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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Video Series: Diane Ehrensaft and Satanic Panic

23 replies

ScreamingMeMe · 23/02/2022 13:44

For those who don't already know, Diane Ehrensaft is a "gender-affirming" therapist who once famously said that if a baby girl tried to take a barrette out of her hair, she was actually a trans boy.

Further background info here:

4thwavenow.com/2016/09/29/gender-affirmative-therapist-baby-who-hates-barrettes-trans-boy-questioning-sterilization-of-11-year-olds-same-as-denying-cancer-treatment/

4thwavenow.com/tag/diane-ehrensaft/

dianeehrensaft.com/

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ScreamingMeMe · 23/02/2022 13:47

Ehrensaft was also a true believer in Satanic abuse. Now she's all about the "Gender Angels."

Clive Simpson on YouTube has done a series of videos on this, which you might 'enjoy'.

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nauticant · 23/02/2022 14:47

When mentioning Diane Ehrensaft in FWR, it's the law to post a link to her utterly bizarre comments about barrettes:

www.dailymotion.com/video/x7kqndw

As this thread shows, she has, and has had, many many bizarre beliefs.

nauticant · 23/02/2022 14:49

I should have checked first, the relevant video is linked to in the 4thwavenow.com article.

Melroses · 23/02/2022 16:31

Can someone explain (for the weak of stomach) what satanic abuse is about and Gender Angels please Smile

LilithOfEden · 23/02/2022 16:52

Is she also the person who said that male babies undoing the buttons of onesies were trying to make dresses and were thus female (or some such batshit)?

DomesticatedZombie · 23/02/2022 16:58

@LilithOfEden

Is she also the person who said that male babies undoing the buttons of onesies were trying to make dresses and were thus female (or some such batshit)?
That's her.
nauticant · 23/02/2022 17:05

Yes, that's among the many nutty things she's saying and has said. It's in the video I linked to just above. It's one of her "pre-verbal gender messages from 1 to 2 year olds".

In fact, if you ever need a refresher to wonder whether "are we the baddies?" just watching that video is reassuring. Any side having Ehrensaft as a guru has completely lost its way.

FannyCann · 23/02/2022 17:07

It's absolutely terrifying that people with such a limited capacity for common sense should rise up the career ladder to positions of influence and be revered in some quarters.

ScreamingMeMe · 23/02/2022 20:07

@Melroses

Can someone explain (for the weak of stomach) what satanic abuse is about and Gender Angels please Smile
The Satanic panic is a moral panic consisting of over 12,000 unsubstantiated cases of Satanic ritual abuse (SRA, sometimes known as ritual abuse, ritualistic abuse, organized abuse, or sadistic ritual abuse) starting in the United States in the 1980s, spreading throughout many parts of the world by the late 1990s, and persisting today. The panic originated in 1980 with the publication of Michelle Remembers, a book co-written by Canadian psychiatrist Lawrence Pazder and his patient (and future wife), Michelle Smith, which used the discredited practice of recovered-memory therapy to make sweeping lurid claims about satanic ritual abuse involving Smith. The allegations which afterwards arose throughout much of the United States involved reports of physical and sexual abuse of people in the context of occult or Satanic rituals. In its most extreme form, allegations involve a conspiracy of a global Satanic cult that includes the wealthy and powerful world elite in which children are abducted or bred for human sacrifices, pornography, and prostitution.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_panic

"The second is that all of us, as parents and people walking down the street, have what I call gender ghosts and gender angels.

The gender ghosts are all of the messages that we got in the way we live — such as our religious beliefs — that tell us that there's something wrong if a child is either gender nonconforming or transgender, or that makes you feel uncomfortable or weird about it. You can't sweep the gender ghost under the rug, because they're there. So you have to take them out and take a look at them. And if you're parents, you always should be questioning yourselves: "Are any of these beliefs harming my child?"

...
So we want to bring them out to the light of day and put them at war with what I call our gender angels. Those are the parts of us — and I think they're either there or can be harvested and fertilized — which open up our eyes to gender expansiveness, to the notion of gender diversity, to the notion that not following the rules does not mean you're sick or have a disease or that it's pathological, but that it's creative. That's why I call it the gender-creative child in the book. And it's just who these children are.
"

www.vox.com/2016/6/6/11853060/transgender-children-parents

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nauticant · 23/02/2022 21:08

As the Wikipedia link says, the Satanic abuse panic now forms a significant part of the insane QAnon conspiracy theory:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_panic#QAnon

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 23/02/2022 21:19

It was widely accepted in the UK too for a time and resulted in several families having their children removed from them. The Orkney case was particularly notable. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orkney_child_abuse_scandal

Horrifying. The credulity and cruelty here are beyond my understanding.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 23/02/2022 21:24

My impression is that a small number of ambitious people wanted to jump on the bandwagon and get invitations to talk at conferences, lead training, be the subjects of profiles etc etc. I feel we're seeing similar behaviour now.

CaveMum · 23/02/2022 21:27

[quote nauticant]As the Wikipedia link says, the Satanic abuse panic now forms a significant part of the insane QAnon conspiracy theory:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_panic#QAnon[/quote]
Have you listened to the BBC Podcast “The Coming Storm”? It’s about the rise of QAnon and they discuss the Satanic Panic and how it links to today’s “cabal of paedophiles running the world” conspiracy.

nauticant · 23/02/2022 21:30

Oh yes, I most certainly have.

Melroses · 23/02/2022 21:32

Thank you.

I remember watching something about the Orkney case, where some teenage boys were taken from their family and ended up in young offenders institutions on the mainland because there was no suitable foster care Sad.

ScreamingMeMe · 24/02/2022 11:18

Have you listened to the BBC Podcast “The Coming Storm”? It’s about the rise of QAnon and they discuss the Satanic Panic and how it links to today’s “cabal of paedophiles running the world” conspiracy.

I've just started this. Fascinating and scary stuff (real-life scary, not cabal-of-satanic-paedophiles scary.)

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CaveMum · 24/02/2022 11:34

Glad others have listened to the podcast, it is very good.

I'd also recommend reading The Irrational Ape by David Robert Grimes which discusses why people fall for conspiracy theories and how things like "the satanic plague" can spread. I haven't finished it yet (I'm one of those people that always has several books on the go at once!) but I suspect there will be a lot to take away from the book re the science/biology denials of TRAs.

NonHypotheticalLurkingParent · 24/02/2022 12:40

There was a poster a while ago who wrote a lot about the Tavistock and the therapists that worked there in the past. They had a few links to Satanic abuse, etc.

ifIwerenotanandroid · 24/02/2022 15:29

While acknowledging that the Satanic Panic was a phenomenon, it should be pointed out that some children are abused & that some people do repress memories of abuse & then recover them accurately. To deny this would not only be to deny reality but to hurt people who've gone through this.

I'm putting this here for anyone who might feel that this thread is saying that they are mistaken or lying or whatever.

There's a poster who leaps on anything like this, battering everyone else into the ground & insisting that only their version is real, with long posts & links. If that happens, my advice to anyone feeling vulnerable about this issue is to remember that that's 'her stuff' & does not imply anything about your own experience. Just quietly believe in yourself & avoid reading it.

Sending love to you all.

nauticant · 24/02/2022 16:06

Out of interest, how many people in the UK have been convicted for Satanic/ritual abuse against children?

Melroses · 26/02/2022 21:31

I knew someone whose children were taken into care for satanic/ritual abuse but there was never any question of conviction.

ScreamingMeMe · 03/03/2022 20:52

A paper written by Ehrensaft on Satanic Ritual Abuse:

psycnet.apa.org/doiLanding?doi=10.1037%2Fh0079332

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nauticant · 03/03/2022 21:43

A fully accessible version:

ia903409.us.archive.org/17/items/ehrensaft-1992/Ehrensaft-1992.pdf

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