Nancy writes for The Guardian

[Theeyeballsinthefuckingsky]

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/07/cancelling-lgbt-conference-government-conversion-practices-trans-people

It seems stonewall are responsible for the “conversation therapy = ECT” doing the rounds atm. I did wonder how all of a sudden that started being quoted everywhere. I assume sone kind of briefing had gone out

Not entirely relevant, I grant you, but I feel very strongly about it being used for scaremongering when it can be a life saving treatment when used in the right places.

My response to this thread title is: of course she does.

Mine too.

She just liked a tweet where Ed Milliband said British Cycling got it right. She has no idea what she's doing

@Theregoesmyhomebirth

Not entirely relevant, I grant you, but I feel very strongly about it being used for scaremongering when it can be a life saving treatment when used in the right places.

No. It is bloody relevant. People like my uncle are only alive, functional, because of ECT. It works for him. He takes comfort from the fact that if/when his meds fail him he could choose another session of ECT with every hope of it being as beneficial as it has been previously.

Reframing it as conversion therapy, as a cruel and dangerous intervention is fucking awful.

As I said, my uncle is gay, has had 2 maybe 3 ECT sessions and has benefited each time. He remains a gay man.

His experience, your experience, are the bloody point.

NK needs to shut up. Or maybe remember the L, the G, the B.

@SamphirethePogoingStickerist

Current ECT is a treatment of last resort for some of the most clinically depressed people. It is a treatment of choice, no professional enthusiastically suggests it, or administers it. It's done under general anaesthetic and is a life saving treatment for many - my uncle for one! He is gay. He has had ECT 2 or 3 times for his mania, it doesn't prevent him from being gay!

Fuck off Nancy!

Indeed. I know someone who was in a catatonic state from depression. ECT treatment was the only thing that worked on her.

But I seriously doubt that ECT is used anywhere for gender dysphoria. Everything but transitioning is seen by Stonewall etc. as conversion therapy, and that includes exploring issues such as body dysmorphia, trauma, internalised misogny and homophobia etc.

Everything but transitioning is seen by Stonewall etc. as conversion therapy

For anyone who may have missed this, the Micheal webberley tribunal is horrifying but an example of where affirmation only can lead and a clear lesson in why conversion therapy for the T is far more complex and nuanced than stonewall would have us believe

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4502351-Dr-Michael-Webberley

ECT is the most thoroughly regulated and audited form of treatment in the entire NHS.
Every treatment course is meticulously documented and the outcomes assessed, along with side effects, etc. The data are analysed and presented annually at conference.
I used to anaesthetise patients for it, and can attest that the success rate in severe depression was between 78 and 83% - as opposed to just 35% for antidepressants.
We knew many of the patients as regulars, who would come every few years when they had a relapse, and some attended for outpatient maintenance ECT - a single dose once every 3 or 4 weeks that kept them well enough to live outside hospital.
It angers me when uninformed people scare monger about a treatment that is lifesaving.
I wish they could watch an old patient of mine who was catatonic with depression- unable to eat, drink, speak or get out of bed - sit up for a slice of toast after his ECT. His gratitude always used to bring a lump to my throat.
Using electric shocks for conversion therapy is totally unrelated and barbaric. It was done decades ago - administering painful shocks to the genitals while being forced to look at gay porn - and nobody is suggesting that should be permitted for anyone, gay or trans.

As had been noted by either the EHRC or Sex Matters, gender identity would be put into law. It's a theological concept.

This nonsense that gender identity is immutable but the physical body isn't needs to stop.

And doesn't this concept fly in the face of the gender identity of genderfluid? Do genderfluid people undergo natural conversion therapy everyday as their gender identity changes?

What will happen to Nancy when public opinion turns I wonder?
Offshore puberty sweetie dispensary?

@LittleWhingingWoman

What will happen to Nancy when public opinion turns I wonder? Offshore puberty sweetie dispensary?

A naice post with Shelter, one of the women's organisations, NSPCC, has she done Girl Guides or Samaritans yet?