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Original poster

BBC rewriting history again

23 replies

NeinDanke · 09/12/2021 17:28

Was sorry to hear about the death of Steve Bronski but this has annoyed me.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-59592187

The group began when Bronski and Steinbachek met Somerville through a documentary called Framed Youth - Revenge of the Teenage Perverts, which was made for an LGBTQ arts festival.

An LGBTQ arts festival? In 1983?? What, were they time-travellers or something?!

I'm guessing the event referred to was actually a lesbian and gay arts festival?

Not gay and probably have too much time on my hands but this has made me irrationally annoyed!

OP posts:
PaleGreenGhost · 09/12/2021 17:59

www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-59559834

Interestingly BBC recognises that using BAME as a catch all term isn't necessarily useful or accurate. I hope they will soon listen to the people who don't think the term LGBTQ is useful or accurate in describing lesbian and gay people.

Honkingallthewaytothebank · 09/12/2021 18:15

@NeinDanke I noticed that too and thought it was pretty sloppy reporting. That term simply wasn't being used at that time. It would have been LGB, surely.

PermanentTemporary · 09/12/2021 18:20

@PaleGreenGhost I noted that about BAME as well. These collective acronyms mainly serve members of in-groups, bureaucrats and companies who want feel-good announcements without any specifics or hard change attached.

Original poster
NeinDanke · 09/12/2021 19:32

Yes good point about BAME, I didn't even join the dots there!

Honking
Exactly and wasn't the Q word still widely used as a slur at that time?! Kind of the sort of attitudes that Smalltown boy was protesting against!

OP posts:
SuperLoudPoppingAction · 09/12/2021 19:46

I also get annoyed that the Glasgow women's library was given a lesbian archive and they call it an lgbt archive or somesuch.

NecessaryScene · 09/12/2021 20:55

I think LGBTQ is itself a form of "thought-terminating cliché" (something we normally say about "trans women are women").

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 09/12/2021 21:00

Completely agree op, I think terminology is important. This is misleading.

SolasAnla · 09/12/2021 21:00

@NeinDanke

Was sorry to hear about the death of Steve Bronski but this has annoyed me.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-59592187

The group began when Bronski and Steinbachek met Somerville through a documentary called Framed Youth - Revenge of the Teenage Perverts, which was made for an LGBTQ arts festival.

An LGBTQ arts festival? In 1983?? What, were they time-travellers or something?!

I'm guessing the event referred to was actually a lesbian and gay arts festival?

Not gay and probably have too much time on my hands but this has made me irrationally annoyed!

Have you googled LGB lately?

🚂

Original poster
NeinDanke · 09/12/2021 21:18

That's bizarre! I hope the model railway people aren't getting abuse for being a transphobic hate group Grin

Yes Glasgow Women's Library evidently fell a long time ago.

LGBT is annoying but there's something about that Q in the article that sent me over the edge. Like, LGBT is the most commonly-used phrase and would have been acceptable to most so why did they feel the need to add the Q?

Feels like someone was trying to make a point...

OP posts:
nauticant · 09/12/2021 21:25

If you want to see a pernicious usage of LGBT have a read of the Conversion Therapy briefing presented to Parliament. It's like watching a Trojan Horse being wheeled through the city gate.

Bosky · 10/12/2021 06:40

@nauticant

If you want to see a pernicious usage of LGBT have a read of the Conversion Therapy briefing presented to Parliament. It's like watching a Trojan Horse being wheeled through the city gate.
Is it this?

Research Briefing
Debate on an E- petition relating to LGBT conversion therapy
Published Thursday, 04 March, 2021

commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cdp-2021-0030/

nauticant · 10/12/2021 14:46

I was simply thinking of this:

www.gov.uk/government/consultations/banning-conversion-therapy/banning-conversion-therapy

and it having stuff like "it does not change a person from being LGBT", "in an attempt to cure them of being LGBT", "attempt to change a person’s LGBT identity " running all the way through.

ScrollingLeaves · 10/12/2021 17:20

It is extremely annoying that LGBTQ+ is misleadingly used as though it is a word with a definition.

Basically it is a T and Q brand name used and promoted for piggy backing on the general public acceptance of LGB.

FlyingOink · 10/12/2021 17:38

LGB: be yourself, be proud
T: be someone else and demand others play along
Q: spicy straights

LobsterNapkin · 10/12/2021 17:56

I wonder if this wasn't out of ignorance.

These kinds of anachronisms seem to come up all the time in the media these days. People and ideas are depicted in ways that are completely ahistorical and inappropriate, but it seems to stem from the writers not realizing that people used to think of things differently. Which is to say, they tend to believe many people thought the Wrong Things, but not realize they had different ways of conceptualizing reality.

Cleebope2 · 10/12/2021 18:08

I don’t recall the LGB abbreviation even existing in the 80s. When did it become common usage?

FlyingOink · 10/12/2021 19:24

I tried to research this and it was hard going. Roughly speaking late 80s through 90s. T added much more recently than we think, but depends on country. Q very recent, and the other variations, forget it, they only last a week.

The event in question was probably described as Gay or Lesbian and Gay at the time.

KittenKong · 10/12/2021 20:11

Blimey - did we even have the B back then? I knew lesbians and gay men... but I can’t remember meeting Bi people in gay clubs.

ScrollingLeaves · 10/12/2021 21:32

From what Bosky posted here

commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cdp-2021-0030/

“Despite all major counselling and psychotherapy bodies in the UK, including the NHS, condemning LGBT conversion therapy, it is still legal and LGBT individuals in the UK are still exposed to this psychological and emotional abuse to this day. The very thought of this sickens me, and I would like to see it stopped one day.“

There cannot really be such a thing as an “LGBT” individual, surely?

Who would have written that?

BlackForestCake · 10/12/2021 22:22

@KittenKong

Blimey - did we even have the B back then? I knew lesbians and gay men... but I can’t remember meeting Bi people in gay clubs.
I seem to remember around that time the big fuss among the right-on was about how you were supposed to say “lesbians and gay men” instead of “gays and lesbians”.
ScribblingPixie · 10/12/2021 23:27

From other new outlets:
Steinbachek had heard Somerville sing while filming Supervised young people: the revenge of perverted adolescents, a documentary produced by the London Lesbian and Gay Youth Video Project, and suggested that they make music together.

ScribblingPixie · 10/12/2021 23:27

news outlets

Bosky · 11/12/2021 00:06

@KittenKong

Blimey - did we even have the B back then? I knew lesbians and gay men... but I can’t remember meeting Bi people in gay clubs.
Claiming to be bisexual became very fashionable overnight after David Bowie said he was gay in 1972 in an interview for Melody Maker - then suddenly remembered he was married so decided he must be Bi Grin

www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-21897627

That prompted a spate of late teen hetero boys I knew from school taking to ostentatiously snogging each other in public to be in with the in crowd but they seemed to get bored with it quite quickly, perhaps because it didn't have the shock value they were hoping for.

All they got for their trouble were laconic comments along the lines of, "Been listening to Bowie again?" Grin

The things kids will do to emulate their Heroes, just for one day . . .

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