PE - changing rooms segregated by gender not sex

[ffscovid]

DD is 11 (yr 7) and has just told me that in her school, biological boys identifying as female do girls' PE and use the (communal) girls' changing rooms. She's very uncomfortable about changing in front of a girl with a penis biological male and I'm wondering where I would stand with this if I was to complain to school?
I'm absolutely not transphobic but I am struggling to understand how one child's needs trump those of the 29 biological girls in their class, none of which want to be standing in bra and pants in front of a male.
DD says she doesn't mind the same child using the girls' toilets as they have separate cubicles. But the PE changing rooms is a bit different isn't it?

Totally different. Enquire as to the accuracy of your daughter's claims and complain if the response dictates.

Don't worry about how you stand. You have just demonstrated how wrong it is. Consent is still a thing and she clearly isn't consenting to this, from what you're saying.

Contact Safe Schools Alliance for information?

Absolutely not....I'd go bananas If this was my daughter. I am all for equality but this takes it too far, and those of us identifying as we were genetically made are being pushed aside for the sake of what's 'PC'

No reason why they couldn't have a separate changing area for those identifying differently

Could you focus away from the magic word transgender and ask the school how they plan to accommodate females (biological girls) separately from males (biological boys) to meet the need for females to have safety and dignity?

I assume the boys are there as their parents have asked for them to be accommodated as girls, and the school hasn't had the opposite message asking what support is available specifically for females based on biological needs.

The EHRC has confirmed that females require female changing facilities.

You are right. Establish facts first. “Are the changing rooms reserved for female students, or not?”

If not, complain that this violates your daughter’s privacy and dignity and is not compatible with the school’s duty to safeguard her.

Send the new guidance from the EHRC that exemplifies how institutions can use the single sex exceptions to achieve legitimate aims, then ask why they are not treating your daughter’s privacy, safety and dignity as legitimate aims.

Her needs are not altered even slightly by the other child’s needs, and there is no case to balance them (a separate changing space could be provided for one child who can’t change with other members of his sex).

Ask to see the Equality Impact Assessment. If a local authority school it should have considered the impact of shared changing facilities on the affected protected characteristics.

There can only ever be negative impacts on the PCs of female sex and religion in terms of loss of privacy and dignity. It would be interesting to see their reasoning and proposals to mitigate the impact.

Decision making in local authorities should be in accordance with delegated powers and policy, they should also ensure compliance with the public sector equality duty.

Here you are OP. Safe Schools Alliance have this covered here:

safeschoolsallianceuk.net/schools-resources-and-policies/

Girls have the right to have single sex facilities and not to be forced to undress in front of boys - no matter how they identify.

You don't have to be transphobic to know that a bio male in a girls changing room is wrong. My dd has a trans friend, and when she transitioned (if transitioning means wearing a skirt and calling herself *Sophie) everyone was comfortable and accepting because the transgirl used the separate toilet to change. I had previously told my dd that if a bio male wants or demands to use the girls changing rooms, then she and her friends are to queue up and change one by one in the toilets, telling the teacher they don't feel safe. This would cause enough chaos for a policy change. If there were any repercussions I would be meeting with the head and / or governors with like minded parents.

PutinIsAWarCriminal
Instructing that girls must go elsewhere to undress was a key part of some appalling trans guidelines for schools from the Crown Prosecution Service. In the end the guidelines were withdrawn rather than subject them to legal scrutiny which was a shame. But it's telling that there are so many people with these dodgy views in places like the CPS.
Personally I'd have done a deep dive into their hard drives - I've no doubt that would show up their real motivations.

Oh hell no! If I established from the school that this was in fact, true, I'd raise merry hell. I was an 'early developer' and can remember going through puberty, and how god awful the communal changing rooms were and that was with all girls in a GIRLS school. I dreaded PE. Got jokes made about my 'bush' from the bully clique. My grandmother (the only one who understood) bought me a humongous Egyptian cotton towel from John Lewis. The thing was truly massive so I could wrap myself from head to toe in it and put my undies on underneath. That was many years ago and I wouldn't go through the awkwardness of puberty again for love or money.

Sometimes we went to another school for PE to use their facilities. We had a ridiculous joint changing room for boys and girls separated by a wall that didn't go completely to the ceiling or the ground by several inches. Boys would attempt to peek over or under. It was horrible.

Girls deserve dignity and safety! Forced to undress in front of biological males, as budding teens? My god! Why are so many institutions seemingly ignorant about these basic needs for girls? Did they think we just had separation of changing facilities for centuries for fun or something??!

Mind you anecdotally, I have never been on the pill, and mostly worked highly paid jobs, and I can tell you honestly, in many businesses and institutions, unless you're a woman with influence, there is absolutely zero understanding of the most basic needs women have for things like extra breaks and toilets within a reasonable distance to change sanitary towels, toilets with sanitary products in etc. It's like men don't have mothers, sisters, wives, daughters, aunts who menstruate. Because of my relatively low social status I didn't realise that it was possibly the permutation of a social and institutional denigration(?) Intentional ignorance(?) of womanhood until fairly recently.

And this is why the needs of women and girls to places that aren't inhabited by men isn't taken seriously. Interesting to hear what the schools' response is.

The law is on your side, OP.

Whenever you talk to the school, remember to be really really clear with you language. Don't let them start talking about 'trans girls' when they mean boys. You don't need or nor should you have to describe them as 'biological boys'. Just call them boys.

And the word 'transphobia' is meaningless. Keep talking about the rights of girls. Where they put the confused boys is NOT your concern.

We are behind you, let us know how you get on

For 11 year old girls there is also the issue that many are on the cusp of needing bras but might not be wearing one yet. My daughter sometimes wears a crop top or vest, but sometimes doesn’t. It is important girls’ underwear choices are not dictated by the presence of a boy in the changing room.

@Genevieva

For 11 year old girls there is also the issue that many are on the cusp of needing bras but might not be wearing one yet. My daughter sometimes wears a crop top or vest, but sometimes doesn’t. It is important girls’ underwear choices are not dictated by the presence of a boy in the changing room.

Excellent point

What the school is doing is against the Equality Act. I wrote to my school about this exact issue recently after rumours a boy was in the girls changing rooms. I made an enquiry but go no answer and Safe Schools Alliance said to make an official complaint. I did this and copied in Ofsted and Safe Schools Alliance. Unfortunately I had to seek more clarification as I used boy and girl so wrote again and used male and female. I got a response saying no males were using the single sex services. I heard a couple of weeks later that the boy who had been using the girls single sex facilities had left the school.
My feing was that he was using the facilities and me pointing out the law meant they had to change their mind and tell the boy they could no longer use the facilities.
This is not transphobia it is safeguarding.
You don't need to even mention transgender just ask questions.

Good for you for complaining FemaleAndLearning.

This framing of safeguarding (of children and vulnerable people) as transphobia really boils my pee!

Sorry my last post did not work. Here is my communication with my school if it will help you. I wrote to them twice with no response so I put in an official complaint part of which I have copied here. I waffle a bit but this is because language has been so misrepresented, though it does show the importance of language and the need to be clear in communications.

Final response from school
Thank you for your further correspondence. Please accept our apologies that our previous response left you with further concerns. In answer to your specific questions.

1. Does anybody who is biologically male (regardless of how they currently identify) have access to the girls toilets, changing rooms or showers?

No

1. Do any biologically female pupils (regardless of how they identify) access the boy’s toilets, changing rooms and showers?

No

At XXXX School we do provide single sex changing facilities, showers, and toilets. We follow our safeguarding procedures and pastoral responsibilities to provide full support to ALL students. In the case of a student who feels they identify as a different gender; the Care and Guidance team will work with the young person and their family to best support their needs in school. This provision will include access to an individual changing/showering area and use of designated toilets which are also private.

Please will you point me to the guidance you consulted from the Local Authority about single-sex and mixed-sex changing rooms and toilets.

We are not aware of explicit guidance from the Local Authority about changing rooms. As part of our work with the Local Authority during 2020-2021, members of the Senior Leadership team and the board of Governor’s, took part in a training workshop lead by XXXX from the Local Authority focused on the Equality Act. XXXX also quality assured our provision and policies through the academic year.

Please let us know if you need any further clarification.

Response from school:
Thank you for your communication to us on the XXXX 2021 which we acknowledge. We always try to respond in a timely fashion within ten school days (they didn't it was over two weeks!).

In your correspondence with us you have raised three questions that we will address below.

Does single-sex provision of toilet and bathroom facilities exist?
Yes, across the site where toilet and bathroom facilities exist, single sex provision is available in all areas.

Does single-sex only changing and showering facilities exist?
Yes, all changing facilities are single sex and have single sex showering facilities

Was an Equality Impact Assessment undertaken if single-sex provision has been removed?
We have consulted and received training from local authority based on the equality act and how to implement this consistently and effectively. However single sex provision has not been removed.

XXXX School supports the needs of all students and based on this need we have facilities to support them.

Should any changes to our facilities be necessary in the future we would of course consult with families and students to ascertain their views on the matter.

Regular dialogue with our community is really important to us and we really do thank you for your communication. Please do let us know if you have any further questions.

My Official Complaint (using school’s online form)
I wish to complain about the lack of action of XXXX School to a safeguarding concern I raised by email on XXXX2021. The email was regarding the safeguarding of female pupils at the school in terms of requesting the status of single-sex provision (changing rooms and toilets). I wish to know if these facilities are still single-sex or in actual fact mixed sex (for example are male pupils allowed to use the female changing rooms and toilets?). If this change has occurred, when did it occur, who was responsible for the decision and what safeguarding impact assessments were undertaken? My email has not been acknowledged or responded to. I sent a follow up email on XXXX/2021 and to date (XXXX/2021) I have still had no response.

My follow up email

I am following up my email sent on XXXX2021 18:50 subject: "Removal of single-sex changing facilities at XXXX School?". I have not yet received any response.

I attach another document by the organisation Sex Matters sex-matters.org/ to help you understand why single sex provision is allowable under the Equality Act 2010. The following sections provide this:

page 10 When treating the sexes differently is justified
page 13 Further explanation of what “proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim” means? page 13
page 14 information on changing and washing rooms

I look forward to your response to this and my original email (below).

My initial email
My children, XXXX, attend XXXX School. Today XXXX has come home and told me that there is a boy who identifies as a girl at XXXX School who is allowed to use the female changing rooms. I know you will be bound by confidentiality so will not be able to confirm or deny this. With this in mind I am writing to make a general enquiry about the provision of single-sex facilities within XXXX School, as are legislated for in exemptions to the Equality Act 2010 that are designed to protect single-sex provision for women and girls. I have used guidance from Safe Schools Alliance to help me write this letter. I would appreciate some clarity on the following questions:
• Does single-sex provision of toilet and bathroom facilities exist?
• Does single-sex only changing and showering facilities exist?
• Was an Equality Impact Assessment undertaken if single-sex provision has been removed?
Although the terms ‘sex’ and ‘gender’ have been used interchangeably in recent history, changing political circumstances have made it necessary to draw a distinction between the two – particularly where legislation is concerned. ‘Sex’ refers to the biological, reproductive classification of people as either ‘male’ or ‘female’. ‘Gender’ refers to the social expectations, roles or stereotypes of each of the sexes. It is important to acknowledge the difference in order to protect both adults and children from sex-based discrimination.
Gender re-assignment is also a protected characteristic under the Equality Act. People undergoing gender reassignment have the right not to be discriminated against. However, they do not have the right to be treated as the opposite sex in all situations. This means it is right and lawful to exclude males from female single-sex changing rooms and toilets.
The Equality Act 2010 specifically says that single-sex exemptions can be used to designate spaces which are only for one sex, and apply to scenarios such as changing rooms (Schedule 3 part 7 sections 26-27) and sleeping arrangements (Schedule 23 part 3). The Act makes it clear that the above exemptions apply even with regard to people undergoing gender reassignment, as long as the exemptions are ‘a proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim’ (Schedule 3 part 7 section 28).
The legitimate aim in this case is the safeguarding of children: You may be aware of the recent articles in the national press on the increase in child on child sexual abuse and the alarming extent of the sexual harassment of girls in school
All children must feel safe in a school environment, and in this context it is particularly important that girls are able to change and sleep in a single-sex space. This is not about the intentions or otherwise of individuals. It is not up to girls and women to decide which males are safe and which are not and to act as gatekeepers when in law single-sex spaces are the gates.
As a parent I am frustrated that I have not been notified/consulted about single-sex facilities at XXXX school being abandoned in favour of mixed-sex facilities. I am also dismayed that girls are being given really mixed messages about their boundaries. The dignity and privacy of girls has been taken away. It gives the message to girls that if they accept males in their changing rooms at school then they should accept males in their spaces anywhere. Many girls will go along with a mixed-sex changing for fear of being called transphobic, yet this policy is sexist. At any point were the impacts of having males in females spaces on those girls who have been sexually abused been assessed?
What if you employ a man who identifies as a woman as a teacher, would this male be allowed in the girl’s changing rooms?
In addition to being sexist this policy of mixed-sex facilities, may also go against certain religious beliefs such as those of Jewish and Muslim girls and this should have been assessed as religion is another protected characteristic under the Equality Act 2010.
I have also attached the following documents which provide further detail on this important safeguarding matter:
Safe Schools Alliance Factsheet: Aims and concerns
Safe Schools Alliance Factsheet: Single-sex toilets and changing facilities
Transgender Trend: Equality law and statutory schools guidance – a basic guide
I look forward to hearing from you.

I really don’t understand how this is allowed.
Sorry I have no advice and I can see you’ve had many helpful comments. I’ve just read this and it’s left me so confused.

I’m only 22 but I can remember back to the changing rooms where some girls were even uncomfortable changing in front of other girls and would try not to show their bra and knickers too much. Let alone having to do all of that with another boy in the room? I don’t really understand what’s going on in the world😂 it must be ending lol

Thank you so much to everyone for your kind advice, especially @FemaleAndLearning for sharing all your correspondence.

School is closed for another week due to the holidays but I shall be tackling this matter at the start of term.

Glad that will help. Hopefully more people will write to their schools. Also check their Equality and Bullying policies. They may incorrectly use gender instead of sex.

I am all for people living how they feel they want to live. If you feel you are in the wrong body I understand that.
What I struggle to understand; and something that touches upon this issue is, if you want to be a female rather than a male then you clearly recognise the differences between the two sexes. What ate those differences in the mind of a trans gender person? What is a 'female' is ot a biological difference, is it the roles society dictates, ie: clothing etc. What exactly a person is identifying with? If its a biological thing ie: what ond looks like on the outside then those differences still stand no matter how person feels. I'd you are biologically male then you are. If its simply dressing amd looking like women do then anyone can do that but that's not what defines a female is it? And if it rhats what you think then a person only needs to cjsnge their clothes and role to be a female that sounds a little shallow and sexist as a person may dress and act how they wish, male or female.
I guess my question is what is the 'opposite sex' in that one wants to be it?
The only difference is biological isn't or? So if that's the case how can one act as if that difference doesn't matter? If it didn't why care that you are biologically male?
My question is what is a female in the sense that you are one?
If its thier body then the reality is you are not one. If its the mind then in what way? My brain is no different than a males brain!
I'm just struggling to find a good answer to what is a 'woman' in that a person feels they are one.
Basically what is a girl/woman funamentally? What makes a person 'not' a woman/girl. If a person says 'my body' is what makes me male rather than female then are they bot saying they are in fact male? What do people think being a woman actually is?
I'm only asking because I'm confused, a good answer is actually wanted, this isn't a way to trick people. I truly want to know.
Why are male/female changing rooms segregated? For what reason? It does seem to be one of a biological nature does it not?
Ps. I have trans friend and she's given me her opinioon on the changing rooms thing. I'm not a bigot I just don't understand certain things. Her answers center around the body being very important in sharing changing rooms etc.
Can someone tell me what is a woman that you identify as one please? That's all I'm trying to find out I guess. And i'm interested not critical.

Make 100% sure your daughter is right first. Then you can go in all guns blazing. And use the word ‘sex’ not ‘gender’ and insist they do the same for clarity.