Woman's Hour on Maya Forstater today (9th March)

[WinterTrees]

Checking in with today's WH offering.

It's an Emma Barnett day, so hoping it's going to be good.

Maya did really well, she spoke her mind, she was in control of her responses and unshakeable in her beliefs. I found it really tough to listen to but I’m glad she gave her a hard time in a way because it really showed listeners Maya knew her stuff. It was aggressive but like a few posters have said a strong interviewer needs to challenge the interviewee, it’s not a cake walk or a bunch of women patting each other on the back. I really respect Maya Forstater she’s brave.

I haven’t listened, but is it possible that EB was pushing the “worst case scenario” issue as it is very much a transactivist argument to say we’re always pushing bad apples and worst case scenarios? Might she have been giving the opportunity for Maya to explain when it sometimes appears that way?

Sorry posted too soon - last sentence should read:
The truth matters and the problem with Emma’s interview stance is that she is treating gender identity as equivalent to sex. They are different and require different treatment. Gender identity does not make the realities of sexed bodies disappear.

Repartition, repartition, repartition.
Be nice.
Don’t hurt anybody’s feelings.
Don’t say / tweet anything someone may find hurtful.

Basically, we should all self censor.

Bloody awful interview. No delving into the issues like The Times award to PB. Completely missed the point there. Someone who hadn’t publicly declared themselves as TW & yet, picks up a woman’s award. Someone thought it was appropriate to give PB the award & PB thought it was appropriate to receive it.

I don’t like EB interview style. Brusque & combative. With no attempt to probe why MF et al believe what they do. No attempt to untangle the ‘don’t offend’ argument from why we should be able to have the very difficult rights v responsibilities discussions.

Concrete thinking masquerading as forthright. Piss poor.

I too had a BBC interview on the radio, much to my massive surprise as a member of the public campaigning about a local issue.

My DH prepared me that they might be not be nice and play devil's advocate, which they absolutely did.

Perhaps that's what they do as others are saying. (To my greater surprise I held my shit together and won my argument) I'll have to listen to this interview thanks.

I haven't listened to the interview yet but I will say that Barnett has covered the issue pretty well on the whole. She hasn't shied away from it unlike wet Jane Garvey who is so worried about upsetting her woke children that she's put her feminism in the attic under the Christmas decorations.

Barnett is combative but if she hadn't been, the TRAs would have been up in arms

I thought Maya was great - she is so calm with her responses. I wasn’t sure where Emma was going with her questioning at all. The whole discussion is about where sex matters not where it doesn’t.

Wasn't it clear what I was getting at, DysonSphere?

There is no need even to assume ill intent (that is, to assume the worst-case scenario), or an age gap, in order to see why teenage Scouts of opposite sex should have separate tents and washing facilities.

Oh I see more clearly now @FebruaryRainandSleet thanks for clarifying.

It was Maya who raised the man in the girls' shower scenario to demonstrate her standpoint that she would differentiate between social/professional situations in which she as willing to use someone's preferred pronouns and safeguarding situations in which she would draw attention to sex based differences.

Then Emma asked her why she jumped to the worst case scenario.

I thought Emma adopted the exact same techniques as she used interviewing Nancy Kelley: asking specific questions that demonstrate she has researched the topic, being polite, and giving the interviewee, time to respond. I have become a huge fan of Emma. She is being a good journalist who understands her role and doesn't give interviewees a free ride to say what they want.

I don't think the interview got to the really important points. Maya got to them I despite the questions rather than in response to them imo, but I don't think the level of hostility was out if place. As a pp said, it was similar to the stonewall lady. Kathleen Stock had a much friendlier interview but that just makes the other side think gc's are getting an easy ride. Much better to be grilled but still come across as calm and get your points out there.

I don’t like EB interview style. Brusque & combative. With no attempt to probe why MF et al believe what they do. No attempt to untangle the ‘don’t offend’ argument from why we should be able to have the very difficult rights v responsibilities discussions.

Same. I thought Maya did brilliantly and I was getting frustrated that it appeared Emma was "you can have the views but just shut up about them" which completely misses the point.

I see Maya emailed overnight about it being good practice for cross examination!

EB is not a gender critical feminist (in public anyway), and it was a mistake to have lauded her as such for just doing her job in previous interviews, where any amount of critical thought and enquiry would have seen the holes in the ideas of the likes of Stonewall's Nancy Kelley, and the person that ruined women's sport with a hugely flawed report and complete logic failure, Joanna Harper. You don't have to be GC to see any of that shit shower what it really is. I think EB used this interview to show she is a neutral, detached journalist, not a mouthpiece for one side. I thought Maya handled it marvellously.

I just caught up on Sounds app. Great to hear Maya speak so calmly, sensibly, with so much dignity. She answered the questions and put her point across and didn't get riled by the interview style.

I'm a big fan of Emma Barnet, she's done very well with this issue before interviewing Nancy Kelly and making her look a fool, and Kathleen Stock and showing how amazing she is.

I thought EB did go on a bit too much though about pronouns when other issues are more relevant to the vast majority of women. And in fact pronouns aren't really what Maya's case is about. But, I'm actually glad EB gave her a hard time overall. It showed that Maya could stand up to the pressure of intense questioning and remain completely logical and still come across as a sympathetic figure. I think Maya will have peaked a lot of people in this interview! She did so so well. I have a massive girly crush on Maya she is one of my heroes.

And I suspect EB is actually a GC feminist, she's just very good at doing her job and hiding it. Curious questioning is the way to change other's minds, it's been proven in studies. So she's doing an amazing job.

I love all these amazing women. So proud of UK feminists, when Maya mentioned we're leading the world I felt so emotional.