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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Mhairi Black, piece by Rowan Moore in Guardian: have people seen this?

29 replies

theDudesmummy · 26/02/2022 17:23

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/feb/26/mhairi-black-shows-how-to-debate-trangender-rights?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

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lovelyweathertoday · 26/02/2022 17:28

It's a completely fluff piece with no genuine content. I can't believe that's what passes as a comment column these days.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 26/02/2022 17:30

Why are we treated to a clueless opinion about women's rights from the Guardian's male "architecture correspondent"?

Goatsaregreat · 26/02/2022 17:51

Meh. He's a self interested man who's previously written a piece with their trans child trashing JKR, Magdalen Berns, Lisa Littman & Maya Forstater (funny that). He hand waves away social contagion in relation to teenage girls, autism and the conflict between trans demands and the rights of women.

www.theguardian.com/society/2021/apr/18/being-trans-transgender-rights-issues-rowan-moore-felix-moore

Hopefully his knowledge of architecture is more factual /knowledgeable. Hmm

WorkingItOutAsIGo · 26/02/2022 17:58

Thank goodness a white man with a beard and no expertise nor skin in the game has arrived to tell us how to think!

IvyTwines · 26/02/2022 18:12

A very well-connected white man at that - his brother is Tory Peer Baron Charles Moore, the fox-hunting ex-editor of the Telegraph. And I'm sure there's no social contagion at play at all and it's pure fluke that so many transboys and transmen pull the name 'Felix' out if the air.

Blogblogblogblog · 26/02/2022 18:24

If Mhairi becomes a mother I think she’ll start to think differently about toilets. Especially if she has a daughter. You know when you start letting them become independent and they go into the toilets for the first time at a restaurant. And you say ‘ok’ cause your daughter doesn’t realise you have kept an eye on who’s been going in the toilets (and it’s the ladies). If a man then goes into the loos when your daughter is in there alone, how many would get up like a shot and go in. Doesn’t matter what the man looks like or what he’s wearing or even if it’s mixed sex or not Mhairi, bet you’d go in.

aliasundercover · 26/02/2022 18:29

Trenchant though she was, she didn’t seek to diminish her opponents. “I don’t doubt that there are legitimate concerns,” she said, “but the answers are also out there.” Whether or not you agree, her words demanded that you engage with the substance of her arguments, not at the level of a Twitter spat.

The same Mhairi Black who calls women 'transphobic cunts' for standing up for their rights?
Some people just see what they want to see.

Rainbowlaceshelp · 26/02/2022 18:29

I wouldn't be so sure blogblog. Plenty of mothers seem quite happy to use their children to demonstrate their woke credentials

Bellusaurus · 26/02/2022 19:19

I am genuinely baffled - was that the highlight of the speech? The answers are out there? What's meant to be impressive about that?

McDuffy · 26/02/2022 19:22

@IvyTwines

A very well-connected white man at that - his brother is Tory Peer Baron Charles Moore, the fox-hunting ex-editor of the Telegraph. And I'm sure there's no social contagion at play at all and it's pure fluke that so many transboys and transmen pull the name 'Felix' out if the air.
The only trans boy I know has chosen that name Sad never thought about it!
DomesticatedZombie · 26/02/2022 21:26

@Bellusaurus

I am genuinely baffled - was that the highlight of the speech? The answers are out there? What's meant to be impressive about that?
X files homage?

Mhairi Black makes a crap Scully.

Abitofalark · 26/02/2022 21:47

Charles Moore's brother! Well it's a small world, is media land.

I haven't heard the debate so all I can go on is what he's stated.
But when he says that she doesn't diminish her opponents, and then quotes her saying she's a woman and she is not scared, that is what I would think is diminishing, indeed trivialising the risks to women and girls, the fears that other women and girls do have and the extreme discomfort that they feel, to the point of schoolgirls and women in workplaces avoiding the loo and indeed both women and men in offices hating these loos.

And then that a gender recognition certificate is irrelevant to single sex spaces. So it's just open access for all? And why if it's irrelevant is it so important to make it easier to get? The certificate was supposed to be the final stage in long complex process that a very few people would undergo. The whole thing was never intended for anyone who felt like it to simply declare a gender identity and thereby acquire a right of access to women's and girls' spaces in schools, hospitals and so on.

Theeyeballsinthesky · 26/02/2022 22:01

If I remember rightly Rowan has a trans child

theDudesmummy · 27/02/2022 07:36

Interesting to hear the info above, I had never heard of this Moore man and wondered wtf the architecture correspondent was commenting on this. Black seems utterly clueless and frankly baffling.

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theDudesmummy · 27/02/2022 07:37

I found the bit about her saying she wasn't scared patronising and even intimidating.

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SolasAnla · 27/02/2022 08:17

Blogblogblogblog I believe she the one who saw no problem with a adult performer uploading pictures of children onto the web to promote his branch out into primarly school visits. He had obtained the "free promotional" pictutes in a private setting without the consent of the children's parent and in breach of what is normal school safeguarding policy.
If someone points out a problem and the choice is to continue to ignore the problem thats a character trait.
An elected official calling members of the voting cunts is also a very good indication of that person's character.

Like Bojos bad hair gig it sets out her stall for all who want to vote or listen to her.

Anyway I expect that MNHQ will zap this thread.

theDudesmummy · 27/02/2022 08:36

I am just so beyond disappointed in the Guardian lately.

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Blogblogblogblog · 27/02/2022 09:53

Hmmm I thought Mhairi did an impressive (maiden?!!) speech a few years back and it was refreshing to see a young female at Westminster. But she can’t/won’t listen to women’s concerns and charges forth with her own agenda and ‘personality’, reminding me Johnson too.

Abhannmor · 27/02/2022 09:59

Perhaps, when she loses her seat , Mhairi can get a column in the Grauniad. Bit of razzamatazz , liven up the craic a bit. ' Cunt of the Week ' feature - and touching human interest stories of course.

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 27/02/2022 10:39

Such leadership to actively continue to disseminate misinformation and disinformation about VSDs…

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4488573-Mhairi-Black-and-gingers

Hasselhoffsheadband · 27/02/2022 10:49

What a load of crap. Black gave totalmy misleading statistics about people with DSDs in a bid to point score, and also compared being able to 'self identify' what nationality you are on a questionnaire, to being able to legally falsify your birth certificate!

miri1985 · 27/02/2022 17:31

Does anyone know is it possible to submit something to channel 4 factcheck or is there anything similar that you can submit something like Mhairi Black's DSD= levels of redheads statistic?

KimThomas · 27/02/2022 19:17

@miri1985

Does anyone know is it possible to submit something to channel 4 factcheck or is there anything similar that you can submit something like Mhairi Black's DSD= levels of redheads statistic?
You could ask Radio 4’s More or Less.
dropthevipers · 27/02/2022 20:10

@theDudesmummy

I am just so beyond disappointed in the Guardian lately.
What do you mean "lately"? Th Graun has been a shit storm of utter toss for years now.