Mail on Sunday: "MPs are urging major high street stores to scrap unisex changing rooms following a surge in women suffering traumatic encounters with men"

[ResisterRex]

Article on investigation revealing trauma of women using changing rooms. Miriam Cates is quoted:

"Nobody is saying all men are a risk but if you are a predatory man you now have an open door – literally – to vulnerable women in a state of undress. I really hope these big companies wake up to what they are doing because it is not safe."

Also Rosie Duffield:

"It’s completely unacceptable for major retailers to deny women and girls a right to change in private."
Maya and WPUK feature too.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11270459/Feminist-campaigners-demand-unisex-changing-rooms-scrapped-amid-reports-traumatic-encounters.html

Examples given include the following, with virtually zero public support for mixed sex spaces such as these:

"One mother said that while taking her teenage girl to M&S for her first bras, they encountered a man emerging from a cubicle with his testicles exposed.
Another mother tweeted how at another M&S store, in Exeter, a man left open the door of his cubicle in the ‘gender-neutral’ changing rooms, exposing himself as he tried on trousers without any underwear.
A woman complained and the man was then escorted out, while protesting.
Another mother said she had banned her 13-year-old daughter from going clothes shopping alone after discovering her local H&M provides only unisex changing rooms.
On Mumsnet, a woman recounted how she had been secretly filmed in a unisex changing room.
Our investigation has uncovered many criminal cases involving sexual assaults, voyeurism and harassment in unisex changing rooms.
This year a Met Police officer was given a suspended prison sentence for covertly filming a woman in a Primark dressing room.
H&M, John Lewis, M&S, Monsoon and Primark no longer offer female only spaces after transgender activists called for unisex changing rooms – despite a survey showing that 98 per cent of the public wanted single-sex spaces."

I could be very cynical and say it could be for the same reason they won't listen to women or research, but react when something goes viral and attracts attention.

Which is that image and snatching the momentary opportunity for personal mileage out of something currently the focus of media attention/polishing personal and party PR matters. And actually caring about people and issues and engaging with them in a responsible way for long term social change doesn't. Soundbite and signalling politics.

No it isn't. The equality Act allows for sex discrimination in certain circumstances, what we need is enforcement.

Urgh....the state of that M&S response.

Taking twitter seriously is probably the reason, come to think of it.

This is the root of all sorts of evil.

Anyway, very welcome news. It's shameful that these companies fell for the pressure in the first place. It's also shameful that it takes the bad publicity of that young woman's tik tok video, rather than any genuine concern for women's safety.

But we take what we can get. Here's hoping the likes of M&S and H&M follow Primark's lead. Asap.

1. A requirement that gender neutral provision be made available in addition to single sex spaces in all public spaces.

2. A clear message to the TQ+ political lobby that female only spaces are essential for the access, equality and inclusion of females, and that these spaces are therefore protected by law. And that sex is a fixed fax, and that other people's beliefs and access to society requires that this is recognised by law regardless to it placing boundaries on male freedoms and choices.

3. Gatekeeping and legal action taken against male TQ+ people who continue to attempt to force entry to female only spaces and to intentionally attempt to remove equality, access and resources from females.

Got it. Thanks Boudica

I predict some epic tantrums and demands from men that the poor sales assistant proves they're not a woman.

Female only changing rooms will only work if they mean proper females.

Until that happens, then any single sex facilities are more dangerous for females to use.

This

I think the 98% figure was from a Sex Matters survey.

sex-matters.org/posts/updates/why-do-single-sex-services-matter/

Still, before Margarita anyone tries to rubbish that survey, the YouGov tracker on public toilets is quite clear that 88% of people want to retain some or all public toilets as single sex facilities.

It’s whopping 6% that want only gender neutral toilets.

yougov.co.uk/topics/philosophy/trackers/support-for-separate-toilets-for-men-and-women-and-gender-neutral-toilets-in-public-spaces

Do you think men and women should have access to separate toilets in public spaces, restaurants, pubs etc? Yes - 88%

Do you think there should also be a gender neutral option? Yes - 38%

I would be interested to know what percentage of the the 38% would agree with the statement "all publicly accessible spaces should have gender neutral toilets in addition to single sex, and if this is not possible for reasons of cost or money they should be forced to shut"? Or whether mst would say "gender neutral is an ideal if there is the money and space, but if they can't be provided then no big problem".

IMHO there should not be gender neutral spaces - people who want single sex spaces don't need them, and people who might benefit them don't want them.

I hadn't posted on it so I didn't see a deletion message and I didn't want to start a thread asking where t had gone. There were about 50 or so posts when I last looked at it.

Oh I'm going to check my internet history and see if there is anything there.

Yet again we need to be clear on headlines and reality.

Too many people believe that Primark have scrapped unisex changing rooms. They haven't. There will still be unisex changing rooms with "provisions" for female-only spaces.

Will other high-street stores scrap unisex changing rooms? Unlikely, but they'll probably just provide some token (not enough) female-only changing rooms.

Agreed ReunitedThorns

None of them are going to admit that obeying the demands of the queer theory fanatics has given the predators access - just as women pointed out it would. It's going to be a painfully slow reversal with twisting and turning to try to avoid a pile on from the trans bullies.

This was always going to happen. The reason that providers decided to go for unisex changing areas is because it's easier to ignore women.
It's really brought home to me how little our needs are given genuine consideration, yet we are constantly expected to yield to others.
I'm so sorry for all the women who have been embarrassed or offended or felt or been threatened by this. It shouldn't have happened in the first place. You've been the collateral damage for a social experiment.

100%

They have zero interest in legislating to protect women's rights. They have zero interest in protecting women full stop. Sure they put a male paedophile in a women's jail this week.

Having let the genie out of the bottle, they are just going leave this in the hands of the market. The Tory government has fucked women's rights in the UK.

Primark never used the word female. They said provision for women. As far as I know they have been asked hundred of times in twitter what definition of women they are using but this has been met with radio silence.

Yes let's hear them define woman. All of this is absolutely despicable. It should never have reached this stage.

Yes, it allows for sex discrimination in certain circumstances, but it doesn't mandate it. So you can't force retailers to have single-sex changing rooms if they don't want to. They are behaving within the law.

If you wanted to force them to have single-sex changing rooms, you'd have to pass legislation, and the reason that would be quite complicated is that you'd have to think, not just about retailers, but all the other scenarios in which you would want to mandate single-sex provision (eg hospitals, prisons, rape crisis centres etc). That would entail amending the Equality Act, which would be a big undertaking, and would probably run into quite a bit of opposition.

Easier, therefore, for MPs to urge retailers to have single-sex changing rooms.

Women should have the option if single sex spaces if they chose.

So that means that there should be shelters that are female only, hospital wards etc.

Prisons should be 100% single sex.

It doesn't mean there should not be the option of spaces inclusive of transwoman. If you are a female who doesn't think its an issue then go ahead and use these spaces.

But every woman should have the choice of a female only space. (And I am deliberately using woman because only those of us born female are women).

all the other scenarios in which you would want to mandate single-sex provision (eg hospitals, prisons, rape crisis centres etc). That would entail amending the Equality Act, which would be a big undertaking,

yup and that is exactly where this is by necessity heading.

All this is slapping sticking plasters with jolly faces over an increasingly gaping and rotting wound. It's not going away. The evidence that this does not work for females is stacking up daily. The exclusion and subordination of females is increasing, and they're tax payers, voters, this is male supremacism by the back door.

I have zero patience for it's all a bit tricky and messy and a lot of male people will kick off and send flying monkeys. People have been warning about this right from the start when it would have been a whole lot easier to manage.

But damn straight, we now need legislation that female humans have a legal entitlement to their own spaces for hospitals, prisons, rape crisis, anywhere in fact where they are vulnerable, regardless of whether or not male people agree or are happy about it. Because frigging male people are not the frigging owners and overseers of female people and need to get a fucking grip.

And now we have male people this entitled, this badly behaved, this determined to openly remove privacy, dignity, autonomy, language and everything else from females lacking any conscience or good will in doing so, and apparently absolutely no basic social contract or boundaries? Yes, it will have to be fixed in law. And gatekept by law. However long that takes.

We need new laws put in place that spell out that single sex spaces are for those of each biological sex only & that having some scrap of paper to say you are allowed to pretend you aren't a man still doesn't give you access to womens spaces or roles.

Until then, until every woman boycotts these stores completely (& avoids them online so those companies have to choose between staying in business & considering womens safety & dignity) this will continue.

These companies make it clear that they hate you, but still expect you to spend money in their stores.

Yes and staff need training that is crystal clear. It will not be a single sex space if men who say they are women are let in. That would make it mixed sex.