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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

So white actors must not play POC, straight actors must not play gay people, able bodied actors may not play disabled people.....

44 replies

HoliHormonalTigerlilly · 10/02/2022 15:28

But men. Men can play women. That's FINE apparently!

https://www.screendaily.com/news/eddie-izzard-to-play-lead-role-in-female-reimagining-of-doctor-jekyll/5167332.article

OP posts:
sairiegamp · 10/02/2022 22:06

Knob. Yep. Utter bollocks and I'm sick to fucking death of powerful white men in general atm

pinkgingham · 11/02/2022 06:34

It just doesn't make sense to me why this is ok, yet if a white actor is cast to play a POC there is uproar.

I genuinely don't see the difference, I don't know what I'm missing 🤷‍♀️

libertine80 · 11/02/2022 07:35

Also see Laverne Cox playing personal trainer Kacy Duke in Inventing Anna on Netflix. Kacy herself has said it is a delighted with the casting apparently: BBC News - Inventing Anna: The Netflix show versus reality
www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-60325070

MrsJamin · 11/02/2022 08:23

We are all being gaslit. Every day I think we must have reached the summit but no, it goes further. Up is down. Left is right. In is out.

KittenKong · 11/02/2022 08:57

It’s just mad. I love martial arts films - so only a ninja assassin can play a ninja assassin?

Only a wronged cop, champion martial artist (with a dark past), framed for a crime he didn’t commit, banged up in the toughest jail in Korea and have to take on the prison gangs to discover the truth be able to play the part of a wronged cop… (hey I’d watch that).

LilithOfEden · 11/02/2022 09:03

Shonda Rhimes is the show runner for Anna. A woman of colour who knows how difficult it is for women of colour to get roles. But then she's also been on the board of Planned Parenthood since 2017, and we all know in what direction that organisation has gone.

ginghamstarfish · 11/02/2022 09:10

But OP, surely you know all this woke stuff is a one way street... gay people will still be able to play straight roles, as we see in many current films/TV stuff, but not the other way round. Same for every other category you mentioned. As with 'cultural appropriation', another thing that only works one way round. We plebs are not supposed to question any of this.

Hasselhoffsheadband · 11/02/2022 09:15

So is Eddie Izzards Dr Jekyll a transwoman, or are we expected to believe that they are actually a female?

RedToothBrush · 11/02/2022 09:21

I feel sorry for people who have a dwarfism condition who are now no longer able to play dwarves or rolls which require people of unusually short stature because dwarves got cancelled for being politically incorrect.

Thats the nonsense we are at.

People with disabilities cancelled by able bodied executives trying to show how enlightened they are because its offense to those with dwarfism, without actually consulting those with a vested interest as to how this might impact them directly.

Its the too down decision making which is enforced thats as blinkered as actual prejudice.

LilithOfEden · 11/02/2022 09:31

Also, what's the real Kacy Duce going to say about Laverne Cox playing her? If she is anything other than supportive, she'll be cancelled - she's a Hollywood PT, her career will be toast.

SockFluffInTheBath · 11/02/2022 10:00

Could have been fantastic as a concept, but looks like another white middle-aged man having the cake and eating the whole damned thing Sad

libertine80 · 11/02/2022 16:04

@LilithOfEden

Also, what's the real Kacy Duce going to say about Laverne Cox playing her? If she is anything other than supportive, she'll be cancelled - she's a Hollywood PT, her career will be toast.
I did think that - she couldn't have a different reaction.
MangyInseam · 11/02/2022 23:08

I don't care if a male actor plays a female role. Just so long as I can watch it and believe him to be female.

I have some doubts that will be the case here with Izzard.

AtrociousCircumstance · 12/02/2022 00:11

I don’t care if a male actor plays a female role as long as he acknowledges that he is a man play acting as a woman. Not the thought control unthink of ‘No he really IS a woman or you’re a bigot”. Ugh.

KittenKong · 12/02/2022 10:43

I seem to remember a time when all female Shakespeare productions were not all that uncommon. It was what it was - all female cast. No one trying to be all ‘genda’ more of an exploration of sex and roles.

BigHuff · 12/02/2022 13:59

@IvyTwines

And it has already been done, and done very well indeed: Dr Jekyll and Sister Hyde, with Ralph Bates and Martine Beswick.
See also Julia Jekyll and Harriet Hyde.
PurgatoryOfPotholes · 12/02/2022 14:09

I'm absolutely delighted a film is being cast with a 60 year old woman in the lead role. Older women have been under-represented for a long time and the average age of lead female actors in Hollywood is now something like 32.

This is wonderful progress for women. Oh wait...

No it isn't!

Casheeeew · 12/02/2022 14:33

Yeah, "women actresses" to busy playing Sean Penns girlfriend (under 30s) or Sean Penns mum (over 40s) or even Sean Penns best friends girlfriend (30-39).

NitroNine · 12/02/2022 15:37

Cripping-up and blackface/yellowface (& all associated variations) are just grim. The director of “Wonder” did try to cast a child with facial differences, but after struggling to do so ended up casting Jacob Tremblay, using prosthetics - & then talking up the need to cast more disabled people Hmm There was a lot published about why it mattered, but I think Ariel Henley’s article for Teen Vogue is particularly clear. (Incidentally, her autobiography A Face For Picasso was published last year.) Last year Sia apologised for her handling of autism in her film “Music”, including the casting of the chief protagonist. There are disabilities that would preclude [some] individuals with them from acting - but with those where there is a spectrum or degrees of severity, having people with the disability draw on their lived experience is preferable to an abled person fully cripping-up to play the role. Things are getting better in contemporary productions when it comes to casting non-white people in roles that don’t specify an ethnicity. Casting disabled people in roles that don’t specify disability, however, is still slightly rarer than finding hens’ teeth by the light of a blue moon.

Both cripping-up & blacking-up are, effectively, a form of punching down. Punching down via artistic expression; not necessarily with malicious intent (the Final Bow For Yellowface project gives a perfect example of yellowface that’s not intended to be cruel); & in the case of cripping-up part of a much bigger picture of using disabled people as props, toxic positivity, tokenism & inspiration porn.

This particular casting is punching down at women - as a PP noted, there is already a marked disparity between [types of] roles available to men & women of Izzard’s age (or simply aged 40+). This is not a bold new departure, even asking the audience to pander to Izzard is simply more of the same egotistical nonsense we see from male actors/producers/directors of a certain age. Film & TV usually expect us to believe that gorgeous [successful] 20-something women are desperately in love with middle-aged men. Now our suspension of disbelief is expected to stretch instead to indulge actors’ personal beliefs about “gender identity” & thus which sex roles they should play - are entitled to play, entitled being absolutely the operative word.

“We could tell you a fascinating, compelling & powerful story with any number of fantastic actresses in the eponymous role… instead we opted to indulge a man’s ego.”

Oh, to have the confidence of a mediocre white man* - may we all be granted it (& ideally paid accordingly, too)

  • I used to think Izzard was a very talented comedian & admired the way he learned French to a sufficient standard to do gigs in the language. Now, though, his behaviour is so off-putting I can’t enjoy his work at all. So not, in fairness, mediocre - but he doesn’t seem to have any comprehension of his male privilege at all; let alone the fact it doesn’t suddenly evaporate when he decides he’s “in girl mode”.

(NB: Use of male pronouns & referring to Izzard as male is because Izzard uses both male & female pronouns & has explicitly & repeatedly stated he’s happy for both/either to be used in reference to/discussion of him.)

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