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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

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Original poster

Sharing Pronouns

28 replies

Stepuptowardsinfinity · 18/01/2023 16:24

I know this has been discussed a lot but I haven't come across it personally until now. I am doing a presentation for a client, who I can't afford to lose. They have sent me a template for my slides and it includes putting my pronouns against my name. I have just ignored this and put my name in but I don't know what to do if they come back and ask me to put in pronouns. I feel very strongly that asking me to share pronouns means they are asking me to sign up to a gender ideology that I don't believe in so ideally I would refuse. At the same time, I can't afford to annoy them as I am earning hardly anything at the moment and need the money. Any advice?

OP posts:

dementedpixie · 18/01/2023 16:31

Could an option be to put Ms/Mrs/Miss instead and then you are signalling you are female? Or say you don't mind how people refer to you.

Original poster

Stepuptowardsinfinity · 18/01/2023 16:34

Thanks. I hadn't thought about Ms etc though it is for quite a young, trendy company and that feels a bit stuffy. If I were being asked verbally I would just say to them to use whatever pronouns they wanted but it is on the template for the presentation that they want a few weeks in advance of the event, so it is in writing.

OP posts:

HipTightOnions · 18/01/2023 16:37

and then you are signalling you are female

Why would OP need or want to do this though?

Cronkywonkycrinkywinky · 18/01/2023 16:37

You could reply:

A problem with pronoun-stating is that it adds to the pressure on people who are uncertain or ambiguous about their gender identity to know where they stand.

So it can make someone who already feels bad about their gender confusion feel much worse.

Sophistry, but effective, I have found

SamphirethePogoingStickerist · 18/01/2023 16:38

Think of it as an invitation to pop your pronouns in that space, should you have any preference. Leave it blank as you don't. Easy.

If/when they ask just say "Oh, just the usual ones will be fine"☺️

Soontobe60 · 18/01/2023 16:40

Cronkywonkycrinkywinky · 18/01/2023 16:37

You could reply:

A problem with pronoun-stating is that it adds to the pressure on people who are uncertain or ambiguous about their gender identity to know where they stand.

So it can make someone who already feels bad about their gender confusion feel much worse.

Sophistry, but effective, I have found

Perfect
Id also add that “I am not prepared to share my sex with people as discrimination on the basis of sex is very real”

Original poster

Stepuptowardsinfinity · 18/01/2023 16:40

The annoying thing is that I do actually have a gender neutral name. I do have my picture on the slides though so it is bloody obvious I'm not a bloke.

OP posts:

dementedpixie · 18/01/2023 16:40

HipTightOnions · 18/01/2023 16:37

and then you are signalling you are female

Why would OP need or want to do this though?

Was just an idea and then people would use she/her automatically without being told to use them. Or leave blank

frenchnoodle · 18/01/2023 16:42

"As I am sure you will understand I don't want to publically out my gender at this time. My name is what I am comfortable using."

goodmorningsunny · 18/01/2023 16:43

Just put your pronouns FFS, it's just a one off.

You're not going to radically change this client's mind by not including them, it's a pointless hill to die on.

dementedpixie · 18/01/2023 16:43

And by told I mean you're not 'commanding' people use a specific pronoun. I couldn't care less if I was misgendered but I look like a woman anyway

Original poster

Stepuptowardsinfinity · 18/01/2023 16:46

goodmorningsunny · 18/01/2023 16:43

Just put your pronouns FFS, it's just a one off.

You're not going to radically change this client's mind by not including them, it's a pointless hill to die on.

I do get that but I have really strong principles and if I give in once, I'll feel I have compromised my integrity massively, which will eat away at me. I've left it blank and if they come back to me, I'll just say 'please just use my name'. I've no desire to get into an ideological debate with them but I will not ever 'do' pronouns.

OP posts:

Violetparis · 18/01/2023 16:48

I think your prepared response of 'Please just use my name' is a good one. I will never do pronouns too.

Userwoozer · 18/01/2023 16:52

Please just put my name
sorry, but I don't feel comfortable adding pronouns

They won't know whether you're GC or whether you're sensitive about your "gender". It's also a true statement.

Crouton19 · 18/01/2023 16:58

Can you just ignore it/leave it blank ? That seems to be what the majority of my colleagues do every time the email reminding us to update our signatures comes round.

Thesonglastslonger · 18/01/2023 17:01

Leave blank

If asked verbally just smile and say “Oh, I never do politics or discuss personal issues in the workplace, please feel free to refer to me however you like.”

If asked in email I think your only options are ignore it, or get in a debate you don’t want to be in.

nikkjay · 18/01/2023 17:04

As a person who was born a female judging by the fact that I have a vagina....I'd say... um what do you prefer to be called? Stop confusing everyone and just say what u want.. because I don't give a fuck what sex organs u have I just need to do my job. So get on with the pronoun bullshit so we can get on with our lives.

TheWitchesAreBackInTown · 18/01/2023 17:09

Good response.

I have a name mostly given to boys (thanks parents). When I have been asked I always say "take a wild guess" with a grin, but that's more face to face and with new colleagues, not clients. With clients I would do as you suggest or if push came to shove, I'd probably say I'm not comfortable with sharing my pronouns, which actually is the truth.

Original poster

Stepuptowardsinfinity · 18/01/2023 17:16

Some good advice here, thanks. It is slightly complicated by the fact that the work is through a third party (I'm a contractor) and they get me a lot of work. The third party organisation is also a fully paid up member of the TWAW crowd, so I won't get any support and will likely be dropped as a contractor if I rock the boat too much.

OP posts:

RaininginDarling · 18/01/2023 17:25

goodmorningsunny · 18/01/2023 16:43

Just put your pronouns FFS, it's just a one off.

You're not going to radically change this client's mind by not including them, it's a pointless hill to die on.

Just make the sign of the cross. It's just a one off 🙄

LK1972 · 18/01/2023 23:57

Wasn't it in the Yogyakarta principles that you should not be insisting on people declaring their pronouns? Would you consider saying that you're currently not sure about how you identify, you're on your 'personal journey' and you feel incredibly distressed and marginalized being made to decide your identity before you're ready, in contradiction to the above mentioned principles?

Really tough position to be in though, sorry you're having to work with such wankers!

MajesticWhine · 19/01/2023 00:06

I think leaving it blank is ok. Hopefully they won't push it. No need to explain.

LK1972 · 19/01/2023 00:10

Sorry, others put it in much nicer terms, should've read all the replies more carefully first

GrumpyPanda · 19/01/2023 00:31

Sure you aren't overinterpreting here? Just because it's part of a general template doesn't necessarily mean it's a huge deal to them. If it's a comprehensive template it'll have space for those who do set store by this type of thing. I'd go for a) ignore, then if that isn't possible anymore b) downplay.

LittleMissViper · 19/01/2023 09:18

If the client happen to question your omission, you could answer ambiguously that you have no preference on your pronouns.

Or, if you're feeling bold, tell them that you are reluctant to compel anyone else's thoughts or speech. Therefore you have intentionally left your pronouns unstated to give others the freedom to decide for themselves how they wish to refer to you.

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