that “natter” is the kind of old fashioned word that people might have used during the war. I don’t mean old-fashioned as in no longer considered appropriate, I just mean straightforward old-fashioned like “frock” or “knapsack” or “elevenses”. I thought it rather suited a Royal.

If he'd said 'wittering' now. Well, death would be too good for him.

Honestly the amount of utter shite I read on here these days I'm not surprised men don't want to marry and I'm amazed how some of these mumsnetters manage to stay married ! All I've seen this last year is utterly batshit man hating women 🤣 it's boring now lol

not if you're nattering too much.

Oh come off it.

At the moment there is a long list of things that you can criticise the RF for, but this just isn't one of them.

It's clearly a joke, meant for public ears, nothing in the slightest bit sexist about it.

I would say 'natter' to male or female. It's isn't sexist, nor was his comment sexist, or meant to be sexist.

I'd wonder why I didn't remember getting married

😁

I don’t personally think ’natter’ is sexist in the way ‘nag’ and ‘gossip’ are, and it definitely seems to have fewer negative connotations (I think ‘gossip’ can be used negatively and lightheartedly and is possibly experiencing a bit of rehabilitation at present eg ‘two friends having a good old gossip’ but ‘nagging’ is always a bad thing).

I wondered if our differing opinions might reflect regional variation so I did a little research (unlike OP, who seems to have done a runner already)!

(Mumsnet loves deleting my drafts when I go off link collecting so I’m resorting to screen shots, I tried to leave the URLs visible, so that readers can follow up if they want to)

The way ‘natter is used has definitely changed over time - nowadays I think it’s most often used to describe friendly, enthusiastic chat that is largely inconsequential (perhaps easily derided if you don’t particularly value human to human interaction) but in the 1800s it was seemingly more or less synonymous with ‘grumble’

Weirdly, Dictionary.com makes the verb form seem more negative than the noun?

But thinking about it, perhaps something similar occurs with chat/chatting and chatter/chattering? if someone described me as ‘over there, having a chat with x’ it would feel a lot less judgemental than ‘over there, chattering to x’.

Vocabulary.com says to natter is ‘to chatter, to blather, to jabber’, but the examples they go on to suggest seem quite positive and friendly and I don’t think anyone would realistically substitute blather or jabber for natter when referring to a lighthearted phone conversation with a best friend!

Wordsense says that In Scotland, natter is synonymous with nag, so that’s one explanation for the sexist/negative connotation…

(to be continued… can only do 5 images per post!)

There are only 5 other posts apart from yours when you posted this. I'm honestly curious, could you show where in those five posts those things you say above happened.

Thanks.

I think it's more just an old fashioned word, I don't see it as particularly female or sexiest.

I wondered if he'd ever used it before (I know, a very sad life I lead), so googled "Prince William natter" and an article came up about him talking to two football players about sport and mental health. He was talking about the importance of friendship and was talking about himself and said sometimes it was important to sit and "have a natter" with friends. So he clearly doesn't see it as a specifically female thing.

Run husband, run!!!

So you are asking if it sexist, someone says no you whinge at that 'but it is' rightio

So what is the point of your question?

Apart from ‘cackle’ Merriam Webster’s synonyms don’t seem to be particularly gendered…

(and they also don’t seem very synonymous, she cackled to herself!)

And under the examples tab, where they list recent usage in the American press, you’d be forgiven for assuming that nattering is something men do and women try to ignore

(admittedly I am making the arguably sexist assumption that both Francis and the driver are male!)

In British examples, we have Cambridge hosting a One-All draw between the sexes and Collins presenting an array of nattering mothers, Germans, farmers and people of sex unspecified (but mostly mothers).

I’ll add these to my now very weird list that also features Romanian speakers in the USA, Donald Trump and Jerry Springer…

(tbc)

I don’t think the OP really thinks nattering is sexist, they just wanted a reason to criticise the couple. 🙄

Given your other post regarding William and Kate's visit today, you're just looking for another way to have a dog at the royal family. Although, I note your worship of Princess Diana and similar feelings to Harry.

Good grief. It was a jokey comment between a couple who are very obviously on the same wavelength and comfortable in each other's company. If we start having to analyse everything we say, even to our nearest and dearest, conversation, chat, badinage, chit chat is all going to be a thing of the past.

I accuse DH of wittering occasionally. Well, he witters a lot, I accuse him occasionally.

Op, you sound oversensitive and annoying. Do you enjoy being offended?

I accuse my DH of nattering. I didn't realise it was sex specific

That’s really interesting.
It is the kind of thing my uncle - late sixties - would say for having a chat, without meaning to be gendered. A Home Counties, south of England kind of word.

‘Natter’ is used by both Age Uk and an NZ Farmers’ association in campaigns relating to combating loneliness and improving mental health. All the NZ Farmers featured are chaps and all the Age UK charity staff appear to be ladies (but I suppose the male staff might just be camera avoidant)

The Jewish Museum in London’s website references a Yiddish natter, ‘a casual and leisurely conversation’, which is far more akin to the modern day usage I’m familiar with than the Scottish ‘nag’ or the Northern English ‘grumble’ that I found elsewhere on the internet.

I can’t find much else online that confirms or expands on the Yiddish reference, although I do now recognise that some of the Merriam Webster synonyms must be connected to natter via the Yiddish language rather than the English language (eg ‘schmooze’ and ‘kibbitz’).
Both Yiddish and English are West Germanic in origin, so presumably there is a shared root for natter much further back in time than the 1800s English usage?

Everyday is a school day!

(One more post to go!)

It would surprise me. DH is the natterer in the family. I'm the one more likely to want to move things along.

Not the point of the thread. But if true the visit failed. William and Kate's team shared on social media photos of William and Kate with no link to the donations page at the foodbank and no information about how to support the foodbank or even saying that public support was crucial. Nothing except look at William and Kate.

Looping back to the English 1800s version, which was the top hit on my first Google for ‘Natter etymology’, I’ve found two ye old sources…

One is from Cheshire (1877), where Gnatter/Natter mean ‘to gnaw into pieces’ and Nattered means ‘exceedingly ill tempered’ (but ‘knattle’ is the much milder ‘cross’ just a few miles down the road 😂)

However, when using the ‘knatter’ spelling, it is described as synonymous to ‘knagg’ and has the example of two stepdaughters soaking their scolding, knagging stepmother in a swill tub(!) because: no ducking stool.

And the other is from Lincolnshire (1866) where ‘knattering’ meant ‘finding fault in a provoking manner’ (how we now use ‘nit picking’, perhaps?) with the example ‘he is knattering’. ‘Natter’ also uses ‘he’ but the synonym ‘worrit’ means ‘worrier’.

So, perhaps the TLDR answer to OP’s question, ‘Is this husband being sexist towards his wife?’ is…

‘Only if he’s from 1877 Cheshire and spells nattering with a silent ‘K’!

(Bonus post)

ngl, ‘poop hath nattered sponge’ (‘the pup has torn the sponge to bits’) made me laugh wine out of my nose.