Norwich - "bisexual capital" BBC article

[MorvenOfMalvern]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-64216989

The conflation if issues in this article is astounding!

Census results show Norwich has the highest number of Bisexual residents in the UK. Really good bits of the article discussing how safe the city feels and that people feel able to be themselves and openly out, show affection to same sex partners in public etc etc. All good!

But, it in the main talks about the undefined "queer community," and the focus is, "while Norwich generally feels a safe place, they are concerned about the treatment of trans and non-binary people.

"We saw this in the summer, with the protests and counter-protests for the Drag Story Time at The Forum.

"It was really nice to see the community of Norwich stand up for the queer community, but there was still a lot of rhetoric that was being said that was harmful."

The main case study is someone who, "identifies as non-binary and has a husband, but is also in a polyamorous relationship with a boyfriend and a non-binary partner."

Times you need Alan Partridge to ask the big question: what do you think of the non-binarialisation of Norwich city centre?

He'd be the perfect roving reporter...

These are sex people, Lynn

Can you imagine ?!

So, my feeling being, again, the LGB is utterly pushed aside for the TQ+.

I'm not LGB but of those who are that I have had conversations with at any level about these forced- teamingissues - they reject the term queer (and some find it hurtful/offensive/anxiety provoking), they believe in the importance of biological sex as they are same-sex attracted and reserve the right to define their sexuality, and they want to get away from the assumptions and portrayals of anyone not hetero being a stranger to commited or monogamous relationships...I can't imagine this article really ticks anyone's boxes really?

There was a letter in the Graun about use of the Q word from someone who found it offensive and hurtful. It was a thoughtful letter. They tweeted it, and some of the replies were just vile.

(I also really resent the suggestion that anyone opposed to DQST in any way, is equally somehow a threat to LGB people...)

twitter.com/guardian/status/1614032071424458753?t=BF1OurBdy7NcukHa3_GXRw&s=19

The aggression in the replies is shocking (I still get shocked!) but also so clearly demonstrates this is a contentious term. Not ok for the BBC to use it so liberally maybe.

Well Norwich has definitely changed from when I was there 15 years ago!

As far as I can remember there was one (fairly small) gay club there and nothing else.

The university LGB society then had a debate about becoming LGBT because there was one (very vocal) trans women. As far as I'm aware the LGB society was very small.

TBH this article sounds like a completely different Norwich to the one I knew (unless it has transformed dramatically in 15 years), gay people were almost unheard of and that wass also the case at the university.

The university (like a lot of places) had a very vocal student union whose views were imposed on students and definitely were not representative of the student population.

Well, I found the assertion that, ""If you're in the queer community in any regard, most of the people you know are bi," to be an odd one.

So who knows what any of this actually means. Because it clearly doesn't mean what it used to. And we know that the definition of Lesbian is very different for TRAs, and we know that lots of LGB people reject the term queer....and the person in the article is bi and queer but also ""identifies as non-binary and has a husband, but is also in a polyamorous relationship with a boyfriend and a non-binary partner." There's a chance this person is male or female with 3 male/2 male 1 female partners, so is then...

(I mean who cares, they can do them and if all consenting etc) but..I'm just not sure what on earth the article is trying to convey.

@MorvenOfMalvern Yes, I'm seeing a lot of heterosexual relationships in the article and whilst I know that at any one time a bisexual person is either in a heterosexual or homosexual relationship, I don't think I'm seeing any true bisexuals in that article.

What difference does a LGBT population make to local businesses? The trouble with Gen Z is that they believe that "silence is violence" and that every business has to become political.

Norwich being on par with Brighton?!? I really find that hard to believe and that if people got out of their echo-chambers they'd find something very different.

...And that was.. Freddie Mercury of Queen, with I Want to Ride My Bisexual... hang on, that can't be right....

The difference between Norwich and the other cities mentioned is very small, by my maths there are more bisexual people in Brighton overall.

The first male professional footballer ever to come out started his career at Norwich City FC, Justin Fashanu. Perhaps the commemorations of his death and the Proud Canaries have contributed to the feeling of being comfortable in public.

I'm now hearing lots of posts narrated in my head by Alan Partridge 😬

Reading that men feel comfortable to walk around holding hands without fear, is both something to be genuinely celebrated but, that this noteworthy is also a stark reminder that this can still feel like "luck" or unusual or brave, and that is sad/frustrating/scary and a reminder there's a long way to go.

Why the conflation with all the rest of the <waves hands>, I just don't understand.

🤣🤣🤣🤣

If only I could add the Alan Partridge shrug gif.

I'm seeing a lot of heterosexual relationships where one partner describes themselves as non-binary, therefore the other partner assumes that they themselves must be bisexual.

Do you have a link to this handy? I'd be interested in seeing it.

www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jan/13/please-dont-use-the-q-word

@Birdsweepsin thank you.

@garlictwist here's the link to the tweet replies too. They're not nice.

It's interesting isn't it, that your identity has become something that has to flex in response to someone else's.

Reminds me of the use of c1s for example. Or T3rf. Having those used as forced descriptors despite you rejecting them, them being factually untrue etc. Or no one knowing what anything actually means anymore.

The conflation is probably because Norwich is a small rather isolated city with a smallish population of all these different types, so they are more mutually supportive than they would be in a bigger city where different groups would have different places to go. There are probably just not enough L, G, B, T and etc people in Norwich to fragment.

Good points @AmaryllisNightAndDay but why does it have to be that a discussion ostensibly about bisexuality ends up only really talking about the NB and T (again)? The overshadowing never seems to go the other way ime.