"Woman can't leave house without husband" - what have I just read??

[InvisibleDragon]

Article here:
www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/woman-who-married-high-profile-27870361.amp

WTF?

Some excerpts:
"As the pair firmly believe in a more traditional, or historic, type of family, Holly Joyce abides by 'what he says goes' when it comes to traveller husband Dougie, 34."

"she's had to 'give up' her old life, including her career as an air hostess."

"He wouldn't want me out at parties without him, we'd always go together. He's the man, so he can go out if he wants, but I'm the woman so I can only go out with him."

"he's very protective and worries about my safety if I'm out alone. I don't feel like I'm missing out because if I want to do something I just ask Dougie and we can do it together."

"My family were worried at first, but as soon as they saw how well he looks after me and how respectful he is, they soon approved."

"Dougie expects the house to be perfect, and to be looked after when he comes home from work. He doesn't even make his own drinks. It's quite different to my past relationships and it took some getting used to at first, but he looks after me and provides for our family so I'm happy to do it."

Again, WTF have I just read?

This isn't traveller culture this is a man being controlling and abusive and his family condoning it. It's racist and offensive that this article (and presumably the TV show it is trailing) condones and normalises coercive control on the grounds that this behaviour is just a different culture.

"the traveller community who, for some reason, are untouchable."

The police are frightened/wary of intervening as they don't want to be accused of racism.
So, pubs & even the little village Co-op close when they know a function is about to happen - empirical knowledge.

She calls him protective. I'd call him possessive and controlling.

Yes, he's quite the catch.

I thought it was illegal but apparently it isn't.

This thread is hella feminist.

The issue is with promoting this as normal or acceptable as a model for other people. It's not. Women aren't children or mentally incapable.

I'm not sure the article is promoting it as normal or acceptable?

More wtf?

Mmm…And yet on the other AIBU thread they are a wonderful law abiding culture who are just misunderstood and horribly persecuted…

The wife is promoting it, Lass.

The wife is seeking publicity. I'm sure the majority of the rest of the world can look askance at that ridiculous article.

It isn't legal for them to leave school under 16. Councils normally have policies about encouraging school attendance, attainment, dual registration, engagement and support.
On the other hand, it's quite difficult to enforce anything when the family can simply move away.

This article isn't really helpful in breaking down prejudices towards the GRT community. I also find it very sad. Holly thinks she's made a lifestyle choice. She'll get a shock when she realizes that her husband believes she no longer has the right to make any choices - for the next 50 years.

Wellies I agree completely - the article describes some fairly egregious controlling behaviour and then effectively says that this is the norm in Traveller families.

Looking at the links to the report above:

• there are many Traveller families where this is not the case
• many Traveller girls have aspirations beyond marriage and babies, let alone being stuck in the house waiting for hubby to take them out.

The article normalises both abusive relationships and prejudice against Traveller communities.

Things are changing in the Traveller Community

m.independent.ie/irish-news/education/19-traveller-women-graduate-from-pioneering-university-course-that-they-say-will-change-lives-41554474.html

.

I just find it depressing that any woman would chose to be a martyred wife wholly in the control of her husband. It leaves her vulnerable by cutting her off from a support network, and ultimately shrinks her world. Men don’t make such decisions.

Presuming you are being sarcastic, I don’t see what’s unfeminist about that observation.

The woman in that university photo is called Cindy Joyce... same name as the husband. And he had a first wife. Now wouldn't that be ironic?!

And BTW they met in 2019, not 2020. The baby was fast work but not THAT fast!

I dont know why people are surprised, Ive worked with a huge variety of travellers, there are many who wouldnt marry out, or not marry to the partner before having children but there are plenty who will and who have children with a number of different partners

Its all very well citing that there are some (not many) traveller women who have aspirations but the vast vast majority dont and are not allowed to and that position is highly enforced not just by the wider community but the females within the community too.

DV is the norm, by the very definition of the statistics. Its not 100 percent of families but the majority.

The exact details differ, but yes, there are several groups where women are openly subjugated and expected not to study or work for pay outside the home. Male leadership is the rule and, in fact, patriarchy probably describes the system as older men have power over their sons, too.

The Amish are one such group. They attempt to live the same lives their Calvinistic ancestors lived at the time they arrived on the American continent (200 + years ago), and this used to mean that they couldn't adopt any modern inventions (zippers is one, I think), but lately the men can use modern machinery and electricity etc for their work while the women can't do the same.

The Amish are allowed to remove their children from school at the age of twelve (or were, the last time I checked). The reason was that not doing so would kill the culture, if I recall correctly.

That is an interesting older argument but similar in flavour to the current ones where minority cultures cannot be discriminated because it would be seen as racist or some type of -phobic. I have always thought that if cultures are given equal rights in this way, then individuals inside them probably can't get equal rights.

The other patriarchal groups in the US (more so than the mainstream) are far right religious groups such as the Quiverful which believe that women should have as many children as possible, to make soldiers for Jesus, I think. That, then leaves no time for women to work outside the home etc.
Most of these religious sects are Christian, but there are also some from the other Abrahamic religions.

Interestingly, it IS acceptable to critique the far right Christian patriarchal sects in the US for their misogyny as they are not seen as otherwise oppressed.

As an aside, this threat reminds me that my kind of feminism now faces two different fronts in these wars. This side which wishes to subjugate women and the side which wishes to erase women. Very exhausting.