Always: 61% of young people have felt ashamed for having a period

[TeenPlusCat]

Ad just on TV as above

That can't be right can it?

Even if every single girl felt ashamed that would still make up only 51% of young people...

(sorry if this has been covered before)

@anadulthumanfemale can I ask would you care if it said girls? And if so why?

@Sophoclesthefox

And how, exactly does the language change help these youngsters who don’t identify as girls?

They’re still going to be getting their periods.

They will still have to cope with that, and all of the manipulation of language in the world won’t change that biological fact.

If they don’t think it applies to them, then they can ignore it, of course.

I’m not seeing how creating more obfuscation, more shame around the topic of menstruation by not even being able to say who menstruates is of any benefit to the vast majority of girls.

I agree with this.

In many ads for e.g. moisturisers, the strapline and/or voiceover will say e.g. '70% of women say it made their wrinkles less deep.' Then a faster voice or some small print will say 'out of xxx women surveyed'.
In this case, it could easily have said '61% of women and girls have felt ashamed for having a period' and then the small print 'out of xxx women and girls surveyed.' Then you know the sample size, and you've used the biologically accurate terms. People will by common sense infer that '61% of women and girls' means '61% of women and girls who are of menstruating age'.

Why should someone who doesn't accept they are a girl get upset about a statistic about girls? Surely it just means they don't think the advertisement is about them?

And what about the distress that having the words women and girls erased from language is causing actual women and girls? Or don't they matter?

You could even make the case from an ally perspective that young people who don’t identify as girls ought to be excluded from a piece talking about the shame that girls feel, because they are going to be impacted very differently from girls. The shame would be compounded, wouldn’t it?

I can’t imagine they want to spend a lot of time thinking about such unmistakeably, ickily female activities as menstruating. Perhaps it would be better to have a specifically targeted ad for them?

If, of course we really are only interested in proper inclusion and representation, and not, say, manipulating the language to make issues relating to women and girls literally unspeakable…

I think that's completely reasonable.

No one is pushed out. Nothing is lost. Except the time to read the small print. And if you aren't willing to do even that little for the sake of another's feelings, well, that's that I guess.

What about the girls.qjo actually want to he called girls? The girls who don't want to he seen as 'people' when it comes to puberty in the sense that they want their female experience to be recognised and to talk about it? They want to complain about it and celebrate it.

It's bad enough that so many of them feel ashamed of/by their periods. Its unacceptable that its now the very reason for their female experience (I.e. being GIRLS) that is also considered shameful.

Where is the empathy and inclusivity towards them?

I am wondering though if they did ask boys and girls, and a certain amount of boys answered yes just for a laugh.

Makes always look like a bunch of twats whatever the survey situation was.

@anadulthumanfemale

If it is only relevant to one of the sexes then you don't need to specify do you? It's common knowledge and therefore it doesn't matter if people or girls is used because everyone would know what it meant.

If everyone knows it is only girls why do you need to make it clear? It's already clear, isn't it?

Because there are ways in which to erase a sex class and this is one of them.

In addition, there are times for writing clearly, and this is one of them.

Exactly.

I have teen sons and daughters so the young person label makes me think that they asked a mixed group.

Did they mean

61% of girls with periods, have felt ashamed of them.

61% of girls with periods, have felt ashamed while having their period

Or

61% of young people think periods are embarrassing. (Boys can think this one only)

@anadulthumanfemale... its not compelled speech is the erasure of the words female, women and girls where the meaning is associated with a sex class and the use of those words only when it includes males that is the problem here.

@anadulthumanfemale... The not so small print on the advert actually states 'online survey 2030 young people aged 13-17 UK 2020'... so they have defined 'young' to be those most likely to be menstruating and referring to the small print absolutely does not clarify the issue.

Ah, so I wasn't the only person yelling at the TV screen. Good to know.

[quote ChateauMargaux]@anadulthumanfemale... The not so small print on the advert actually states 'online survey 2030 young people aged 13-17 UK 2020'... so they have defined 'young' to be those most likely to be menstruating and referring to the small print absolutely does not clarify the issue.[/quote]
Wow. So definitely wrong then, as they didn't even clarify in the small print!

If only there were words that advertisers or anyone else could use that differentiated between which sex could or couldn’t have periods.

This is from another thread... you can see the text on the screen.

So, as maybe this group were self selecting, maybe they do mean 61% of young people? Who knows?

If say 39% of respondents were boys who never worried about their periods, but 100% of the girls (the other 61% of respondents) did feel ashamed, then they end up with 61% of young people, but actually hiding the fact they meant 100% of the girls who actually get periods.

Unless of course the gateway question to the survey was either are you a girl, or do you have periods (which only biological girls/women can have), but then we are back to surveying girls.

Gosh, now I am having to guess what they mean. Wouldn't it have been so much easier if they had been clear in the first place?

wow we have suddenly increased our presence on this planet by over 10%, must be a world record in that.

I am so glad I buy supermarket own brand pads

Always: 61% of young people have felt ashamed for having a period

That makes no sense at all. 50% of young people don't have periods and never will.

If everyone knows it is only girls why do you need to make it clear? It's already clear, isn't it?

Well no it's not clear, at best it's exaggerated. 61% of girls is only 30.5% of young people so that sounds like a lot more than it really is. And if the statistic had been "40% of young people" then no-one could guess what it meant - would that mean "40% of girls so 20% of young people" (because only girls have periods) or "40 of all young people so really 80% of girls"?

@AmaryllisNightAndDay

Always: 61% of young people have felt ashamed for having a period

That makes no sense at all. 50% of young people don't have periods and never will.

If everyone knows it is only girls why do you need to make it clear? It's already clear, isn't it?

Well no it's not clear, at best it's exaggerated. 61% of girls is only 30.5% of young people so that sounds like a lot more than it really is. And if the statistic had been "40% of young people" then no-one could guess what it meant - would that mean "40% of girls so 20% of young people" (because only girls have periods) or "40 of all young people so really 80% of girls"?

Also do the states include trans and nb?

I bet a few transmen would really skew the figures.

I don't think it matters if the stats include transboys / nb girls. Quite potentially one of the reasons girls may identify as transboys is feelings around their body during puberty.
Periods are a biological function. The statistic quoted needs to be clear whether it includes the biological sex that can't have periods, or not.

When people put up half-baked surveys on NFP Surveys I often find myself commenting on the quality of the questions. Doing 'fair surveys' is part of GCSE maths syllabus. It isn't rocket science.

I'm totally lost. So they asked a load of young people how they felt about having periods? Only 50 percent of those people could possibly have a period. Yet 60 percent were ashamed about having a period? So were a load of biological men who self identify as bleeders saying they feel ashamed of their imaginary period? What am I missing?

@TeenPlusCat

I don't think it matters if the stats include transboys / nb girls. Quite potentially one of the reasons girls may identify as transboys is feelings around their body during puberty. Periods are a biological function. The statistic quoted needs to be clear whether it includes the biological sex that can't have periods, or not.

When people put up half-baked surveys on NFP Surveys I often find myself commenting on the quality of the questions. Doing 'fair surveys' is part of GCSE maths syllabus. It isn't rocket science.

But thats the point they would be more likely to be ashamed of their periods.

@anadulthumanfemale

If it is only relevant to one of the sexes then you don't need to specify do you? It's common knowledge and therefore it doesn't matter if people or girls is used because everyone would know what it meant.

If everyone knows it is only girls why do you need to make it clear? It's already clear, isn't it?

How does everyone know that it's only relevant to girls? Only because at some point in everyone's education, someone had to admit the truth that menstruation is unique to the female reproductive system.

This survey obviously was only for anyone who has had a period. Anyone who has not had a period is obviously not included as part of the 100% possible.

@anadulthumanfemale how do you know? How do you know who was included in the survey. It might be that 20% of respondents were girls who were yet to start their periods.