Forms, asking for "gender" not "sex" what can I say?

[MrMrsJones]

I quite often come across forms, sign ups which will ask..

What is your gender, not sex

I did query one which replied "that's what people want no a days"

So how do I reply to that?

Do we just shut up and put up?

Form is online

If you had the time you could complain. It can be tedious to keep pointing out the failures of not keeping accurate data according to the equality act, and the consequences or the message it sends, but it's also surprising how sometimes a company or organisation will reverse it when someone takes the time to point it out.

Why is Neighbourhood Watch interested in your religious beliefs and why are they imposing an ideology onto those it is gathering data on?

www.ourwatch.org.uk/how-we-work/nationally/governance-strategy/policies/data-protection-policy

I would ask why they are assigning gender identities, it's a very definitive list and doesn't list demigirl or maverick...or did they mean sex?

@OhHolyJesus

Why is Neighbourhood Watch interested in your religious beliefs and why are they imposing an ideology onto those it is gathering data on?

www.ourwatch.org.uk/how-we-work/nationally/governance-strategy/policies/data-protection-policy

I would ask why they are assigning gender identities, it's a very definitive list and doesn't list demigirl or maverick...or did they mean sex?

Yea but how 🤔

How do I put it in words

Something like this?

"I had wanted to complete your online for form X but was confused by some of the wording.

The form appears to confuse biological sex (a protected characteristic) and 'gender identity' an ideological concept that is widely understood to be promoted by controversial lobby groups.

I am also unclear as to why my sexual orientation would need to be requested and recorded and what relevance my religious beliefs would be.

Why would this data be collected for the purpose of the X form? I wanted to participate in X but feel unable to do so. Please can you email in by way of reply so I can better understand the reasoning behind the questions on this form.

I felt that the form was assigning a 'gender identity' to me when I don't have one, I am female and this is my biological sex and has no relevance or connection to an ideological movement I don't ascribe to.

Please can someone contact me to help me understand the purpose of these questions and to perhaps pursue a way I can be involved without completing this form, if the form cannot be changed.

Signed..."

This letter doesn't need to be written in any particular way, so just put it into your own words, say why it bothers you and how it prevents you from taking part in whatever it is they have the form for.

If they reply you can follow up with the links and info on the protected characteristics and all the evidence to show why they should be accurately gathering relevant data and why they could be in trouble for breaching their own rules. That could be a follow up email and you'll get into your stride by then!

Blueberry, are you ever embarrassed by yourself?

I’ve come across a few forms like this recently, I think they’re all very confused tbh!

One asked if my gender corresponded to the one I was assigned at birth, and since I don’t believe I was assigned a gender I clicked - prefer not to answer. No mention of sex.

One asked for my sex and one of the options was ‘woman - including trans woman’ but that really should’ve been asking for gender, so again I clicked a ‘none of the above’ option.

I do worry though that they’ll see these responses not that I’m biologically female, but that I define myself in some other way, but I have no way of telling them that.

I do worry though that they’ll see these responses not that I’m biologically female, but that I define myself in some other way, but I have no way of telling them that.

Then they didn't test the forms. Or, they did test the forms but didn't want to deal with this issue so decided that the ignoring it was worth the price of inaccurate information.

I tick 'other' - but only if it brings up a box in which I can type 'my sex is female; I do not identify with any gender'.

@BlueberryCheezecake

Gender is a perfectly acceptable synonym for sex in these contexts and has been used as such for centuries. Just tick the box that applies to you.

Show us you know nothing, without telling us you know nothing.

It has not been used as such for centuries. Before 1955 it was only ever used to refer to grammar. Then John Money coined the term "gender role". It became common in the seventies where scholars wanted to distinguish between biological differences and societal differences.

Use as a synonym for "sex" is even more recent than that.

@OhHolyJesus

Something like this?

"I had wanted to complete your online for form X but was confused by some of the wording.

The form appears to confuse biological sex (a protected characteristic) and 'gender identity' an ideological concept that is widely understood to be promoted by controversial lobby groups.

I am also unclear as to why my sexual orientation would need to be requested and recorded and what relevance my religious beliefs would be.

Why would this data be collected for the purpose of the X form? I wanted to participate in X but feel unable to do so. Please can you email in by way of reply so I can better understand the reasoning behind the questions on this form.

I felt that the form was assigning a 'gender identity' to me when I don't have one, I am female and this is my biological sex and has no relevance or connection to an ideological movement I don't ascribe to.

Please can someone contact me to help me understand the purpose of these questions and to perhaps pursue a way I can be involved without completing this form, if the form cannot be changed.

Signed..."

This letter doesn't need to be written in any particular way, so just put it into your own words, say why it bothers you and how it prevents you from taking part in whatever it is they have the form for.

If they reply you can follow up with the links and info on the protected characteristics and all the evidence to show why they should be accurately gathering relevant data and why they could be in trouble for breaching their own rules. That could be a follow up email and you'll get into your stride by then!

Fabulous 😘 thank you

@SignOnTheWindow

I tick 'other' - but only if it brings up a box in which I can type 'my sex is female; I do not identify with any gender'.

This is what I do. Or email them. I have just emailed swimathon becasue they ask for age so that they can categorise results, which is fair enough, but they they ask for gender. I said...

"I was going to enter the Swimathon until I got to the question on the form asking for gender. I thought you might mean 'Sex' but as you include 'non-binary' as an option you clearly don't.

You say you want to categorise results by gender, but how can this have any meaning or relevance if it is self identified? Are you going to compare male-bodied non-binary people with female bodied non-binary people? Or even male-bodied people who identify as female with actual women? What would that show? Sex, is a biological fact which has direct relevance in a sport such as swimming. Gender is an ideology and you may as well have categories based on star signs or religion.

I am sure you will say that you are being inclusive, but as an actual woman I do not want to be part of something that has bought into an agressive, exclusionary ideology."

Tick it. It’s far better than having a form that says gender and not only doesn’t give all the options but then you find out is about biological sex. Or cross out gender and pot sex. One of my students added “non-binary” to their straight up two gender option on a test paper and I told them quite right too and was proud.

Oh and btw fwiw - I’m actually in agreement with the poster above re swimming: I think in that case they should ask for sex. I’m talking about when it isn’t really relevant.

@serendipitea

I usually click other if it has a free-text box and write My SEX is Female.

I can see your thinking behind this, but you realise you're actually just adding to the statistics of those counted as identifying as other/ non binary etc., and therefore reinforcing the need to keep putting this option on forms, right?

You are possibly kicking yourself in the foot there.

I had to sign a form for DD for school the other day for her second Covid jab. It was a paper form so I crossed out gender and put sex.

This was not a school form but one issued by the NHS. I find the fact that the NHS are doing this quite concerning.

@Beamur

I usually go with 'prefer not to say' as it's none of their business.

Me too.