Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Positive Guardian article on LGBA v Mermaids

44 replies

HeadAboveHeadBelow · 15/09/2022 06:41

Good positive article www.theguardian.com/society/2022/sep/14/lie-of-gender-identity-spurred-founding-of-lgb-alliance-court-told
Reassuring to see anything supportive of this position in the left wing media.

OP posts:
IvyTwines · 15/09/2022 11:11

@Kellie45 "Remember guys it will not be the Guardian who is sued when this social experiment on children is found to be a lie and the lawsuits come rolling into the NHS. It will be us, the taxpayer."

And I bet their cheerleading articles, like the one on 'Hannah' the Roblox gamer (so many red flags in that one) will mysteriously vanish from their online archive.

bellinisurge · 15/09/2022 11:20

@IcakethereforeIam , they always give TRAs the last word. It's how they "get away with " publishing more sensible articles.
My view is "Let them speak to as wide an audience as possible". They do the work for us by showing themselves up.

canyouextrapol · 15/09/2022 11:24

When it's mermaids etc talking I don't even know what gay and straight mean any more. If you can't have a sex then you can't be attracted to someone of the same or opposite sex.

Brefugee · 15/09/2022 11:28

the last few lines of the article, howerver, are not so easy to digest.

Igmum · 15/09/2022 12:06

Agree canyou it's ridiculously confusing. I think the problem is - as others have said - that LGBA sees homosexuality as same sex attracted, whereas Mermaids see it as same gender attracted. So, to Mermaids, a heterosexual man who identifies as a woman is a lesbian and therefore homosexual. Makes my head spin. I hope the tribunal lawyers manage to point this out to the judge.

Baaaaaa · 15/09/2022 12:14

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

I am only following on here but I believe she means straight in their new identity.

She was responding to discussion of over representation of lesbian teens seeking refuge in a masculine identity (transing the gay away) who are "straight" after transition, by force teaming them with adult heterosexual males who are " lesbian" after transition (not straight) And saying overall more trans people are straight (I.e. same gender/opposite sex attracted)

Whilst it may well be true, in absolute numbers if you include straight males who become trans women so "not straight" anymore and straight females with body dysmorphia/ autistic traits etc. Who become " not straight" as females who are now "males" but remain attracted to males.

It is not true in a relative sense because a greater percentage of same sex attracted youth are seeking transition,compared to the percentage in the whole population.

Its an ideological linguistic knot.

Baaaaaa · 15/09/2022 12:16

Argh * "not straight" in their new identity.

It's like trying to wrestle with jelly!

ImNotAnExpert · 15/09/2022 12:30

Belinda said 'not straight', which is close to meaningless.

Under LGBTQIA+ catechism, this could mean:

Women who are attracted to women, men, neither, or both.
Men who are attracted to women, men, both or neither.

They've rendered the words we use to describe sexual orientation utterly without meaning. Which is why we increasingly only see the initials of the acronym, which shall Never Be Sundered, while words like 'homosexual' are verboten for reasons.

RoyalCorgi · 15/09/2022 12:35

NotBadConsidering · 15/09/2022 08:48

It is not a “positive” article from the Guardian. It’s an article where they have reported the facts of the case and the words of the people spoken in court. It’s straight reporting. You know, journalism. It demonstrates how far the paper has fallen that it gets faint praise for not publishing a piece of Wi Spa-type propaganda on a gender issue for a change.

It only seems positive because when the words are straight reported in a case like this it’s pretty obvious how bonkers gender ideology sounds.

I agree. When newspapers report on court cases, they are obliged to be as neutral as possible and report what was said in court. They are not allowed to introduce any editorialising - though of course it is possible to be selective about what you choose to quote.

But it is interesting that the Guardian has chosen to report it. A couple of years ago they simply wouldn't have done.

parietal · 15/09/2022 12:43

TinselAngel · 15/09/2022 07:52

I love that the author is called Amelia Gentleman

Amelia gentleman did fab work uncovering the wind rush scandal

KCandtheSunlightBand · 16/09/2022 07:11

I note that the follow up piece is at No. 1 spot in the Guardians ‘most viewed’ list.

ImNotAnExpert · 16/09/2022 08:04

Here's how the twitters are responding: twitter.com/guardian/status/1570498609581330434

DameMaud · 16/09/2022 08:09

NotBadConsidering · 15/09/2022 08:48

It is not a “positive” article from the Guardian. It’s an article where they have reported the facts of the case and the words of the people spoken in court. It’s straight reporting. You know, journalism. It demonstrates how far the paper has fallen that it gets faint praise for not publishing a piece of Wi Spa-type propaganda on a gender issue for a change.

It only seems positive because when the words are straight reported in a case like this it’s pretty obvious how bonkers gender ideology sounds.

YES!!!

WolverineBluey · 16/09/2022 10:06

TinselAngel · 15/09/2022 07:52

I love that the author is called Amelia Gentleman

I'm intrigued by this. She's an excellent in-depth feature writer but never usually called on for everyday court reporting or hard news. I wonder if she is digging deeper on the subject? That would be something.

Good to see the discussion on Twitter. I can't see the Guardian has put a link on Facebook, where I imagine they'd get a great deal of the kind of discussion they don't want btl.

Rubidium · 16/09/2022 13:33

I'm intrigued by this. She's an excellent in-depth feature writer but never usually called on for everyday court reporting or hard news. I wonder if she is digging deeper on the subject? That would be something.

Interesting comment made by AG on her Twitter feed:
“This has been a fascinating case to follow
Close analysis of the meanings of the terms sex, gender, lesbian, homophobia, transphobia, same sex attraction, gender identity
There's a lot going on (Queen) so hasn't been in the paper, but all coverage here"

twitter.com/ameliagentleman/status/1570718802949861379

I also wonder if reporting on this case will prompt her to look more closely at this issue. AG has a good track record on investiagtive journalism, most notably the Windrush scandal.

titchy · 16/09/2022 13:46

TinselAngel · 15/09/2022 07:52

I love that the author is called Amelia Gentleman

Sister IL of the former prime minister.

RoyalCorgi · 16/09/2022 15:04

She's an excellent in-depth feature writer but never usually called on for everyday court reporting or hard news. I wonder if she is digging deeper on the subject? That would be something.

Yes, I wondered this. Court reporting is pretty specialist and they usually use dedicated court reporters for it. So either she's switched roles in the Guardian or, quite possibly, as you say, she's digging deeper, which would be fantastic. She is a superb journalist. I would be surprised if the Guardian is letting her investigate, but stranger things have happened, I suppose.

And as titchy says, she is married to Jo Johnson, Boris's brother and former government minister. She even wrote about the height of the Windrush scandal, where she would do a media interview to talk about how terrible the government was, and then her husband would do an interview defending the government. Weird.

Kellie45 · 16/09/2022 21:21

Debbie Heyton (trans herself) in the Spectator is pretty scathing about the Mermaids litigation.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page