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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

"Why I stopped being a good girl" by Hadley Freeman

86 replies

spacehardware · 21/02/2022 12:22

It's a long read but Hadley deconstructs the issues, and all the "this is like homophobia/racism/you're a right wing schill" nonsense (honestly the TRAs must share Cliffs Notes) brilliantly.

unherd.com/2022/02/why-i-stopped-being-a-good-girl/

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HoliHormonalTigerlilly · 21/02/2022 19:35

Brilliantly articulated Hadley!
👏👏👏

Weefreetiffany · 21/02/2022 19:41

Hadley has always been a fantastic writer and a voice of reason. Can’t tell you how validated and supported I feel reading this. Being a woman is more than a feeling. Your womanhood isn’t a floating thought bubble above you’re head its in every fibre- every cell of your being! Like it or not. Likewise with manhood. When did the word “gender” become inseparable from the word “identity”? Weren’t we all working towards removing gender roles until quite recently, not reinforcing them? Can’t I see someone’s identity without having to also think about their genitals? I literally couldn’t care less. But that is apparently bigotry and hateful. I hope more people are emboldened by this to stop capitulating to the bully mob on Twitter. Hadley you’re welcome for dinner at mine any time.

EdithStourton · 21/02/2022 20:27

Bloody hell, that is an excellent article.

This brought me up short, made me feel actually physically shocked:
Or how about this line from a recently published memoir by Grace Lavery: when describing how hormone treatment has affected her body, she writes that her penis felt “as though I were laying my own miscarried foetus across my hand”.
How can Lavery say that? Believe me, I'm tough enough to do home butchery, and finish off injured wildlife, and that inspired a visceral reaction. Mind you, I've had an actual miscarriage, pints of blood and a lost baby, and the grief and sense of bodily failure that goes with it - what would Lavery know about that?

Like Hadley, I don't want to outlaw offensive writing, but the double standard is utterly, utterly shocking. Under a previous name, I got a deletion on here for using the 'wrong' (that is, the biologically correct) pronoun for someone, but Lavery can write that, and it's just fine?

Bollocks it is.

RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 21/02/2022 20:34

Excellent article

Unfortunately i can’t comment on Grace Laverys penis quote because my reply includes swearing, gesticulating, insults and slurs regarding parentage and intelligence

HildaHedgehog · 21/02/2022 20:34

I was at college with Hadley. I'm so incredibly and irrationally proud of her for writing that article!!

HereticFanjo · 21/02/2022 20:43

It's a brilliant piece of writing.

aliasundercover · 21/02/2022 21:05

Here is everything you need to know about The Guardian:

They would rather have Owen jones than Hadley Freeman

SwissBall · 21/02/2022 21:26

That was a really good overview of the situation.

Marie Le Conte likes to label us as obsessed but she has her own obsession going on trying to silence and scold women on this topic. I find her so tedious.

ChakaFridaMendips · 21/02/2022 22:32

It’s the rebelling against the old guard and the old fogeys - except even my parents were cool and quite non conforming.

To be fair it must be irritating that even your grandparents were cooler than you. All the good rebelling has been done.

BraveBananaBadge · 21/02/2022 23:15

Martha Lane Fox on Twitter calling it 'excellent writing' and also praising the Atwood interview.

McDuffy · 22/02/2022 06:53

Hadley is in the Times today.

Guardian columnist Hadley Freeman says left-wing media bows down to trans bullies

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/26028b74-9333-11ec-9aec-82f0032d4cd3?shareToken=fe93b70b3898666d14a00ff041f21be7

EdithStourton · 22/02/2022 07:48

[quote McDuffy]Hadley is in the Times today.

Guardian columnist Hadley Freeman says left-wing media bows down to trans bullies

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/26028b74-9333-11ec-9aec-82f0032d4cd3?shareToken=fe93b70b3898666d14a00ff041f21be7[/quote]
She's not wrong, is she?

I feel so let down by the Left and the centre. Betrayed, deceived, and completely shafted.

I'm not sure how I'm ever going to bring myself to vote for any of them again.

EdithStourton · 22/02/2022 07:51

Oh, and to add to the irony, our local LibDems have a blog post up about how 'we must unite as our rights are under attack!!'

This is the (well, okay, a,) party that doesn't give a shit about natal women and their rights, and is quite happy to lose members who complain about this policy stance.

spacehardware · 22/02/2022 07:51

I didn't vote at the last general election and unless labour sorts itself out, I won't vote at the next one either

I don't believe Keir starmer, a bloody QC, actually believes it is "not correct" to say only women have a cervix. It's possible David Lammy is stupid enough to think trans women grow a cervix, jury's still out.

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savehannah · 22/02/2022 07:55

Such a great article

GoIntoTheLight · 22/02/2022 08:23

Bloody well done, Hadley. I do hope you lurk here so you can see the support.

I have supported the Guardian for a long time but have stopped my subscription over this shit. Can I just pay you directly instead please Hadley?

WarriorN · 22/02/2022 08:37

She's on fire at the moment!

WarriorN · 22/02/2022 08:39

[quote McDuffy]Hadley is in the Times today.

Guardian columnist Hadley Freeman says left-wing media bows down to trans bullies

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/26028b74-9333-11ec-9aec-82f0032d4cd3?shareToken=fe93b70b3898666d14a00ff041f21be7[/quote]
She's said this misrepresents her.

twitter.com/hadleyfreeman/status/1495827707632001030?s=21

"Why I stopped being a good girl" by Hadley Freeman
NecessaryScene · 22/02/2022 08:44

I don't believe Keir starmer, a bloody QC, actually believes it is "not correct" to say only women have a cervix.

I dug up to check the precise transcript, cos I've seen this phrased various ways:

Marr: Is it transphobic to say that only women have a cervix?

Starmer: It is something that shouldn't be said. It is not right... But Andrew, I don't think that...

Marr: So Rosie Duffield should not have said that. Can you explain to people watching why she should not have said that?

Starmer: Well, Andrew, I don't think that we can just go through various things that people have said.

He didn't quite finish the thought - he kind of tried to change tack after "not right" - maybe realising what he was saying - so it's not clear whether he was going on to say it's "not correct", or he was suggesting it's morally wrong to say it (because it upsets people?)

Schmoozer · 22/02/2022 08:47

Very good
Article - love it 👍

Floisme · 22/02/2022 09:11

I'm glad she's called out the Times, I was uncomfortable about the way they used their headline to suggest her article was specifically about the Guardian (without actually saying so of course). I read her piece as being about the cowardice and laziness of the left, of public institutions and above all, of her own profession. That's much bigger than her own struggles at The Guardian (with which I really sympathise) or any circulation war with the Times.

spacehardware · 22/02/2022 09:12

"so it's not clear whether he was going on to say it's "not correct", or he was suggesting it's morally wrong to say it (because it upsets people?)"

Either way, it doesn't inspire confidence. It suggests cowardice

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spacehardware · 22/02/2022 09:12

Blair was spot on last week about all this.

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loislovesstewie · 22/02/2022 09:33

Well done that woman! Off topic slightly but am I the only person cross at that hair dye ad? The one where Stacey twirls with the girls? One of the 'girls' she is having coffee with (or something) is either a cross dresser or drag queen! I mean can ANYONE now be female??
Are we going to call everyone a woman now by stealth? Because it's just not on!

Childrenofthestones · 22/02/2022 09:42

@Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g

Oh good, I was going to post a link to that, but you got there first. Very pleased indeed to see this from Hadley Freeman. I don't know how she can bear to be at The Guardian surrounded by people who pay lip service to gender ideology but don't really believe it. The Guardian used to pride itself on its journalistic standards and independence. What happened?
"I don't know how she can bear to be at The Guardian surrounded by people who pay lip service to gender ideology but don't really believe it. "

A mortgage probably. I wonder if she was one of the signatures denouncing Suzanne Moore?
BTW, Moore has a great piece today on pg 21 of the Telegraph slamming the New York Times advert " Lianna is imagining Harry Potter without its creator "