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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

But What About The Men says the Labour Candidate

28 replies

octopusdweller · 03/05/2022 19:22

Aaargh! This is just a rant!

Had my two actual Labour party candidates at the door (one man, one woman) . Asked them about single sex provision for women and how they would support this as councillors, e.g. ensuring in commissioned sexual/domestic violence services that there were single sex services for women. The response from the man was brilliant - he spoke clearly and in detail about why this was important, what he would do, and how he was prepared to make himself unpopular to support it. So I had a conversation with him, and then the women candidate came in with ' but what about the men, men suffer terrible violence from women and they get hardly any services.'
So I raised the issue of women not being centred, but being deprioritised in favour of males, and in her response she chose to centre and prioritise men. Not women, whose services are being eroded, nope her focus was on men.

Now I agree that men need sexual violence/ DV services, but I was talking about women's issues and women's rights being eroded, and I object to this 'whataboutery' where she cannot hold her focus on women. And the fact that she chose to centre men in her answer shows me she does not understand the this issue of sex-based rights at all or its significance for women's rights.

It turned into quite the argument! Despite me saying I support men's single sex services she rolled her eyes and countered with how little men get compared to women. So I said women have greater spending as women have organised and campaigned hard for those single sex services and they are not being destroyed, as which she eye-rolled again and went on about men again.

I hope one can vote separately for the candidates as I would absolutely vote for him but not for her.

OP posts:
octopusdweller · 04/05/2022 15:56

CatSpeakForDummies · 04/05/2022 13:48

Firstly, the stats are misleading as the first thing a lot of abusive men do when confronted by the police is claim their victimhood, citing one time she threw something at him, for example. The scale is in no way equivalent, it is purely a power play.

We don't have refuges and domestic abuse services just to comfort people and make them feel better. Women need these services because often the abuse leaves them unable to set up on their own - having children leaves them emotionally and financially isolated. They are unable to work and they have cannot easily access money to put a deposit down on a new house, for example. There is literally nowhere for them to go, especially with children in tow.

I'd also be amazed if the form domestic abuse takes is as long reaching, do these men really need to be hidden away to save their lives, the murder rates do not suggest so.

The services you would design for men would be different, perhaps a first month deposit for a flat, support in separating belongings and lives without them being in a vulnerable situation, support groups - but you don't need secret places for them to heal and hide while bringing up their families. There is no good argument for shoe-horning them into the women's support services.

Well exactly!

OP posts:
octopusdweller · 04/05/2022 16:00

crumpet · 04/05/2022 09:02

“That’s an interesting point you raise, but it’s a separate point, which I’m happy to discuss so let’s come on to that once we have finished talking about women”

But I didn't want to discuss it! They were canvassing. I had one issue I was going to decide my vote on and I asked them about that.

One of her retorts was, ' This is really important to me'. I'm sure it was. But they were canvassing me. I am sure there are lots of issues important to her, but that doesn't mean I want to discuss them with her. There are lots of issues important to me too, but I had decided to cast my vote on this one issue of women's sex based rights so wanted her views on that.

If she wants to harangue random people about topics of interest to her I suggest she gets a spot at Speaker's corner!

OP posts:
NitroNine · 05/05/2022 17:10

@octopusdweller
How very selfish & unreasonable of you to think that the people asking you to select them as your elected representative[s] should actually answer your questions about things that will influence how you vote. You should feel delighted & honoured she was willing to so generously share something she cares about so much with you. You’ve probably decimated her confidence, insisting on centring yourself like that instead of just listening respectfully. Why can’t people just Be Kind? <cue tiny violins>

More seriously, am relieved the male candidate is someone you feel able to vote for.

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