Telegraph: NHS trans plans will make maternity care ‘the next Tavistock’, midwives warn

[ResisterRex]

Wearily familiar. I'd be surprised that maternity care is somewhere where this is happening expect I'm not. At the core of this ideology is rank misogyny, so it makes absolute sense to see this happening in this location.

It's good though, to finally see that the profession concerned (midwives in this case) are fighting back. Dr David Bell is also quoted in the piece, pulls no punches.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/01/11/nhs-trans-plans-will-make-maternity-care-next-tavistock-midwives/

"Midwives are in revolt over new NHS transgender training plans which “could be a repeat of the Tavistock scandall_”.
NHS England is recruiting a group to run “gender inclusive trainingg_” across 40 NHS maternity services, such as trans-inclusive language and pronouns.
The sessions with up to £100,000 taxpayer funding will also include online resources, information posters and “best practice examples of how to care for trans and non-binary birthing people”.
The supplier, which will be decided this month, must have “a track record in trans awareness training” and will deliver classes for midwives, maternity support workers, nurses and others.
But 300 doctors, nurses, midwives, psychologists and other health workers have now written to NHS England demanding the plan be placed on “immediate hold” as it has “no evidence base”.
The letter to Lizzie Streeter, NHS England’s “national LGBT programme manager”, on Jan 9, which has been signed by 2,000 people in total, warns: “A scandal similar to Tavistockk_ could be repeated in NHS maternity services due to poor research and the influence of advocacy organisations.”
The Tavistock and Portman NHS Trust’s sole child gender clinic for England is being shut down by the NHSS_, following years of criticism over activist interference."

Archive link:

archive.ph/m0wa9

David Bell:

"David Bell, formerly a staff governor at the Tavistock, said: “As someone who was instrumental in exposing the damage done to patients by an unthinking acceptance of ideologically based claims, which had no evidence base, I am shocked at this repetition of ideology again trumping careful examination of the evidence and little thought as to the likely damage.”"

I’m a midwife. I’m in two minds about this.

Transmen are entitled to access care. That care should be personalised and sensitive. In the same way that all care should be tailored to the needs of the individual.

However, that should not be at the expense of other women/families. We don’t need extensive training for a very small minority when the funds could be allocated to training for issues that are genuinely pressing (eg. The disproportionate number of BAME women who die during childbirth, mental health and suicide, SUDEP, cardiac complications etc.).

Training regarding trans families could literally just be boiled down to ‘don’t be a dick’. No one needs a whole day of training or whatever to be told to use the pronouns they are asked to and to be polite.

I have no issue with trans individuals. They are just as entitled to good care as anyone else. If they want me to say chestfeeding instead of breastfeeding, it’s really not a massive issue. It’s just not something that needs a huge focus. Maternity services are on their arses, this is not a priority.

twitter.com/WeAreWithWoman/status/1613446282059874310

Successfully paused!

'We’ve done it! The £100K NHS trans maternity training programme that would have covered 40 Trusts has been paused! Why is this important? It was based on flawed research and was linked to activist organisations'
...
'This may be one of the first times a major programme based on flawed research and linked to gender activist organisations has been prevented in the UK public sector. At least for us in the maternity sector, it is a watershed moment and gives us great encouragement that ideologically-driven schemes with no evidence base will have no place in NHS maternity services. End.'

Wow!!! Great news

"I have no issue with trans individuals. They are just as entitled to good care as anyone else. If they want me to say chestfeeding instead of breastfeeding, it’s really not a massive issue. It’s just not something that needs a huge focus. Maternity services are on their arses, this is not a priority."

This just about sums up the majority view on most "trans issues" I think. As does the idea that the guiding lotto of "don't be a dick" gets you a very long way. And it is more widely applicable, significantly cheaper and less cumbersome for service provision to roll out...

There were TWO so far as I've ever seen. From 2017 to Feb 2021:

Why are the language police trying to wipe out women?

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/d1157740-6d57-11eb-ba86-e516f9df6e0a?shareToken=25847fbec69d05f659a5c8b6ccbfdfd9

There were TWO so far as I've ever seen. From 2017 to Feb 2021:

Why are the language police trying to wipe out women?

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/d1157740-6d57-11eb-ba86-e516f9df6e0a?shareToken=25847fbec69d05f659a5c8b6ccbfdfd9

In the same way that all care should be tailored to the needs of the individual.

Yes. The needs of the individual. Unfortunately trans health care is about demands. It’s a consumer driven system, not evidence-based.

Brilliant news!

Will have zero negative effects on the very very few female people with TQ+ identities giving birth (was it two so far?) and avoid major negative affects on the thousands and thousands of women giving birth daily where they and their staff need to get on with the job without politics getting involved. Or enforcing careful demonstration of decentering and offending of women for political purposes.

I think they need to collect some data how many trans men are giving birth. We know from the latest census that 0.5% of the population identify as trans. There are about 620,000 births a year in England and Wales. If trans men/people identifying as non-binary are giving birth at the same rate as other women, they would make up 3,100 of that figure. That would mean each maternity unit would see about 15-20 trans men each year on average.

That is already a small number, but I would guess that the number is far lower than that because a) if you have gender dysphoria then you're less likely to want to do something uniquely female b) some trans men (I don't know how many) are taking testosterone, which will reduce their fertility, or having hysterectomies, which will remove their ability to get pregnant altogether.

I do think that that trans men who give birth will have particular needs, and these relate mostly to the potential harm done to the developing foetus by testosterone and the mental health vulnerabilities of the mother. I don't know how much research has yet been done into either of those topics.

This was never about transmen. The number of pregnant transmen is tiny, and more importantly they already get personalised respectful maternity care.

This was about controlling women’s speech. It was about making ‘breastfeeding’ and ‘mother’ forbidden words in the medical profession and later, all public bodies.*

It was about erasing all female-centric language, as part of the ideological agenda that denies there are any important differences between transwomen and natal women, and seeks to prioritise the whims of transwomen over natal women’s dignity and safety.

It was about, wherever possible, diverting public money away from women’s needs and putting it under the control of trans activists, the vast majority of whom are men who hate women.

• (It didn’t even make sense, ‘breast’ can refer to men and does so in the bible, eg “he beat his breast in anger” but since when did actual facts matter to trans activists.)

Re @Thesonglastslonger'end note - men get breast cancer, too.

No end of websites / webpages on the subject, including the NHS www.nhs.uk/conditions/breast-cancer-in-men/

Breast refers to a specific part of the chest. Chest refers to the whole of area of the body between the neck and the abdomen, the thorax.

Chest cancer refers to cancers in the thorax, breast cancer only to those in breast tissue.

@Thesonglastslonger

👏👏👏

@ProserpinaProserpina
If you read the letter you’ll see that the authors agree with you about compassionate, personalised care. The are just trying to protect the 99.9% of women from what Thesonglastslonger describes.

Excellent post.

And sadly, you're absolutely right as has been proved over and over.

Anything exclusively about females is a target to activist organisations.

Transmen are entitled to access care. That care should be personalised and sensitive. In the same way that all care should be tailored to the needs of the individual.

This is very true. This training seems focused on language and experience for trans mothers.

I would suggest that rather than increasing stress around language (some NHS trusts threaten their jobs if they get patient pronouns wrong) on already stretched staff, they should be focusing resources on looking at the impact on the baby if the mother has very high testosterone levels or as in some cases intends to take testosterone while breastfeeding. Also any common complications that the mother may experience as a result of double mastectomy.

In my experience, all expectant mothers in maternity services just became ‘mum’ - no names. If any woman in a maternity unit has an issue with being called ‘mum’ then I would have concerns for the ongoing mental health of that individual and their ability to put baby first.

Do we know if there have been any studies on the impact on the baby of these things?

Midwife:

How would you like to be addressed?

Are there any aspects of your identity or culture that you would like us to understand?

Trans-awareness training done.

they should be focusing resources on looking at the impact on the baby if the mother has very high testosterone levels or as in some cases intends to take testosterone while breastfeeding. Also any common complications that the mother may experience as a result of double mastectomy.

Far more important. But identity ideology gives huge importance to performance, and minimal importance to facts.

Agree completely. Individualised care for the tiny amount of females who need a few thoughtful language accommodations. No witch hunts for the occasional slip ups that might occur especially when things go wrong and emergency life-saving measures might trump searching for the right pronoun. Options to opt out if some midwives genuinely feel they cannot be guaranteed to remember to address the birthing female in front of them as 'he' or the 'father'. Because even with the best of intentions, when you're professionally immersed in such a profoundly female experience it requires such an overriding of instinct to use male/neutral pronouns. Unless of course, you want to instill such language across the board in the NHS. Then that's a big, fat 'no' from me.

Can’t Transmen just write what they want in their birth plan? And trans groups can work to give information of what to put it?

I agree that more BAME women dying should be a higher priority when time and funds are scarce.

Great post Thesonglastslonger.
Every time anyone explores the background to these initiatives up pops a man who claims to be a woman yet displays contempt and hatred for women. They have no place in influencing healthcare, education or public policy relating to women or children.

I have no issue with trans individuals. They are just as entitled to good care as anyone else. If they want me to say chestfeeding instead of breastfeeding, it’s really not a massive issue. It’s just not something that needs a huge focus. Maternity services are on their arses, this is not a priority.

you do you. I did breastfeeding which is a specific concept.

And while i agree that it really does boil down to "don't be a dick" i wonder why so many resources might be allocated to the miniscule number of transmen giving birth, and not directed to actual midwifery services?

also: I don't get how being pregnant, which is biologically a function that women only have, matches up with "living as a man". It is bonkers. But in the name of "don't be a dick" I'll go along with it.

But bloody norah. Breastfeeding. Women. Use the words, and if you have a trans birthing person, use their words.

It’s not just trans men though….

fake pregnancies should not be handled by OB/GYN services, that is stealing resources. Frankly? they need mental health services. I don't mean it unkindly, but. No.

What a headline. MIDWIVES REVOLT!

NHS U-turns on transgender plans for maternity care after midwives revolt

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/01/13/nhs-transgender-plan-maternity-care-midwives-revolt/

Archive

archive.ph/l19JQ