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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

16 year old grooming victim in Rochdale was arrested for being a madam

82 replies

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 17/04/2022 17:58

extract

Between 2008 and 2010, a child abuse ring that came to be known as part of the “grooming gang” phenomenon operated in Rochdale,Greater Manchester. Girls aged between 13 and 15 were trafficked, prostituted, raped and assaulted by the gang.

One victim was forced to have sex with at least 20 men in one night; another was forced to drink vodka, and was vomiting over the side of the bed while being raped by “countless men”.

The perpetrators would pass the girls to their friends, often to settle a debt. The victims, many of whom were from difficult backgrounds and therefore particularly vulnerable, were plied with drugs, alcohol and fast food, and then taken to “chill houses” across the north of England to be abused. One 13-year-old victim became pregnant and had an abortion. Some of the men involved were arrested, tried and found guilty. But not all.

One of the victims – given the fictitious name Amber inThree Girls, the BBC One drama about the abuse – was 14 when she was targeted by gang members. After a troubled upbringing, Amber had been placed on the child protection register as being at risk of sexual and emotional abuse and neglect. Craving love and attention, Amber was lured into a nightmare, subjected to repeated and often violent sexual abuse.

(Continues)

That nightmare should have ended with the arrest and trial of the perpetrators, but instead the police, Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) and even social services treated her not as a victim but as a perpetrator.

When we met in a hotel in Rochdale last month, Amber was accompanied byMaggie Oliver, a former police detective who walked out of the job in protest at the way Amber had been treated.

In 2009, when Amber was 16, uniformed officers arrived at her mother’s house, arrested her and took her to the police station.

“[I] can’t remember exactly what they said, but it was something along the lines of being a ‘madam’,” she recalled. “I didn’t know what that meant.” She was held in custody for hours before being released on bail. Her mother was not allowed to be with her during the interview, and there was no mention of an appropriate adult.

Amber had, under pressure from the abusers, taken some of her friends to the takeaway where the ringleaders operated from. She told me: “It wasn’t like a forced thing. It was like a casual, ‘Oh, bring your friends.’” She was a vulnerable child, being sexually abused, controlled and in fear.

(Continues)
No further action was taken against Amber, but it would be another two years before the CPS agreed that she should be treated as a victim and witness rather than a suspect. During that period, Amber – by now pregnant and living in a one-room flat – continued to be targeted by the grooming gangs. Although police interviewed a total of 56 men on suspicion of abuse, only a handful were tried. There were therefore many still walking free that had evaded detection.

(Continues)
Without Amber’s initial evidence there might never have been a trial at all. She gave the police a list, at an early stage of Operation Span, with nicknames, telephone numbers and other details relating to offenders. She later went on to positively identify a number of offenders, which enabled charges to be brought against them all.

(Continues)

But in court, she was portrayed by the prosecution and defenceas an assistant pimp. Because she was not involved in the trial, and therefore did not give evidence, she had no opportunity to defend herself. She was vilified and nicknamed in the press as the “Honey Monster”. Although a court order prevented her being named, everyone in her local community knew who she was.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/apr/17/rochdale-victim-i-was-groomed-at-14-then-the-courts-came-for-my-children

Why was there so much interest in placing responsibility on Amber? Yes, the victims of child abuse and repeated rape are groomed into introducing other girls into the horror. We know this. The priority should be identifying and criminalising rapists surely, not schoolgirl victims in denial about being rape victims?

OP posts:
DdraigGoch · 17/04/2022 22:53

@happydappy2

the police logs must surely identify the 2 men who drove off with the girl & attacked her...a drivers licence is identification of them. presumably they would have given their names, dates of birth, address etc.
Odds are the dog section ate them or something.

As for the case in the OP, surely the police are in breach of PACE for their treatment of Amber? Holding a minor without calling an appropriate adult for a start.

Hoppinggreen · 18/04/2022 09:10

A young female family member with SN was targeted by one of these gangs, we are in an area notorious for it.
When we realised and involved the Police they did take action but I do wonder if the family hadn’t been Mc and living in a large detached house in a nice area whether the outcome would have been the same .

Theunamedcat · 18/04/2022 09:18

They also came for Amber's children because they are at risk of sexual harm due to her being a madam took years for her to sort things out extremely traumatic

Sorry doesn't cut it

MoltenLasagne · 18/04/2022 09:27

When the misogyny runs that deep in the police force, what the hell can be done to fix it?

AlisonDonut · 18/04/2022 09:33

You have to ask yourself these days, what is the point of many of these institutions. They seem to just be able to get away with anything.

StrictlyAFemaleFemale · 18/04/2022 09:36

No-one worries about racial profiling, when they're doing stop-and-searches. No-one cares much about losing their job about black men still being more likely to die in police custody. It's only when protecting girls from sexual abuse that race becomes really important to be sensitive about.

Omg I never realised that before now. I never put the 2 strands together.

DragonOverTheMoon · 18/04/2022 09:43

This is awful. I would love to scoop Amber up and take her and her dc somewhere safe so she can start again. She's been through so much. I've done CSA training a few times around the case and as professionals we're horrified by how the girls are treated, yet in RL it's still happening.

Echobelly · 18/04/2022 09:48

It just goes to show how the system totally fails to understand exploitation of children. You can't hold a child who has been horribly used and manipulated for things that may seem like being part of the abuse. That's how the whole appalling thing is designed to work - not the 'fault' of a child.

Deliriumoftheendless · 18/04/2022 09:52

@StrictlyAFemaleFemale

No-one worries about racial profiling, when they're doing stop-and-searches. No-one cares much about losing their job about black men still being more likely to die in police custody. It's only when protecting girls from sexual abuse that race becomes really important to be sensitive about.

Omg I never realised that before now. I never put the 2 strands together.

It really is remarkable that child abusers worm their way into so many areas of life- education, youth groups, churches, entertainment industry, politics- but not into the police force, isn’t it?

It’s absolutely correct to say the police don’t seem concerned about accusations of racism when they are targeting Black people but CSA and it’s all sensitivity and concern (for abusers).

Whatwouldscullydo · 18/04/2022 10:05

I find it incredible how being seen as a victim is no longer a result if circumstances . No longer something happens to you. But a a role only achieved of you are the right person acting in the right way at the right time and the police like you. Crime is a crime and grooming is grooming what ever else a person and in this case a child has done ir has been involved In.

I hate how the police can get the credit fir and a pat on the back for arrests and shutting down sex trafficking rings and brothels. Yet that's as far as it goes. You shut it down. That's not the end of it. You cant expect the victims to just suddenly be ok .it was a huge part of their lives fir a long time. They had no one else but eachother. It shouldnt be ok to leave them high and dry because they played a part on something. How do they think that happened in the first place?

gardenhelpneeded · 18/04/2022 10:10

In Scotland we have the children hearing system which is very different to England. It’s similar to Scandinavian models. I used to volunteer on a panel. It would be interesting to know if there have been any similar cases of grooming gangs in Scotland and how the victims have been treated.

In the hearing system, the child is centred and the key principle is that children, whether they are offending themselves or having offences committed to them, face a lot of the same issues.

www.chscotland.gov.uk/about-us/

I just can’t get my head around how these girls were treated. We had some cases of young girls and older men and it was the girls’ safety and wellbeing that was seen as paramount.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 18/04/2022 10:19

Police forces don't worry about being seen as racist when using tasers, to the point that in Bristol, they managed to tase one of their own race relations advisors, after mistaking him for somebody else.
They're not experiencing any anxiety about using tasers, despite investigations finding that police officers tase black people for longer than white people.

No-one worries much about unfairly racially profiling brown people as Islamic terrorists either, including women. I know British (asian) women who've had awful treatment in airports trying to get back into the country after work trips! But a few blokes get accused of serial rape and they get the kid glove treatment. Odd...

OP posts:
cunningartificer · 18/04/2022 10:48

In think it's a perennial problem with young women who are sexually abused--because they don't always present as victims in the way men find acceptable they are seen as complicit. I suspect that the 12 year old wasn't presenting as a quiet middle class victim and so was more vulnerable. I've seen 12 year olds (dressed up, wearing makeup, drunk, arsey and sweary) where adults have forgotten they are children showing the signs of abuse, and just get annoyed by them as disruptive and difficult, completely forgetting their age. Even easier if the child in question is 15 or 17 for adults to inappropriately respond and again forget that they are CHILDREN.

Vampirethriller · 18/04/2022 11:00

I was beaten in the head with an iron bar by the man who was forcing me into prostitution. Someone called the police, who believed him when he said I'd attacked him first, and they told me that it's not illegal for a man to pimp his girlfriend if she consents.
I wasn't his girlfriend, I didn't consent, they knew, they didn't care.

Whatwouldscullydo · 18/04/2022 11:00

Oh vampire Flowers

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 18/04/2022 11:21

That's not even true, as far as I know. They may think it's the law though, due to their own misogynistic belief that women belong to partners, to do with as they like.

Vampire, I am so sorry that that you have been put through so much and that the police could be so useless.

OP posts:
crispsarny · 18/04/2022 11:26

@Vampirethriller I’m so sorry that happened to you. I read these threads time & time again, it makes me feel so incredibly sad, angry & powerless.

@PurgatoryOfPotholes what @Wauden said it sounds like they’re all in on it, evil, rotten & corrupt to the core.

Whatwouldscullydo · 18/04/2022 13:45

That's not even true, as far as I know. They may think it's the law though, due to their own misogynistic belief that women belong to partners, to do with as they like

Don't drs have protocols In place to ensure that any women undergoing a procedure such as termination or sterilisation ate not being coerced into doing so?

Recognised patterns of behaviour such as the partber/ father doing all the talking. Reluctance to leave the women/girl on her own etc

So drs aretarined in coercion but police are happy for men to consent to pimping theor partners ?

These two facts co existing surely isn't possible.

Whatwouldscullydo · 18/04/2022 13:46

All those women failed when police say shit like that Angry

Vampirethriller · 18/04/2022 14:58

@Whatwouldscullydo the man pimping me actually coerced me into an abortion. He didn't go with me but he was waiting for me. Nobody ever asked me if I was being made to do it against my will, they didn't ask me for a reason. Maybe because I was alone. I still hate the part of me that didn't tell them anyway.

Whatwouldscullydo · 18/04/2022 15:15

Sounds like your were failed in every way imaginable vampire

I am so very very sorry for what happened to you.

BarrM · 18/04/2022 15:26

@Grotbag81 - I’ve also heard and read about what is happening in Oldham. I am surprised that the news has not broken onto the mainstream press. If and when it does, and from the reports I have read about the corruption and complicity of the local council, the red wall will be utterly obliterated and consigned to history.

fluffiphlox · 18/04/2022 15:26

Does anyone know if these girls were in care or lived in the family home? Either way it would seem that they were let down not only by police but by their parents, carers, teachers, and the police. Any further info?

LK1972 · 18/04/2022 15:50

Delirium, your earlier post made me wonder what percentage of male police officers are arrested/convicted and if this rate is comparable to the rates of males in other industries that are known to attract predators. It should be.

If it's lower then they are being protected, by someone more powerful in the police hierarchy. Police may claim that their safeguards are so effective that the abusers don't get through, but many recent cases demonstrate blatant disregard of any safeguarding, including not arresting Wayne Couzens for indecent exposure.

The police treatment of these girl children is informed by misogyny so pervasive that they can't see the child abuse. But, on the other hand, there may be actual known predators being protected for corrupt or nefarious reasons, including by fellow abusers in power.

After all, this is the same police that refused to investigate and prosecute Saville for decades

LK1972 · 18/04/2022 15:58

And Vampire, I'm so sorry all of that happened to you, that's horrific, and please don't blame yourself for not being brave at the time. You were being abused, it changes our personality when it happens to you, for that period. I really hope you're managing to heal Thanks