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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Telegraph: Highgate School tells pupils "Modern feminism is ‘racist’ and only focuses on ‘straight, white, middle-class women’"

112 replies

ResisterRex · 18/04/2022 17:32

It has emerged that Highgate School held a forum on anti-sexism, in which pupils were told:

  • feminism only focuses on white, middle-class women
  • to assess how privileged they are
  • that others are worse off - especially trans victims
  • that LGTBQ+ are more likely to be victims of child sexual abuse.

The forum was held to respond to the fact it was featured in Everyone's Invited. It seems that their response has been to ignore what was said about the school and what girls experienced, and tell them they’re not the real victims. Private school or not, parents decide where their kids go to school. Children don’t make those choices.

Anyone know where evidence is for the line about LGBTQ+ being more likely to be victims of CSA is from?

The school’s response was ill-informed, for example the “case by case” line which is wrong as per the EHRC guidance:

“We know that girls and women are disproportionately affected by sexual harassment and violence and LGBTQ+ people are more likely to experience child sexual abuse and less likely to report sexual abuse than their peers.
“If or where tensions exist or are perceived to exist between two or more protected characteristics under the Equality Act (2010), we will do everything that we can - on a case-by-case basis - to ensure that safeguarding every child in our care remains at the heart of what we do here.
“We continue to follow our safeguarding procedures, offer support to all of our pupils, and be led by the guidance of the DfE, local authorities and the police, where applicable. We remain committed to working in close and transparent partnership with our pupils, their parents and carers, staff, and alumni.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/04/18/modern-feminism-racist-focuses-straight-white-middle-class-women//_

This whole thing has echoes of this thread:

The word 'woman' is misogynistic, racist and transphobic, apparently.
http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4532660-The-word-woman-is-misogynistic-racist-and-transphobic-apparentlyy_

OP posts:
EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 19/04/2022 13:13

You can't be serious.

I suspect it's not at all serious and material for screenshotting and sharing elsewhere.

if a girl identifies as trans that makes them a transman and TMAM so they will gain male privilege. It is not like…transwomen that not only are now oppressed as 'women' but worse…

Sheila Jeffreys' sex castes would agree with you. Ben GNC Centric is a lesbian and previously identified as transgender. In this interview with Benjamin Boyce, she highlights important issues (based on her experiences) within the community when the relevance of age, sex and their attendant power asymmetries are disregarded in a frankly disturbing way that recalls Sheila Jeffreys and her work on sex castes. (Middleaged transwomen led and spoke over them at 'youth gatherings' and told them to shut up and listen because transwomen are the apex of the oppression hierarchy, and teenage transboys are somehow at the bottom.)

'Coercion & Abuse in the Gender ID Community'
14 Mar 2019

Empressofthemundane · 19/04/2022 13:19

Who would send their daughter to Highgate?

Identity politics is so corrosive. It feeds everyone’s innate human narcissism. It’s not good for society or individuals.

Villagewaspbyke · 19/04/2022 13:21

@PurgatoryOfPotholes you are entirely right. No one should be telling girls they are privileged in the context of sexual abuse. Or in the context of any other type of misogyny. “You don’t matter, others have it worse” is not the sort of thing we should ever tell our daughters.

Villagewaspbyke · 19/04/2022 13:26

@OhSister interesting post

Doubletoilandtrouble · 19/04/2022 13:28

I am very uncomfortable with the thought that white, straight, middle class boys can identify as trans and suddenly be “the most oppressed”. That is why I am wary of the intersections (but open to be persuaded). Racism is racism, sexual assault is sexual assault and indeed transphobia is transphobia.

In the school case below, it appears that rape and sexual assault was covered up due to trans identity. That is not right.

www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/us/2021/october/va-judge-finds-transgender-teen-guilty-of-sexual-assault-in-loudoun-county-high-school-girls-bathroom-case

Lovelyricepudding · 19/04/2022 13:34

I am very uncomfortable with the thought that white, straight, middle class boys can identify as trans and suddenly be “the most oppressed”.

It is male privilege in action. Males must always be at the top - even by being the 'most oppressed'

Doubletoilandtrouble · 19/04/2022 13:48

Where does racism even come in this this?? It seems to be

a) “forget about feminists, they are racist anyway”.
b) “poor transpeople have it much worse than you so shut up girls”.

Why would anyone try to cut young girls off from the wisdom of older women Hmm . It seems to only be a wedge to separate us.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10730869/Modern-feminism-focuses-straight-white-middle-class-women-private-school-pupils-told.html

ResisterRex · 19/04/2022 13:50

@ScreamingMeMe

Divide and conquer. It's all part of the plan isn't it?
Absolutely it's divide and conquer. Women are starting to do a bit too well in raising concerns, getting a bit too organised, having a bit too much impact.

So what happens? Incoming: false flags. Who cares if some raped and assaulted girls get cut off from help.

That's what's going on here.

OP posts:
maltravers · 19/04/2022 14:24

Setting aside the unpleasant “what are you complaining about cis-het white girls” approach (which I deplore if it’s as reported) why is Highgate’s response to predatory male behaviour an optional meeting. I can’t imagine the predatory boys responsible for any offences lining up to attend. Surely this should be addressed during mandatory PSHE sessions..?

Staffy1 · 19/04/2022 18:46

I can’t read the link without signing up. Don’t suppose it explains how they came to those conclusions that it only focuses on white, middle class women?

LittleWhingingWoman · 19/04/2022 18:51

@goldernpie

Racism isn't as big a problem as the assault on women's rights that is happening every day now
I wouldn't agree with this, they are similar needs. I would also say disability and ageism need similar weighting. However in the context of the girls needs in that school, sure a balanced teaching about racism in all its forms (not just blaming white feminist women for it ffs) would be a good thing as a separate thing.

But the girls need conversations about how to keep themselves safe, how to support each other, how to come to terms with sexual abuse if they have experienced it, how to get help from trusted people, how to deal with difficult situations. How to watch for red flags in relationships. How to survive a sexual assault.

If they weren't talking about this and instead were being told to minimise their fears and their struggles then they are being let down.

mateysmum · 19/04/2022 19:03

Yep. This is all part of an attempt to discredit those nasty feminists who are campaigning to keep women's rights. If you can discredit women's groups by labelling them as racist etc, then why would anyone listen to them when it comes to defending women's sex based rights. TRAs have seen that they have lost some ground in recent weeks and so are attacking from a different angle. It goes along with the whole funded by right wing religious groups claims.

LittleWhingingWoman · 19/04/2022 19:19

@ResisterRex agree

ResisterRex · 19/04/2022 19:20

@Staffy1

I can’t read the link without signing up. Don’t suppose it explains how they came to those conclusions that it only focuses on white, middle class women?
The Mail has it if that helps:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10730869/Modern-feminism-focuses-straight-white-middle-class-women-private-school-pupils-told.html

OP posts:
MsGoodenough · 19/04/2022 19:26

Sounds like the premise of 'Against White Feminism' by Rafia Zakaria. A (white) teacher at my school has a display on her wall all about it....

KittenKong · 19/04/2022 19:33

It’s just another way to divide and conquor. Have women be suspicious of each other and deflect from the real issue. The SMT at that school need to have their heads examined. Stonewall?

ionlyhaveice4u · 19/04/2022 19:34

forget about feminists, they are racist anyway

That's simply not true, it was only a couple of months ago that everyone here was saying what a brilliant comedian Dave Chapelle was.

Doubletoilandtrouble · 19/04/2022 19:47

Sigh

Staffy1 · 19/04/2022 20:21

@ResisterRex, thanks. Well that doesn’t give any reason for the conclusion, but I don’t suppose there is one.

ChateauMargaux · 19/04/2022 20:28

I have downloaded white tears brown scars as recommended above.. and will hold my thoughts on which sex was the main driver of racism until I have read it..

Staffy1 · 19/04/2022 22:23

@ionlyhaveice4u

forget about feminists, they are racist anyway

That's simply not true, it was only a couple of months ago that everyone here was saying what a brilliant comedian Dave Chapelle was.

What is the point of this comment? If you think feminism is racist, give an example.
maltravers · 19/04/2022 23:43

We should all be concerned about racism, but this smacks of identity politics “top trumps” where white heterosexual women are supposed to be cringing at the bottom. I don’t see TRAs needing to sort out racism before asserting their needs. Why are women expected to do this?

Igneococcus · 20/04/2022 07:42

There is an article by Polly Vernon in the Times today. I have't actually read it (crazy workload this week) just putting it here for anybody who wants to read it:
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/0e716fae-bff5-11ec-b4e3-203ad1be3cbc?shareToken=f1ab7f436c6760c5c8fb242b13aa66b3

Truer43 · 20/04/2022 07:43

Staffy1 · 19/04/2022 22:23

@ionlyhaveice4u

forget about feminists, they are racist anyway

That's simply not true, it was only a couple of months ago that everyone here was saying what a brilliant comedian Dave Chapelle was.

What is the point of this comment? If you think feminism is racist, give an example.

Dave Chapelle is black and very popular on FWR.

Doubletoilandtrouble · 20/04/2022 07:56

I think the point of that comment is to pretend to be an FWR regular and do a version of “I have a black friend”.

Dave Chapelle did a comedy show a while back where he allegedly made fun of trans people. This caused huge demonstrations and he had one film (about Covid I think) cancelled. He subsequently made a follow up where he asked people to really listen to the jokes he made. He stated that he at all points were comparing trans people with black people and said that if trans people were black, things would look very different. He also made the point that he felt that he finally had come to a time where black men occasionally could stand up to white men - only for them to identity as women and tell him that he couldn’t say anything.

he did all this in a very funny way and this was discussed at FWR. My understanding is that he usually can be sexist but to be honest, I haven’t watched that much of him. Sexist men are usually not admired at FWR (who would have thought) but many women here seem to be able to separate out an argument from a person. It is amazing how few people who seem to be able to do that.

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